US adds 199,000 Jobs in Nov. Unemployment Falls to 3.7%

[bjl584]

Jobs report November 2023: U.S. payrolls rose 199,000 unemployment rate falls to 3.7% (cnbc.com)

[kork13]

Not much surprise here that there's alot of hiring right now. Many of those folks are probably seasonal workers. Happens every year, and yet our always gets talked about like it's a great shock & fantastic news. Then in February, the numbers tank ... "Oh nooooo......"

[Fishindude77]

I feel like most statistics like this are published for some type of political gain or to promote an agenda.
Meanwhile, every place you shop, eat and nearly all employers constantly complain that they can't get any decent help and nobody wants to work.

[disneysteve]

I feel like most statistics like this are published for some type of political gain or to promote an agenda.
Meanwhile, every place you shop, eat and nearly all employers constantly complain that they can't get any decent help and nobody wants to work.

Yes, one big impact of historically low unemployment is difficulty finding new workers. Demand exceeds supply. Nothing political about that. It’s just basic economics. Also these stats are published monthly and have been for decades regardless of who was in leadership.

[ua_guy]

Not much surprise here that there's alot of hiring right now. Many of those folks are probably seasonal workers. Happens every year, and yet our always gets talked about like it's a great shock & fantastic news. Then in February, the numbers tank ... "Oh nooooo......"

That's not what the report says, though. Out of the 199k added jobs:

Health care was the biggest growth industry, adding 77,000 jobs. Other big gainers included government (49,000), manufacturing (28,000), and leisure and hospitality (40,000).

Heading into the holiday season, retail lost 38,000 jobs, half of which came from department stores. Transportation and warehousing also showed a decline of 5,000.

It also notes that more workers are coming off the bench, engaging from part time to full time, and discouraged workers joining the workforce again. GDP grew another 1.2% in the 4th quarter, household debt is maintaining pace at 2.5%, but wealth dropped because of losses in the stock market.

All in all, this is a report card on our economy, jobs, and labor administration showing pretty much all A's. Pretty hard to argue that things aren't humming along in a generally good direction right now.

[disneysteve]

All in all, this is a report card on our economy, jobs, and labor administration showing pretty much all A's. Pretty hard to argue that things aren't humming along in a generally good direction right now.

I guarantee a million campaign ads in the coming year will say just the opposite

[bjl584]

I guarantee a million campaign ads in the coming year will say just the opposite

Looking at the economy objectively, I wonder how much of what is happening economically is a direct and short-term result of who is in office or what party is in power? Politicians love to use the state of the economy as a tool in campaigning, taking credit in good times and blaming the other party in bad, but can those dots be connected? The economy is huge and global. Washington can no doubt move the needle to an extent, but it seems like business as usual no matter who holds the reigns of power.

[disneysteve]

Looking at the economy objectively, I wonder how much of what is happening economically is a direct and short-term result of who is in office or what party is in power? Politicians love to use the state of the economy as a tool in campaigning, taking credit in good times and blaming the other party in bad, but can those dots be connected? The economy is huge and global. Washington can no doubt move the needle to an extent, but it seems like business as usual no matter who holds the reigns of power.

That’s pretty easy to answer actually. Actual data (which politicians love to ignore if it doesn't fit their narrative) shows quite clearly that the economy performs much better under Democratic leadership. If you Google “which party is better for the economy” you'll get a bunch of sites and studies documenting this.

This one comes straight from Congress. It's from 2016 but the data hasn't changed. The last administration and the current one have just further proven the point: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...-&opi=89978449

From Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._e...can_presidents

As for the stock market specifically, which isn't "the economy" but it's certainly something we all care about, "The average annual return for the S&P 500 index when we had a Republican President was 9.32%. When we had a Democratic President, the S&P 500 average 15.22% per year. That's a premium of 5.9% per year on average. To put it mildly, this is a really big difference."

[Fishindude77]

It's easy to pluck news off the internet that suits anyone's personal political narrative.
It's probably smarter to simply make the judgement based on personal experience; cost of every day goods and services, interest rates, stock market returns, your local employment picture, etc.

[disneysteve]

It's easy to pluck news off the internet that suits anyone's personal political narrative.
It's probably smarter to simply make the judgement based on personal experience; cost of every day goods and services, interest rates, stock market returns, your local employment picture, etc.

NO! It isnt! That's a huge problem in our society today. Too many people think that their opinion carries more weight than facts and actual data. They don't trust government. They don't trust science. They don't trust people who have devoted their lives to studying various topics. They see one TikTok video or a Twitter post and decide that they know more than all of the experts.

Just for the sake of discussion, please share a few links to studies (not opinions) that show the economy had done better under Republican leadership. It would be interesting to compare the data and see how the approaches differ to come up with opposing results.

And for the record, I didn't "pluck news off the internet". I pulled cold hard facts. Not the same thing at all.

[ua_guy]

It's easy to pluck news off the internet that suits anyone's personal political narrative.
It's probably smarter to simply make the judgement based on personal experience; cost of every day goods and services, interest rates, stock market returns, your local employment picture, etc.

Unemployment isn't a political topic unless we're talking about policies which influence it, and this topic hasn't gone anywhere near there. You're saying this supports a political narrative. Which one, exactly?

Should we not celebrate the fact that people are working, jobs are growing, and GDP is up? Or, do we only get to do that when your favorite candidate holds office?

[bjl584]

NO! It isnt! That's a huge problem in our society today. Too many people think that their opinion carries more weight than facts and actual data. They don't trust government. They don't trust science. They don't trust people who have devoted their lives to studying various topics. They see one TikTok video or a Twitter post and decide that they know more than all of the experts.

Just for the sake of discussion, please share a few links to studies (not opinions) that show the economy had done better under Republican leadership. It would be interesting to compare the data and see how the approaches differ to come up with opposing results.

And for the record, I didn't "pluck news off the internet". I pulled cold hard facts. Not the same thing at all.

Opinion: The economy -- and the stock market -- tends to do better under Democrats - MarketWatch

This article dives into the subject a little deeper.
Seems that the best case scenario is a democratic president with a GOP controlled congress.
Some point to republicans deregulation policies as a root cause of worse economy.
Others say it could be random chance.
Looks like records go back to the Eisenhower administration, at least for the purpose of the article.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

I can see why deregulation causes problems. Think of the crash of 2007/2008 housing. Deregulating banking and underwriting went by the wayside.