die with nothing

[jenn_jenn]

I mentioned on another thread that we started working with an FA and this was actually a question on their individual assessment: “Leaving an inheritance to family is important to me” and a scale of strongly disagree to strongly agree. For us, it is important (for our imaginary future children) but I understand for others why it wouldn’t be.

What stood out in your post is “they EXPECT us to…”. I tend to be a generous person by nature but the minute someone “expects” me to do anything for them is the instant that I have no desire to give them anything (and don’t). For your own sanity, do less for them. Free yourself of that expectation.

[QuarterMillionMan]

Those that die with nothing won at the game of life, IMHO.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Funny you reminded me the last time my in laws visited us it was 18 months ago. My mil asked my dh to make her a smoked brisket to take home. He said no. This after their last visit before that one he smoked a whole turkey for them to take home. She left at 6 am the next day not bothering to say good by because they were pissed at us.

That same trip we were supposed to see them in three weeks at DH cousins wedding. They changed their mind that weekend after we left two weeks before and called and said they wanted to come to the wedding. The cousin called us to ask if it was okay they told my in-laws it was too late to change the RSVP so late, she was the bride. DH said it was okay and not at all offended. My in laws started hounding us about cancelling our 3 bd Airbnb which I did in April for an August trip because his parents and brother said they weren't going to the wedding. I booked a room at Fairmont instead where the wedding was and a regular car instead of the minivan I had booked. Boy were they pissed and they asked if they could sleep on our floor. DH was like no. So to punish us they went to the zoo the day we arrived and when we were planning on the zoo they said they wouldn't come and then turned up 2 hours late to the aquarium instead. They said it's because the bus was late so they had trouble coming from their Airbnb and wouldn't pay for a cab. We should have eaten lunch without them.

My mom? Well I didn't realize a problem till covid since we hadn't been visiting home since my parents love to travel with us. We went on a lot of trips and they came every holiday to see us for a decade. So they love coming and doing stuff with us. Seeing the house just didn't happen since two tickets were easier to manage and my parents liked going on holidays with us for years. We went to Asia, Alaska cruise, la, las Vegas, Washington DC, NY, Boston, Maine, Canada, all over with my parents and kids. So I didn't realize the problem. My mom just came to visit with my dad and we took trips instead. And no religion or politics but fun. I realized my mom likes to have fun and worry about the house and stuff later. She says so even now. Later she'll deal with it. She doesn't particularly like to deal with stuff and she like shopping and having fun with the kids.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Those that die with nothing won at the game of life, IMHO.

That's what I think. Although my suspicion about my mom is that shell die with too much stuff. I think it's a Hawaii thing this hoarding and the house is full of crap. I'm right now maneuvering in the condo which they aren't at trying to a place to sleep..there is one bed and a couple air mattresses.

[disneysteve]

Those that die with nothing won at the game of life, IMHO.

Unless you had dependents who were left with nothing as a result. I certainly wouldn’t want to die and leave my wife penniless.

[QuarterMillionMan]

Good point. I would even go as far to say those that die with debts who are single are geniuses.

[disneysteve]

Good point. I would even go as far to say those that die with debts who are single are geniuses.

You mean like my sister in law who died in February and now my wife is getting letters from a collection agency trying to get her to pay her sister’s $10,000 Discover bill?

[myrdale]

Those that die with nothing won at the game of life, IMHO.

The guy I saw pushing a shopping cart down by the bridge this morning is well on the way to beating the high score on the leader chart.

[myrdale]

Good point. I would even go as far to say those that die with debts who are single are geniuses.

All jokes aside, I knew a guy who's grandfather had been diagnosed with cancer and told he had 6 months to live. The first thing he did was go out and bought new furniture for several family members, like $10k worth from different stores. All was purchased on no payments for 12 month sort of deals. Twelve months later he was dead and the furniture stores / creditors were none the wiser about where the furniture went.

Does that make him and his family thieves? Yes.

Did any of them care? No. In fact they bragged to me about it is how I know.

[Like2Plan]

You mean like my sister in law who died in February and now my wife is getting letters from a collection agency trying to get her to pay her sister’s $10,000 Discover bill?

That is a good point. Also, who would cover the burial expenses in such a situation?

[QuarterMillionMan]

Not so much the guy or gal pushing the shopping cart with their belongings who no longer is in the game but more like my uncle (mom's brother) who was a government employee who inherited his father's house and took out 4 refis/helocs against the house and lived a jet-setting lifestyle traveling the world leaving outstanding debt balances on numerous lines of credit upon his death. When all along I looked up to him thinking he was a responsible person living a good life. Little did I know he had all those skeletons in his closet upon his death which my mom, myself, and other family members had to scrammble to notify credit card companies, banks, etc, of his death when we'd be getting the bills to pay off the loans. I no longer had looked upon him favorably and had ill feelings towards him. But after all the dust had settled I thought about him and thought to myself he actually was quite smart living off all the debt and upon his death not having to pay off all that debt. In a sense he won at the game of life. Most of us here upon our deaths will bequest large sums of money to our heirs, including myself. I often wonder to myself why should save like a mad-man only to die and leave large sums of money to my family when I should be enjoying it myself. I still save but also I'm trying to spend more on myself and not leave large sums upon my death but it's a balancing act not to let the pendulum swing too far in either direction.

[bjl584]

Not so much the guy or gal pushing the shopping cart with their belongings who no longer is in the game but more like my uncle (mom's brother) who was a government employee who inherited his father's house and took out 4 refis/helocs against the house and lived a jet-setting lifestyle traveling the world leaving outstanding debt balances on numerous lines of credit upon his death. When all along I looked up to him thinking he was a responsible person living a good life. Little did I know he had all those skeletons in his closet upon his death which my mom, myself, and other family members had to scrammble to notify credit card companies, banks, etc, of his death when we'd be getting the bills to pay off the loans. I no longer had looked upon him favorably and had ill feelings towards him. But after all the dust had settled I thought about him and thought to myself he actually was quite smart living off all the debt and upon his death not having to pay off all that debt. In a sense he won at the game of life. Most of us here upon our deaths will bequest large sums of money to our heirs, including myself. I often wonder to myself why should save like a mad-man only to die and leave large sums of money to my family when I should be enjoying it myself. I still save but also I'm trying to spend more on myself and not leave large sums upon my death but it's a balancing act not to let the pendulum swing too far in either direction.

Nothing wrong with leaving assets to the next generation, but it's about trust and faith. Do you trust your heirs enough to leave them a large sum? Will they be good stewards of it and do positive things with it? It can be a role of the dice.

I personally could leave my heirs saddled with a mess and force them to scramble to clean up everything, but not everyone has that belief I guess.

[disneysteve]

That is a good point. Also, who would cover the burial expenses in such a situation?

Exactly. Even a pretty modest funeral and burial is thousands of dollars. I think her ex-husband (who really couldn't afford it) paid for my SIL's funeral. He refused to take money from us. I have no doubt that he's buried in debt, too, and when he dies, whoever is left will have to clean up his mess.

[disneysteve]

Nothing wrong with leaving assets to the next generation, but it's about trust and faith. Do you trust your heirs enough to leave them a large sum? Will they be good stewards of it and do positive things with it? It can be a role of the dice.

You could choose to leave your assets to charities that you care about. We have bequests for a couple of organizations in our final arrangements and we really need to update our wills because they were written many years ago and our assets are a lot greater now. There are more opportunities for us to help out when we're gone.

[disneysteve]

But after all the dust had settled I thought about him and thought to myself he actually was quite smart living off all the debt and upon his death not having to pay off all that debt. In a sense he won at the game of life.

Borrowing a bunch of money you have no intention of ever repaying isn't winning in my opinion. I don't think that should be anyone's goal.