What a day

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Scanner exactly my point. No one says spenders can't be happy together. Some of the happiest marriages are. I think there are more difficulties with people who aren't in alignment together.

Thank you. . .I know a thing or two about alignment.

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*Taking off jester hat*

Seriously, I have been wanting to have that "what do you want out of life" talk with my wife as she turns 40 on Thurs. and I turn 40 in Oct.

We are definitely out of alignment on several issues so I preach to you, not from the pulpit, but from the trenches.

You may have to compromise that 4.2 million dollars. I know, I know. . .the numbers say that's what you will need but suddenly, life got a little real, didn't it? Something the financial advisors and pundits don't seem to grasp. . .

[Well Spent]

It's great you're both talking about this problem, but I think counseling would really help to improve the current state of your marriage.

I'd be very worried if I were you about having the bills sent to her mother's house to avoid detection by you. That's a deliberate betrayal of trust. It's even worse because she knows how responsible and caring you are about the family finances.

[tripods68]

I implied that I consider deception no different than an afair.

Hey Matt not to pick on you. How is deception is the same thing as having an affair? The two things refers to two different situation in marriage. Deception is weaker arguments in comparing to a cheating wife or husband IMO.

[DebbieL]

I don't know...I'd almost prefer my DH have a sexual "slip up" that had no financial ramifications (so long as there were precautions taken) than to bury us in thousands of dollars of debt behind my back. Diverting the credit card bills to another address is a very high order deception in my books. The betrayal is what I believe maat55 is talking about - and I happen to agree with him.

[jIM_Ohio]

There is a feeling of betrayal, but within 48 hours that feeling had subsided. Chalk one up for patience and not reacting to the immediate feelings.

I don't have a 4.3 Mil goal (1.5 M is what I could retire on today). Some of the savings vs spending goals were not in alignment- we had those discussions as recently as 2-3 weeks ago.

We hit 20% savings rate over the summer when I got my raise, so from my standpoint the advice I often give here has been met. Took me 11 years to go from saving 6% of a small number to saving 20% of a number 3X what I started out at 11 years ago.

We spend plenty and I am not a freak about living within a budget, I am just a freak about spending less than we take home (after the savings).

I'll let you know how Saturday goes. I think paying the bills down will be without issue over next few weeks.

My credit is fine and I have removed my wife off all 4 of my cc. I am listed as an authorized user on her 2 accounts right now. All 6 accounts have a 0 balance as of 1 pm today (Tues).

[LivingAlmostLarge]

I couldn't get over an affair. I could get over the debt, but it wouldn't be easy. Especially because most affairs are due to other problems in the relationship, not just physical lust.

Many times affairs are because something is missing at home. And sometimes it's not going to work out.

[disneysteve]

Many times affairs are because something is missing at home. And sometimes it's not going to work out.

I think the same could be said for financial infidelity. I think Oprah did a show on this recently and it is very similar to sexual infidelity. One spouse sneaking around, spending, opening accounts, hiding purchases, etc. The deception, lying and betrayal has a lot of similarities to having an affair and often has a lot of the same underlying causes.

[tripods68]

I don't know...I'd almost prefer my DH have a sexual "slip up" that had no financial ramifications (so long as there were precautions taken) than to bury us in thousands of dollars of debt behind my back. Diverting the credit card bills to another address is a very high order deception in my books. The betrayal is what I believe maat55 is talking about - and I happen to agree with him.

I see your point, but its a weak argument one could make.

Decepting someone to hide a truth is something that can be talk about to provide clarification with good defense. As Jim said, his wife was afraid of his reaction so she kept CC bills from him. I get that. But cheating has no defense nonewhatsoever in a marriage. However, I would agree for $10K debt is not enough cause and effect to throw a marriage. But its hard to defense a cheating wife or husband. Maybe I'm just old fashion.

[DebbieL]

I may be different in that I just don't see a sexual fling as the be all, end all of betrayals that most seem to view it as. To me there are worse things my DH could do to me. I would be more hurt if he were having a full out emotional affair with someone (even if there wasn't a physical affair) than a one night slip. I would be SO hurt if he were piling up debt behind my back and hiding things from me that I can see it feeling like being cheated on.

PS - I don't condone sexual cheating, I just don't see it as the worst thing a person could ever do to me in the context of a relationship.

[MiikeB]

That sounds like a terrible situation to be in. I am praying for you, I hope it works out.

[ceejay74]

I kind of agree with Debbie, as long as the slip-up were confessed to right away. The important thing to me isn't that my family never makes a mistake, but that we aren't afraid to tell one another so that nothing is held back, and any damage is contained.

Jim, sounds like you have recognized that part of the problem was your wife's feeling afraid to tell you her initial mistake, and that you've resolved to make it easier for her to be open with you. Great job! Did you discuss taking her off the cards, and did she agree that was a good thing? If not, she may view you in a stern-father kind of way and may still be afraid to tell you if she had another slip-up.

[MonkeyMama]

I may be different in that I just don't see a sexual fling as the be all, end all of betrayals that most seem to view it as. To me there are worse things my DH could do to me. I would be more hurt if he were having a full out emotional affair with someone (even if there wasn't a physical affair) than a one night slip. I would be SO hurt if he were piling up debt behind my back and hiding things from me that I can see it feeling like being cheated on.

PS - I don't condone sexual cheating, I just don't see it as the worst thing a person could ever do to me in the context of a relationship.

AGREED. We are all humans and make mistakes. (& I can think of a few things worse!!!)

As such - I think Jim has some serious issues. BUT I don't think that means you throw the marriage away. That would be crazy. But I think he has a lot to think about. He said in his blog just a year ago he went through this (on a smaller scale). So I personally am left on the outside wondering what is to stop his wife from doing this again tomorrow. ????? What's changed since last time this happened? (appears nothing, from the outside looking in).

I think marriage counseling and/or debtors anonymous is in order.

I think there is probably no better time for Jim to support his wife though, as they work past it.

My personal thoughts as I watch this unfold.

[tripods68]

I may be different in that I just don't see a sexual fling as the be all, end all of betrayals that most seem to view it as. To me there are worse things my DH could do to me. I would be more hurt if he were having a full out emotional affair with someone (even if there wasn't a physical affair) than a one night slip. I would be SO hurt if he were piling up debt behind my back and hiding things from me that I can see it feeling like being cheated on.

PS - I don't condone sexual cheating, I just don't see it as the worst thing a person could ever do to me in the context of a relationship.

I get your point. Listen i'm not here to argue with you about the different types of affairs. It doesn't matter to me how you define cheating versus having an affair. To me is no difference nonewhatsover. Cheating is cheating. Affair is an affair. That's very strong compelling arguments for a divorce versus deceiving the husband for not paying outstanding bills were supposedly paid.

[Well Spent]

I think Jim confronted her when he discovered it. I don't think his wife went to him and confessed on her own. So how long would she have continued to deceive him?