I Can't Afford Another Baby. Help!!

[DebbieL]

Personally, there is no way I would let a grandson go into the foster care system. But, that's a personal decision. Only the OP and his wife can decide what they'll do.

As for the "nature vs nurture". There is absolutely no proof that criminal activity is genetic. (what would that say of the grandparents...). Don't say that an 18 year old baby can't be nurtured into a responsable, well adjusted adult if raised in a loving, save, disciplined environment.

I agree with you completely. I've seen the evidence of it myself. This is still a little baby with his whole life ahead of him. I think there is a FAR greater chance of him growing up to be a criminal if he starts getting shuffled through the foster care system than being raised by his grandparents. Far greater.

[thekid]

I agree with you completely. I've seen the evidence of it myself. This is still a little baby with his whole life ahead of him. I think there is a FAR greater chance of him growing up to be a criminal if he starts getting shuffled through the foster care system than being raised by his grandparents. Far greater.

I think that 18 months is quite young enough to undo most if not all of the emotional damage that could have been done by irresponsible parents.

However, I think only the OP can know what his situation permits and what he can reasonably give. Ultimately, I think that's the sucess factor in this one.

[thekid]

A little thought on custody laws, there are way too protective of natural parent's rights I feel. I can understand that theoretically the best interest of the child will be to stay with his natural parents, but that that doesn't seem to hold up in many instances. Only the child's interest should be a factor, and that doesn't transalate well when the system presuposes that those interests will best be served with the natural parents.

[Scanner]

I am not suggesting criminal activity is genetic per se. . .I have just seen drug addicted crack babies or even just a father who used drugs, they never knew, grow up in a nuturing environment turn to the same destructive behavior.

I guess I am saying I see destructive behavior being genetic.

More than just coincidence IMO.

[blankcheck]

Just had this thought while looking at another topic ("envy," not exactly related), but take into account what type of person you have been in the past. Have you harbored resentment towards others because of some wrong they've done to you? Have you found ways to vent frustrations besides yelling at someone? If so, maybe it's not in ANYONE's best interest if you take the grandchild. Make no mistake; kids can pick up on when they're not wanted, and if you can't get past the unfairness of the situation, then don't use this child as an emotional restoration project. So many of us are looking to achieve the most good. Well the first step is to minimize the harm.

[thekid]

I am not suggesting criminal activity is genetic per se. . .I have just seen drug addicted crack babies or even just a father who used drugs, they never knew, grow up in a nuturing environment turn to the same destructive behavior.

I guess I am saying I see destructive behavior being genetic.

More than just coincidence IMO.

I think that certain traits that can lead to destructive behavior have a genetic basis. Depression, alcoholism among a few certainly have genetic basis. So, I would agree that "nature" does play it's part.

My point should rather be that we should not overlook how much of how a person turns out will be based on the environment in which they were raised. In many of the cases you have seen, how adequate was the "nurture"? Really? I tend to believe that a child brought up in a loving environment that provides discipline and structure will very seldomly develop severe behavior disorders. I would certainly not tend to "write off" a baby's potential based on supposed "bad behaviour genes".

[GREENBACK]

I think something that's missing from the discussion is the issue of older parents/grandparents. Those of you with grown children know that it's easier to raise teenagers when you're relatively young( 30's, 40's). I think there becomes a social disconnect with 60 somethings raising teens or handling young adults. As I viewed personally, I think this is where the real problems begin. Also, grandparents seldom give the strict discipline to these kids that they need(grandparents are supposed to spoil their grandchildren as the saying goes). Parents that aren't many years apart from these kids are usually going to do a better job of understanding what's going on and metering out the discipline as needed.

[thekid]

In the end, I think it's simply a question of whether the OP and his wife have the dedication and reasonable means that are necessary to properly raise a child. Are they ready to put the child first and make it their priority to give it the best environment they can.

I don't mean that in a derogatory sense. I think this decision should be made with a level head and without any consideration paid to what others would do. There are no right or wrong answers and either choice is valid.

My mom had me at 40, and I could not have asked for better parents. I don't think genes are determinant that a baby can't be "saved". I don't think debt prohibits willing parents to be very good parents. To me, these are excuses.

The real question is whether you want to. And an honnest answer to that is what is required.

[lmclanahan]

This topic has brought out a lot of strong feelings!
I am particularly passionate about this because we have had a similar situation almost occur with us.
My brother and his wife are both bi-polar prescription drug abusers. They have two girls, who were 12 and 7 at the time this happened. There was a real possibility that they were going to be arrested, and my step-mother said to me point blank:"I don't know what will happen to the girls. I don't think my marriage could survive taking them." I was astonished, but immediately said, well, of course we will take them. She was honestly shocked.

At the time, we had one income of about $39,000 to $42,000, and four children. Money was just not my concern. The girls' welfare was. I didn't want them possibly separated, and in foster care, even for one night.

The reason my dad and step-mother didn't want to take them had nothing to do with money, by the way. My dad, a father of 3 and grandfather of 7 1/2, just doesn't like little kids. Sigh. They make more than twice what we do, and have two empty bedrooms. They already worked alternating shifts, so daycare was not an issue. These girls are good kids, too. Not wanting to take them for years, okay, but this was not going to be long-term, most likely! Maybe a month or two at the most. Maybe only a night or two! Not to mention, my dad is the one who turned them in to begin with! This I agreed with, because they needed help badly!

I just don't understand how someone can turn their back on their own flesh and blood. I CAN understand being furious about the situation, and not enabling the parents by giving them money or gifts that they can sell for
drug money. I've been there and done that! I can understand having fear of the parents returning and wanting them back. You cannot control these things. What you *can* control is making sure that this little guy feels loved by you, even if you decide not to take him permanently. Maybe this will be a new beginning for all of you. Please consider keeping in touch with whoever is caring for him, and sending photos and cards for holidays. Gifts are not necessary, but a card and a nice note can do wonders for a child who feels they have lost everything. The dollar store has cards for 2/$1. Tucking in a picture of Mom-Mom and Pop-Pop, for example, can have a good impact on his life. As he gets older, he will remember the feelings of being loved, even if he is too young to remember the details. None of my grandparents had much money, but without them, our childhood memories would have been grim at times.

Being in your 40's with young children has never been weird, by the way, lol. (Okay, maybe for a couple of years in the 80's, lol) Before widespread birth control, it was normal to have women having children until natural menopause. (It still is *normal* for women, just not *desired* by all women) Today, it is usually because women have decided to delay childbearing until later. In the circles I travel, the majority of my friends have had children in their 20's, 30's and 40's. One of my good friends had her last child at 48. Almost all of my over-40 friends had children (with no fertility help) in their 40's. It is not unheard of, and really not as uncommon as you think. I had my first at 20, and my fifth is coming when I am 36. Since they seem to naturally be spaced at around 3-4 years for us, I anticipate at least one in my 40's, if I am lucky. :-)

I hope that you are able to find some help with the childcare expenses!
Have you tried searching for a support group for grandparents raising grandchildren? I am sure there is something on the web.

Lea

[disneysteve]

I tend to believe that a child brought up in a loving environment that provides discipline and structure will very seldomly develop severe behavior disorders.

I'm not so sure.

I'm 44. My brother would have been 48 currently, so we weren't that far apart in age. I'm a successful physician, married, child of my own, leader in my community, etc. My brother, raised in the same household by the same parents with the same loving environment, discipline and structure was a drug addict who died of an overdose many years ago.

I think there is a whole lot to behavior that we simply don't understand. I think some day, as the genome is studied, we'll find ways to identify, and maybe even correct, issues like this, but to say that nurture can overcome nature, IMO, is hogwash.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Not necessarily. Like I pointed out only around a 1/3 of the kids in foster care go to prison. Does that mean all the rest in foster care are failures? Probably not.

There are many kids who turn bad but are raised in loving homes. Sounds like the OP tried hard with his stepson yet things didn't work out. I doubt the OP's wife was a bad mom, yet her son ended up in jail. So by the logic presented earlier, then the OP's wife is a bad mom, provided no discipline, structure and love, and should NOT be allowed to raised another child.

Or perhaps there were other reasons. My cousin's wife is the youngest of 6 children. She is the only child to not get pregnant in her teenage years. Wonder what happened that she waited until marriage instead of having a child at 15?

[lmclanahan]

Well, I tried to post some links, but it wouldn't let me. I mostly read posts, and don't write them,lol.

The links were here:

These are just a few I found when I put "grandparents raising grandchildren" in Yahoo's search engine. I am sure there are more! I am not sure what state you are in, so there may be resources on your state's .gov page.

I hope this helps!!

Lea

Oh, and Steve, I agree with you about nature vs. nurture. Sometimes no matter what we do, or how good someone's childhood is, they just go down the wrong path. No explanation, except for something genetic. I hope they find markers for these things, to look for ways to treat it.

[whitestripe]

The youngest mother we delivered when I was an intern/resident was 12.

i had a friend who had an abortion at the age of 11 and another at 14, and then she was ecstatic when she fell pregnant at 17 and now has a baby boy (and she is still with the father).
some situations out there just make your heart break.

on the topic of affording the baby...

if you can't afford it, you can't afford it
BUT if you can adjust your lifestyle accordingly, you may be able to supply a young baby with a chance in life. a good upbringing, good values, and a sense of belonging and love can make an unbelievably strong individual - you could help break the cycle that seems to have started.

give it some thought.

[thekid]

I'm not so sure.

I'm 44. My brother would have been 48 currently, so we weren't that far apart in age. I'm a successful physician, married, child of my own, leader in my community, etc. My brother, raised in the same household by the same parents with the same loving environment, discipline and structure was a drug addict who died of an overdose many years ago.

I think there is a whole lot to behavior that we simply don't understand. I think some day, as the genome is studied, we'll find ways to identify, and maybe even correct, issues like this, but to say that nurture can overcome nature, IMO, is hogwash.

I'm sorry for your brother Steve. That's a sad and unfortunate story. But, from the fact that you have turned out aqs you have, doesn't that also rule out that a baby of irresponsible parents has non starter genes?

I really don't know to what extent personality traits are inherited and to what extent they are the result of environment. My point with relevance to this thread is that you can't "write off" a baby based on his parent's behavior.

Overall, I would think that, statistically, children brought up in healthy environments do much better than children brought up in unhealthy environments. Writing off this baby on the basis that "bah, he'll turn out bad cause his parents were bad" is wrong and a a dishonest way out of this very heavy decision.

[disneysteve]

My point with relevance to this thread is that you can't "write off" a baby based on his parent's behavior.

I agree. I was just making the point that the opposite isn't true either: Just because a kid has good parents and grows up in a great home doesn't mean he'll turn out okay.