Have you made 2021 travel plans? Do you think they'll happen?

[QuarterMillionMan]

John Hopkins school of medicine Dr. Marty Markle said usually vaxes are given 3 months apart but with CWD, Pfizer & Moderna had to expedite the trials so they used 3 weeks and 4 weeks for the 2nd doses, respectively. Dr. Marty believes if the trials had not been expedited and conducted under regular timelines using 3 months between 1st & 2nd doses that a booster may not have been needed as we are currently experiencing. Any thoughts?

[james.hendrickson]

John Hopkins school of medicine Dr. Marty Markle said usually vaxes are given 3 months apart but with CWD, Pfizer & Moderna had to expedite the trials so they used 3 weeks and 4 weeks for the 2nd doses, respectively. Dr. Marty believes if the trials had not been expedited and conducted under regular timelines using 3 months between 1st & 2nd doses that a booster may not have been needed as we are currently experiencing. Any thoughts?

Um...vaccines are medicine. Vaccines basically work, this seems like much ado about nothing.

[QuarterMillionMan]

Ha-ha James I agree medicines & vaccines work but the point that I was trying to get across was if the clinical trials weren't rushed and hurried along, and they stuck with 3 months in between 1st & 2nd doses, a 3rd booster might not have been needed like we do now.

[james.hendrickson]

Ha-ha James I agree medicines & vaccines work but the point that I was trying to get across was if the clinical trials weren't rushed and hurried along, and they stuck with 3 months in between 1st & 2nd doses, a 3rd booster might not have been needed like we do now.

That's a fair point...but what can one really expect? The government and the drug companies had to get the vaccine to market. The economy was ruined and there was shut-down related rioting in the streets.

[Snydley]

John Hopkins school of medicine Dr. Marty Markle said usually vaxes are given 3 months apart but with CWD, Pfizer & Moderna had to expedite the trials so they used 3 weeks and 4 weeks for the 2nd doses, respectively. Dr. Marty believes if the trials had not been expedited and conducted under regular timelines using 3 months between 1st & 2nd doses that a booster may not have been needed as we are currently experiencing. Any thoughts?

It's very likely that the spacing between the first and second doses impacts how long a 'high enough' level of virus-specific antibodies are in areas that prevent infection (so in this case, likely the lining of the nose and mouth). What is clear is that the levels of antibodies in the blood are falling over time after the second dose of all 3 types of vaccines in the US. If the second dose was given 3 months apart, this spacing could have been better for the dividing/growing numbers and long term survival of two types of immune cells that pump out antibodies- they are called plasmablasts and plasma cells. The thinking that longer could be better between doses is because immune cells (like people!) function better when they get time to rest in between when they are put to work. If the B cells (which develop into the plasmablasts and plasma cells) got maximal time to rest in 3-4 weeks isn't known.

However, if the Delta variant didn't appear, maybe the booster wouldn't be as needed, as maybe the amount that the antibodies declined in level 4,5,6 months after that second dose would not be clinically revelant, as there might still be enough to catch most/all the virus that is thrown at you when an person infected with the old strains breathes in your face. An person infected with Delta spews out way more virus so you need more antibodies.

Regardless, needing boosters, even annual shots, is nothing new, and we didn't have years to test for the best possible combination to minimize the number of shots given. The potential health risks are so low from receiving many doses of the same type of vaccine (your immune system is designed to handle foreign stuff being thrown at it, over and over, without incident, especially if it's not packaged in some nasty virus that knows how to mess things up for you clinically and ensure it replicates and moves on to the next person). I think getting a 3rd shot at 6 months makes sense- which is why I got a 3rd shot a month ago.

[ua_guy]

We just finished a 1700-mile road trip to central Montana and back to the upper left, with a stay in Glacier National Park along the way....The park only gets prettier in the fall! And traffic and crowds are much reduced.

We planned the trip with only a couple weeks notice. It was all self-contained motorhome travel with some enjoyable stays in Sandpoint, Great falls, and Missoula. I have really come to love fall travel. It's so much quieter, and the cooler temperatures are really nice.

One more little trip coming up, meeting some (vaccinated) friends for a weekend campout on the Columbia. November and December are pretty dreary, lots of rain, so our itinerary is pretty quiet until the week of Christmas. We've already booked a great spot on the water so we can watch fireworks for New Years Eve.

We're not going to let 2022 pass us by. Our itinerary is already filled through June!

[LivingAlmostLarge]

We just finished a 1700-mile road trip to central Montana and back to the upper left, with a stay in Glacier National Park along the way....The park only gets prettier in the fall! And traffic and crowds are much reduced.

We planned the trip with only a couple weeks notice. It was all self-contained motorhome travel with some enjoyable stays in Sandpoint, Great falls, and Missoula. I have really come to love fall travel. It's so much quieter, and the cooler temperatures are really nice.

One more little trip coming up, meeting some (vaccinated) friends for a weekend campout on the Columbia. November and December are pretty dreary, lots of rain, so our itinerary is pretty quiet until the week of Christmas. We've already booked a great spot on the water so we can watch fireworks for New Years Eve.

We're not going to let 2022 pass us by. Our itinerary is already filled through June!

Sounds like an amazing trip.

[bennkar]

We leave for Florida on Monday. I've got a supply of N95 and KN95 masks packed and will wear them everywhere we go. We'll do our best to avoid indoor dining whenever possible or distance ourselves from others when we have to dine inside. When we were there 2 weeks ago, all of the restaurants we went to still had barriers up between tables and they were spacing out parties for the most part so we felt reasonably comfortable but I'm sure in the Disney parks that won't be the case, so we'll just take our food and go outside even if we have to sit on the sidewalk to eat.

So how did the trip go? We have one week before we travel down there (for three weeks). I'm hoping that the parks won't be too crowded especially as international travel won't open up until about the time we are heading north.