die with nothing

[LivingAlmostLarge]

I had an interesting weekend with the in-laws. I learned that I want to enjoy my money and possibly die with as little as possible. I want have no regrets. My in-laws are saving every penny and I'm not sure for what. I know you don't know when you will die or how you will die, but they take it to the extreme.

We spent the weekend with us and they didn't treat us to a single meal or remember it's xmas in a few days for the kids. This after we gifted them a gift, took them out multiple times, and the craziest part was they asked us to bring them saran wrap, batteries, notepad and pens, and took a bottle of coke. Because they are staying in an airbnb as they look for a place to buy after selling and moving out of their home. They complained also multiple times about how expensive everything is, but they literally sold a house for ~$750k that didn't have a mortgage.

I couldn't wrap my head around it. That and they asked me if we were still interested in buying a rental and if so could we do it where they wanted to live and they could live in it for free. My answer? We can't affrd it.

[bjl584]

Sounds like your in-laws are beyond cheap and approaching a status of taking advantage of people at every turn.
I'd limit interaction with people like that.

Not sure what causes this behavior, but hoarding money for the sake of itself is not a good strategy or a healthy way to go about things, as you have witnessed first hand.

[myrdale]

Your story is not clear "We spent the weekend with us". I am assuming you spent the weekend with them, in the airbnb they are paying for.

Did they invite you? Or did you invite yourself?

You chose to give them a gift. Had there been a discussion ahead of time about exchanging gifts or did you take it upon yourself to assume they would?

You chose to take them out to dinner. Maybe they wanted to stay in and cook each night (or was it the case that you had to fend for yourself?).

The list of items they requested you bring: Plastic Wrap $5, Batteries $10, Note Pad $2, Pens $5, Coke $3. That's $25 assuming you didn't have these items already.

They are your kids, not theirs, don't expect them to provide gifts.

Their questions about wanting to live for free in your future rental house is pushing the bounds, but at this point it is hypothetical.

Could they be more generous? Sure. Is your relationship with other people based on them giving you things?

It isn't generosity on your part if you get upset when it isn't reciprocated.

[ua_guy]

Whether they have resources or not may or not be the issue. They sound pretty self-centered.

[kork13]

"Die with nothing" seems like an overreaction to spending a weekend with excessively cheap & self-centered parents.

I've found that often, the most frustrating & inexplicable habits from people (especially older folks) tend to be caused by some long-standing traumatic experience or mental health issue. For example, abandonment or sexual assault creating a control freak; various mental processing deficits (decision making/problem solving, attachment issues, OCD, ADHD, etc.) leading to hoarding; or growing up in poverty leading to becoming outrageously cheap (or the opposite, and become an irrepressible spendthrift). Those are more extreme & obvious examples, but the point is to understand their behaviors in context of their lives. They will either mimic or overcompensate for the trauma & tragedy in their past.

DW & I each have parents that are challenging in their own "unique" ways. Definitely enough to make me want to limit our time with them, and perhaps reflexively try to live our lives differently than they have/do.

The biggest thing to remember when dealing with challenging personalities is the need to set & hold to firm boundaries with them. Will it create heartache for your parents (potentially yourself as well)? Without a doubt. But you can set the rules for your own family, and it certainly helps if you communicate those red lines to your parents.

For example, DW's mom is incredibly controlling, and a pathological hoarder to boot (imagine why those examples came so quickly to mind above? ) .... So we eventually set down the boundaries that we will never stay in here parents' home (really couldn't even if we wanted to .... The beds are barely even accessible), and that we will handle our own time & choose what/when we do with them. Occasionally, we've walked out of an event that she's taken off the rails under her control, and other times refused to even show up. It sets her off into an anxiety spiral, but so be it -- I have a responsibility to protect my family, and I'm not going to inflict her issues upon my family by playing her hyper-controlling games. That said, we can & do still love them for who they are, and do our best to maintain a good relationship with get parents.

Don't try to "die with nothing" just because you're parents have their own flavor of crazy. Set healthy boundaries, stick to them, and love them where they're at.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Actually we stayed in hotel which we paid for ourselves. They don't pay for anything ever and expect us to pick up the tab literally for everything. No they are not cooking for us unless we go out and buy the food and cook it. When they had a house we would go grocery shopping so we could have food go eat at their house and we stayed in the hotel. Yes I bought milk, soda, bread, cheese, rice, etc. I also bought toilet paper because they didn't have enough when we visited their house. Now I came prepared.

Second I booked this trip before they even came to the city since we like visiting it as a weekend trip.

Third I felt guilty for giving my family so much gifts because I like too. I shouldn't have expected anything considering they've never given the grandkids any birthday to Christmas present. In fact last year they try to arrive the day after my kids birthday so they didn't have to give her a gift when they stayed at my house.

Nope they are takers. Wish I could limit interaction. Too bad dh still wants his mom's approval.

Kork so my mom isn't perfect and this is the first holiday and time we are not staying with my parents. Sort of a die with nothing bit. My mom the hoarder has no beds in the house since she got rid of them to hoard more stuff. So my dh this year put his foot down and refused to stay anymore though my mom tried to guilt me about being so spoiled that we expected beds. But I held the line and booked an airbnb for us. She hates us not being with them 24/7 and goes overboard with everything. But the house i suggested I buy her a bed or sofa bed or something and she said no. She refused to let me buy anything or clean a room for us to sleep in. So now we are in an Airbnb.

Guess we are spending money left and right. Treating my in laws. Not staying for free with parents. Even my mom could spends bit more and maybe have someones come on and maybe organize and clean but she won't have someone on the house. And she hates when I keep offering hire my friends cleaner.

I don't want to die with millions and not having enjoyed it

[myrdale]

Two books to consider reading.

The first is Boundries by Cloud & Townsend. From your description it would be useful for both sides of the family.

The second is Meditations by Marcus Aurelius.

Your in-laws are very selfish and not generous. No amount of kindness or generosity is going to change their behavior. How they are today in the airbnb is how they were years ago in their house AND it is how they will be years from now in their next house.

Your mother is a hoarder. She values her stuff more than she values the company of others (including her family). I don't know the story but I suspect this has been going on for years. I believe your husband is correct in refusing to stay over night in a house without beds. I've seen it first hand in my own family. Suggesting your mother hire a cleaner or let you clean isn't going to work if she is a hoarder. Its a mental illness and until she gets help it is not going to get better.

The two books I mentioned will help with both of these points.

Also keep in mind, instead of playing by everyone else's rules you can play by your own.

When mom ask you to visit but says no beds are available, just say "Thank you so much for the invitation but sleeping in a recliner is not an option with my back. We will have to pass". When the inlaws ask to come and bring food for them to eat, just say "no thank you, it's not in our budget".

And when the inlaws come to visit, while you and your husband are grilling a steak and they say "Boy that smells great!" Respond "It sure does, by the way where are you two going to eat tonight? I think McDonalds is open if you're hungry"

[myrdale]

Driving home after work yesterday, there was a clip on the radio that really hit the nail on the head for dealing with relatives over the holidays to reduce stress. To paraphrase their recommendations were:

1) Take a deep breath.
2) Go for a walk.
3) Remember it's not your job to convince your relatives that you're right.
4) It is your job to love them (or at least act like it) for the brief period that you're around them.

[james.hendrickson]

Driving home after work yesterday, there was a clip on the radio that really hit the nail on the head for dealing with relatives over the holidays to reduce stress. To paraphrase their recommendations were:

1) Take a deep breath.
2) Go for a walk.
3) Remember it's not your job to convince your relatives that you're right.
4) It is your job to love them (or at least act like it) for the brief period that you're around them.

Why is the media presuming that the holidays are difficult? Why not presume your family loves you and is excited to see you?

[kork13]

Why is the media presuming that the holidays are difficult? Why not presume your family loves you and is excited to see you?

Not to be pessimistic, but I'd bet that in most (>75%) extended families (especially if married) there is some corner of the family tree that for whatever reason you just can't get along with. Be it the crazy uncle, controlling mother-in-law, stoner brother, humblebrag sister, or hyper-political father, you likely don't see eye to eye with everyone in the family. Nevertheless, we try to maintain decent relationships & visit for holidays or otherwise. You can still love a person & look forward to visiting the family even while detesting the time or conversation spent with an individual.

[ua_guy]

Why is the media presuming that the holidays are difficult? Why not presume your family loves you and is excited to see you?

That too.

I can't stand the holidays. Full of obligation and expectation. They're all about making our families happy, trying to appease two dueling sets of retired, stubborn parents who, quite honestly, don't care that we'll be spending 8 hours in a car Christmas day driving so we can split time to try to make everyone happy. We do it because we love them, but Jesus F, this is becoming insane. We try to propose something ever year so nobody is put out like we are, but which gives us a little more equity in the holiday situation, and the answer is always no, because (insert selfish impossibility here).

One of these days I'm going to put my foot down. The past couple of years we had to beg/borrow some time to ourselves because of our aging dog. To be fair to him, we chose to stay at home for select holidays because it wouldn't have been right to leave him or cause him stress while traveling. Those were wonderful memories, we did a holiday our way. And now he's since passed, and the sentiment with our family is "oh, you can travel again! We'll do Christmas in 17 places! Yay!"

I'm freaking over it. Next year might be it. They can all come over. I'll be sauced like pasta, in a fantastic mood, turkey on the BBQ. Everyone can come, be themselves, be merry - or don't, I don't care. No fancy tables, no gifts, unless you want to - but don't expect anything in return! We've done our time and we deserve a little break.

[myrdale]

Why is the media presuming that the holidays are difficult? Why not presume your family loves you and is excited to see you?

Its my opinion that the media amplifies the most extreme opinions, no manner how small of a minority they may represent in reality.

To the original post, there seems to be stress in dealing with both sides of the family, which at least seemed to match up with the radio segment.

My personal situation matches your description. My family loves me and they are excited to see me. And I think that statement applies to the original poster's family as well, but I know I've got to keep my opinions to myself over the next couple of days when we sit down to eat dinner at a table covered in bags and stuff. That I'll have to keep my opinion to myself in regards to overly religious relatives. That I'll get to hear a few ignorant opinions, and I'll just smile and nod.

[disneysteve]

Why is the media presuming that the holidays are difficult? Why not presume your family loves you and is excited to see you?

Because that's not reality.

The holidays are a stressful time. Everyone is getting pulled in multiple directions with spouse, kids, two (or more) families involved, travel, altered schedules, crowds, traffic, etc. It's not at all a relaxing or calm time. Most people can't wait for it to be over so they can get back to their normal routines.

We "had to" go to my MIL's last week. Neither I nor my wife particularly care for her. Even though she only lives 30 minutes away, Chanukah is usually the only time we see her all year because we just don't care to interact with her if we don't have to.

Another day we went to my mom's. We see her all the time but it's always rather challenging because she's old and not as with it as she used to be and there's always some banging heads especially with all 4 of us together.

Fortunately, both of them live close by so we don't have to deal with airports or long road trips or hotels and such. We can go, have lunch together, and be home for dinner. Too much togetherness wouldn't go well.

[ua_guy]

Oh yeah. At least I don't have to deal with religion or politics over the holidays. None of us are particularly religious. Our political opinions vary, but we all agree on basic premises. Not really the stuff of offensive or heated arguments, and we haven't had any.

We all love each other and get along at events just fine...holidays are just.....such a production, they're so exhausting.

[disneysteve]

There is also a lot of financial stress this time of year which impacts people's behavior and patience in general. When people are strained financially, that shows up in other areas of their lives.