Should struggling families tithe?

[disneysteve]

Since a new poster dredged up a 6-year-old thread, I'm going to go ahead and lock it.

[TexasHusker]

If you are going to follow the Old Testament tithing to the letter of the law, it is actually 23.3 percent of crops. So get out there and start raising some.

The tithe was instituted by God's chosen people, the Israelites, as a means of taxation. You gave 10 percent each year to support the clergy, 10 percent each year to support the widows and the orphans, and 10 percent every third year to help pay for special festival and holiday celebrations.

That's 23.3%.

If folks are desiring to tithe, I think that is great. I would simply advise them to study the origin, purpose, and amount of the tithe.

[abbottt579]

My pastor is broke like the rest of us.

My pastor is lucky to make more than $10,000 a year as a full-time pastor working around the clock all week. We have a pretty modest area we rent from the local community center. Lots of people attend in tight just plenty and it actually makes a difference in the community by funding several Outreach programs and mission trips. My church is always ready to help the poor and the needy. And on a separate note I've also attended what you would call a super Church. Even though their infrastructure is huge they service easily 1 thousand or more people at any given service date. And this church actually passes around a collection plate and tells anyone who is really struggling and in need to go ahead and grab some cash out of it if they need it. First time I've ever heard anyone say that. My Philosophy is to tithe what you can But be sure to actually tithe in your day-to-day life with small donations or acts of charity to anyone you run into that needs it.

[disneysteve]

Says who? Some loan officer?

$1,400 a month mortgage payment out of an income of $5,000 is very reasonable.

Actually, for someone making $5,000 a month, I would expect their mortgage payment to be much higher than $1,400 a month.

I agree with you that $1,400 is reasonable on $5,000 income - that is 28% which is exactly what the mortgage lending limit has been for years (until the recent lending fiasco).

I certainly disagree that it would be okay to be "much higher" than that.

[scfr]

You might as well ask a question like "Should families that are struggling financially keep their pets?" or "Should couples that are struggling financially get pregnant?" This is one of those questions on which there will never be consensus.

[GaryArnold]

They are tithing in my book. Anything you do and not get paid for is tithing because you do it so God can spend time watching over his other children. Believe it or not, God is a lot busier than we are willing to admit. If we mortal stop abusing his time and love by stop saying "God Bless You" everying someone sneeze or cough, maybe 9/11 wouldn't happen and tsunami would be nothing more than a surfer's wet dream.

You need to look up the word tithe in the dictionary.

A tithe is a TENTH PART, or a TENTH.

You are confusing tithing with giving.

[GaryArnold]

If your income is 60k and your mortgage is $1400/month, then you are living very irresponsibility. Your mortgage should be no more than $800, including insurance, tax, and all fee associate with owning such mortgage.

Says who? Some loan officer?

$1,400 a month mortgage payment out of an income of $5,000 is very reasonable. It still leaves $3,600 left to live on, and still leave enough to be a generous giver.

When you use a percentage given by so-called financial experts you are using flawed reasoning. Since a home can be an investment, and since the interest and taxes are deductible from your income if you itemize you deductions on your tax return (in the US, anyway), that $1,400 payment in reality can be much less. Actually, for someone making $5,000 a month, I would expect their mortgage payment to be much higher than $1,400 a month.

My qualifications: Retired Accountant and Tax Auditor. Currently a Money & Finance Minister

[jpg7n16]

jpg7n16,

Be honest, what do you do for living?

Just to be clear, I work for an accounting firm in Dallas. We do not do accounting for churches, but for various types of mutual funds.

I am not employed by any church, nor do I serve on volunteer boards for the running of any church, nor do I financially benefit by receiving tithes in any form. I receive many benefits from my church, but money isn't one of them.

Any views I posted are my personal beliefs and are not influenced by some alterior financial motive.


I also think I enjoy SA better when I'm not arguing about my personal views, so I probably won't reply any more to this thread. There's not much more that can be said.

[nick__45]

Is giving your adult children money for food, tithing?
Is renovating an adult childs or in-laws house for free, tithing?
Is stopping to help fix a flat for a women on the highway, tithing?
Is seeing to any need of another individual(you are not responsible for), tithing?

IMO, people tithe/give without even thinking about.

They are tithing in my book. Anything you do and not get paid for is tithing because you do it so God can spend time watching over his other children. Believe it or not, God is a lot busier than we are willing to admit. If we mortal stop abusing his time and love by stop saying "God Bless You" everying someone sneeze or cough, maybe 9/11 wouldn't happen and tsunami would be nothing more than a surfer's wet dream.

[nick__45]

I would think it would be more convenient for someone who wishes to keep his whole pay to pay his bills, to pay his tithe through service to the church, especially those with rotating hours.

I'm sure you can find a church that you can work within your time frame. Besides, when you work for the lord, the ticker isn't ticking(like not paying taxes while trying to pay your taxes) because you are not getting paid.

Actually, you have a God-given right to enter any church during business hours and receive preaching, however good or bad, and services free of charge. You can choose to give, tithe, donate, etc whenever you want and at whatever level you feel comfortable with. It is not up to the church to decide so you don't have to get the church's blessing before doing anything. If you ask Him, He will tell you exactly what what I told you. Your contribution is strictly between you and your God.

[nick__45]

All the bread in the world will not save someone's soul.

I believe charities and organizations serve immense purposes in helping meet the physical needs of those who have them. Red Cross, Salvation Army, Food banks nationwide, etc.

So many great orgranizations. But which is more important: to feed someone's body? or to feed their soul?


If you don't think that giving to the Church equates to giving to God, there's not really anything I can say. How else would you give to Him? Burn up your cash? Grow some tomatoes in your backyard and burn them on a makeshift altar?

If you give food to the poor, Jesus says it's the same as giving to Him - but if someone only feels they gave food to a poor guy, not directly to Jesus, what can be said?

So if I give my money to a church who helps people find salvation, how is that different than giving food to a homeless person? I have helped feed their soul, which (to me) is more important than their body.


Nonetheless, if we have the money available, it's preferable to give to both. Feed the body AND the soul. We should not neglect charitable organizations, as they serve wonderful purposes for society.

Jim 13:
Give thy hungry neighbor thy bread, for his life is saved.
Give thy hungry neighbor thy non-sense soul food, thou will have thy ass kicked.

[nick__45]

Basic Biblical truths:

Tithe came from the miracles of God, specifically crops and animals.

Firstfruits came from the miracles of God.

Do you find any scripture where a carpenter gave the first of his works to God? Do you find any scripture where a tent maker gave the first tent he made to God? Do you find any scripture where fishermen gave the first fish they caught to God?

God reserved, for Himself, a tenth of His crops, every tenth of His animals in herds and flocks, RAISED ON THE HOLY LAND. God did NOT accept a tenth of crops or animals raised outside the Holy land. Crops and animals raised outside the Holy land were not considered clean and could not be accepted as a Holy tithe.

Easy Tiger. You may have just expose the loophole us mere mortal have against the vaticans' elites. We are now doomed, at least our wallet is, because you can keep a secret. Loose lips sink ships, have you heard of that?

[nick__45]

Who here live on church income? I think it is fair we know which side of the bed commenters sleep on.

[nick__45]

See I just really don't like this sentiment. As though, paying a tithe means you'll be poor forever. But "giving sacrificially" means you're doing well with your money. Which if 10% makes you poor, how does 25% mean you're doing well?

If you make $60,000 a year, you can afford $1400/month for housing. If you tithe, that reduces your income to $54,000; and thus you can afford $1260/month for housing. Now how big of a difference is there between $1400 and $1260?

It means you can afford a $235k house, instead of a $260k home. Not that big of a difference.

If they lost that $60k job, and took a $50k one in the meantime, they still couldn't afford the house - even if they stopped tithing! But they'd try and stretch the income to make it work, so they didn't have to give up that lifestyle. And usually, they'd blame the tithe, or taxes, or something else as the reason why things were so tight. When their budget is the real issue.

Or would you say that they should "give sacrificially" at say 5%. What sacrifice?? They didn't give up anything. They kept their expensive home. Expensive car. Kept eating out. The only thing they sacrificed on, was their giving.

For someone who is low income already, things are tight as is. The tithe doesn't make them a "pauper." Instead of making 24,000, they're making 21,600. Things were going to be tight anyways. But there is minimal difference in the lifestyle you'll be able to live.



Can you give me an example, where the income itself is good enough to live well, but tithing turns them into "paupers?"

If your income is 60k and your mortgage is $1400/month, then you are living very irresponsibility. Your mortgage should be no more than $800, including insurance, tax, and all fee associate with owning such mortgage.

[nick__45]

And being Jewish, you also don't tithe because you know there is to Temple and no Levitical priesthood to support. You know that the tithe can ONLY be taken to Levites. Right?

Isn't it amazing how so-called Christian leaders have taken God's commands and changed them to fit their own circumstances? And these same Christian leaders, who are misrepresenting God's Word actually think they are getting away with it! Maybe they have fooled their congregations, but they haven't fooled God.

+ 1 million zillions. I got to church but I don't fool me. Religiously they can't deny my present or entrance for doing so they deny the true God's love for me. All church buildings and properties belong to God, that means I am freely allowed in any church, during business hours of course.

For those thinking I take advantage of the church (if that is even possible) or being cheap, I will tell you this. My family business employs 27 people at the church in some capacity. We also provide free catering every week. The preacher and church elders get free haircuts and oil change from us. Church vehicles are maintained free of charge even for expensive repairs. But we don't give a penny to the donation box nor do we tithe. We had provide temp employment for people from the church with success for both parties. We are thinking about providing non-interest loan but it is a very gray area and collateral must be put up.