End game for closed businesses

[Nutria]

I just had our handyman guy at the house (I know, I know -- social distancing fail) to fix a pair of faucets that we discovered were leaking & damaging the cabinetry below. As he was leaving, that's effectively what he was telling me as well.

Nothing about having a handyman at your house requires that the 6-foot rule be violated. And as soon as he left, you could have sanitized whatever he touched then washed your hands.

[TexasHusker]

Nothing about having a handyman at your house requires that the 6-foot rule be violated. And as soon as he left, you could have sanitized whatever he touched then washed your hands.

Kork had to hold the flashlight.

[Nutria]

Kork had to hold the flashlight.

Kork should have worn a bandanna over his nose/mouth (like a Western bandit) -- that would have prevented any droplets expelled by the handyman from entering his nose and mouth -- and gloves.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Depends on where you live. I get that alaska and parts of texas are not in dire need. But there are places that it's pretty overrun with cases and the medical personnel are overwhelmed. So the social distancing is to flatten the curve for places where it's overrun because that's where the deaths will come from at first. Then it will occur in rural areas from people fleeing the urban areas and spreading the disease. And rural areas won't have any distancing or medical care likely and that's when they'll get it. But boy is florida going to be in trouble. All those retirees it will be crazy.

[TexasHusker]

Kork should have worn a bandanna over his nose/mouth (like a Western bandit) -- that would have prevented any droplets expelled by the handyman from entering his nose and mouth -- and gloves.

That’s not what WHO was telling us a month ago. They poo poo’d off the whole mask deal.

[Nutria]

That’s not what WHO was telling us a month ago. They poo poo’d off the whole mask deal.

1. Experts can be very absolutist ("masks don't help recuse the virus is smaller than the mask pores"), as opposed to giving "better than nothing" advice.
2. "Officials" have to worry about hoarding and a perception that a mask and one pair of gloves that you wear all day makes you invulnerable.

But it doesn't take an MD to figure out that if the transmission method is people coughing and sneezing stuff out, then it's pretty obvious that preventing those droplets (because that's what you cough and sneeze out) from getting in your mouth and nose is of prime importance.

[creditcardfree]

That always seems to be the problem with many government decisions. No end game. Same goes for our military in the Middle East. Dr. Fauci wrote in NEJM that this is likely to be equal to a severe seasonal influenza season. Remember we do not shut down our economy for the seasonal flu. His article is here .

My prayer is that citizens, governments and medical systems start looking a health prevention to reduce the number affected by a virus. A virus cannot get into a cell and replicate if it is well protected nutritionally, this why Vitamins C, D, A are critical and shown in the medical literature to be protective to all health and explains why some do not get ill even when exposed. If a virus does get into a nutritionally sound person, the symptoms are mild and the illness is self limiting. The effect of any virus on the immune system of someone that is not nutritionally sound or that has other chronic illnesses that reduce the immune system, is always going to be much more severe, including a cytokine storm. Adding in toxic drugs and treatments can also cause the overreaction of the immune system (cytokine storm). There are functional medical doctors in this country that know exactly how to treat this illness with low cost treatments, which have low risk, and create recovery very fast (keeping most out of hospitals). Fast treatments can open up beds faster!

[LivingAlmostLarge]

4 In another article in the Journal, Guan et al.5 report mortality of 1.4% among 1099 patients with laboratory-confirmed Covid-19; these patients had a wide spectrum of disease severity. If one assumes that the number of asymptomatic or minimally symptomatic cases is several times as high as the number of reported cases, the case fatality rate may be considerably less than 1%. This suggests that the overall clinical consequences of Covid-19 may ultimately be more akin to those of a severe seasonal influenza (which has a case fatality rate of approximately 0.1%) or a pandemic influenza (similar to those in 1957 and 1968) rather than a disease similar to SARS or MERS, which have had case fatality rates of 9 to 10% and 36%, respectively.

He did not say it is the seasonal flu. He said specifically that if one assumes not prove to be several times as high as the number of reported rate, then the fatality rate may be considerably less than 1%. Might be, not is. Again he's hedging because we haven't seen the data. Also he hasn't discuss the impact on the hospital staff and care and beds in the situation of an overwhelming number of people need it. Nor was he comorbidity factors in the US acknowledge which is a lot more than other countries who have flattened the curve. So I don't think we can make statements until later about the severity, impact,or transmission of disease. We'll have to see. And in the article it also posted about age being a huge factor in other countries. And other countries have not seen deaths like we have in younger cohorts. We have, suggesting that a lot of diseases prevalent in our society could be due to other factors.

Also the 7% death rate in Italy isn't from the virus it's from the impact on hospitals and care. Which we haven't seen yet in the US and I'm not sure how that will play out. Better or worse. I don't know. No one does. We don't know if we will max out hospital beds or if we are fine.

[disneysteve]

Also the 7% death rate in Italy isn't from the virus it's from the impact on hospitals and care. Which we haven't seen yet in the US

We're starting to. There have been deaths from people waiting for a ventilator to be available for them.

The situation in NYC is beyond critical. The navy hospital ship brought in with great fanfare from the president has been all but worthless so far because they are refusing to take COVID patients aboard. Last I heard, they had 20 patients despite a capacity for 1,000. They are providing virtually no relief for the overwhelmed area hospitals that have had to convert conference rooms, the library, and any other available space into patient care areas.

Anybody who is still suggesting that this is no different than the flu has got to be smoking crack.

[bjl584]

I just keep thinking, at what point is locking down the world hurting us more than helping us?

There is a point when shutting down the world to "save" lives will actually end up costing more lives.
Maybe some think tank at the Pentagon is already hard at work at this.
But, if you throw the world into world-wide depression and cause hunger, starvation, social unrest, destruction, war, and murder, then all of that will cost WAY more lives than a virus could ever hope to.

[~bs]

we already knew this. plenty of businesses have shut their doors, most never to reopen. it's the path of least resistance

[ua_guy]

So you think Fauci is actually going to stand up to the podium one fine day and say “all clear”?

Dig me up.

No, because there is no federal mandate to stay at home. It's currently a suggestion; voluntary compliance appreciated. This is being managed by the states, and most of those orders are voluntary as well. Dr Fauci is an adviser to whomever is in charge of the response, and even that's questionable who's actually leading things these days.

[bjl584]

No, because there is no federal mandate to stay at home. It's currently a suggestion; voluntary compliance appreciated. This is being managed by the states, and most of those orders are voluntary as well. Dr Fauci is an adviser to whomever is in charge of the response, and even that's questionable who's actually leading things these days.

Power is in the hands of the states. Such is the way with our representative republic.
This is one of those cases where having a communist regime like China was more effective at something like snuffing out a viral outbreak.

[Scallywag]

Staples is open and last I checked, office supplies aren't "essential"?

[Scallywag]

There is a point when shutting down the world to "save" lives will actually end up costing more lives.
Maybe some think tank at the Pentagon is already hard at work at this.
But, if you throw the world into world-wide depression and cause hunger, starvation, social unrest, destruction, war, and murder, then all of that will cost WAY more lives than a virus could ever hope to.

But staying open, knowing how virulent & contagious this bug is, is unethical? Who decides what is more important - our money or our life?