do you have any unmotivated family members?

**kork13** · 03-02-2015, 07:44 PM

I'm 28, my younger brother is 25. He graduated 2 years ago with a reasonably good business management degree. Since then, he's worked in a bookstore, Verizon store, Vivint customer service, and now sales at a CarMax lot. To his credit, he's legitimately applied to at least a hundred different jobs, but many either haven't picked him up, or have come with very unattractive/poor offers. After he was laid off from Vivint last October, I talked him into moving in with me to reduce his expenses & get him into a new state with a new (and thriving) job market. He's fed up with CarMax now, and actively seeking new options again. Honestly, I'm not sure how to help him, besides encourage him to broaden his horizons and be open to anything. There really are alot of jobs available in my city, so I feel it's just a matter of time for him... I wonder if he just doesn't interview well, or doesn't represent himself well, or what... But my dad has had multiple conversations similar to what you describe with him as well.

Not sure what I'm saying here, besides "I feel you".... Happy to accept any advice on how to help a brother (or niece) with alot of potential actually rise to that level.

**snafu** · 03-02-2015, 08:19 PM

I've 2 sons who graduated with advanced degrees last May and were just plain lucky to have gotten part time work experience in their fields during the ghastly recession which in a round about way led to current employment. We re very aware of their friends who are in a mess of student loans, poor curriculum choices, destructive personal relationships and under employed in minimum wage jobs. What a horrid combination!

One thing I can suggest is to send those who are still motivated and searching for resume and interview training. I know our guys practiced interview skills with their study group who were vicious in their remarks and criticisms. You can tape and repeat these efforts easily and playback as much as necessary until it feels 'comfortable. There are sections in the library devoted to coaching for employment.

Most employment is obtained by referral. Someone in the company suggests/refers the person for an opening. One problem that's rarely discussed is that advertised jobs are all too often 'wired.' The selection committee/HR have a candidate but go through the formal process for their own job protection/security/legalities. It's hard work to get your foot in the door and the rejection is hard to take over and over.

Have the people you're describing examined every possible employment their degree can be of benefit? In some employment, the bottom line is must have a degree. In other situations you must be staff to have your application accepted. You can be a janitor, cafeteria service...whatever.

Wishing these people the very best of luck, glad someone is willing to help if only to help their self esteem.

**HappySaver** · 03-03-2015, 04:21 AM

I don't know your niece's situation, but I think it's important not to be too judgmental. You can't put yourself in someone else's shoes. Chances are she's not happy either, but maybe she lacks the confidence, energy, and yes motivation. Many people suffer from chronic low energy due to undiagnosed physical conditions, poor eating and exercise habits, etc. Maybe she has other psychological issues that are contributing to her apathy. The best you can do is provide gentle support, but I'm not sure what other "intervention" you're thinking of that would be appropriate. She is, after all, a 31 year old and in full control of her life. Whatever you try is likely to backfire.

**feh** · 03-03-2015, 04:36 AM

Originally posted by HappySaver View Post

I don't know your niece's situation, but I think it's important not to be too judgmental. You can't put yourself in someone else's shoes. Chances are she's not happy either, but maybe she lacks the confidence, energy, and yes motivation. Many people suffer from chronic low energy due to undiagnosed physical conditions, poor eating and exercise habits, etc. Maybe she has other psychological issues that are contributing to her apathy. The best you can do is provide gentle support, but I'm not sure what other "intervention" you're thinking of that would be appropriate. She is, after all, a 31 year old and in full control of her life. Whatever you try is likely to backfire.

This is also an especially difficult time for career opportunities for younger workers:

Bad News For The Class Of 2008

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/bad-news-for-the-class-of-2008/

Timing is everything. And for Joe Moser the timing was bad. He graduated from the University of Iowa’s law school in 2011, one of the worst years to graduate fr…

I was fortunate enough to be in the exact opposite situation - I was hitting the prime of my career for IT workers during the late 90s, when the economy was going gangbusters and people were throwing money at tech companies. I am still riding the wave of inflated salaries from those days.

**97guns** · 03-03-2015, 04:42 AM

by intervening we dont want to push her into anything, just guide her. we have tried guiding her for the past 10 years but she cant grasp it.

i truly believe that a person becomes enlightened in life and eventually will see their way but for this one it is getting very late. i did not become enlightened myself until i reached 26/27, before that i was working high school type jobs also but for me enlightenment came when i landed my first corporate job. after i had the taste of success it was my goal in life to succeed.

maybe we are just too judgemental, im kinda confused about her myself

**disneysteve** · 03-03-2015, 05:57 AM

As the parent of a college student, I would say that a lot of this "failure to launch" is due to over-parenting. When I was growing up, I was expected to become independent. Today, that expectation doesn't seem to be there. Parents aren't letting kids spread their wings and fly. They are keeping them tied down - I'm speaking figuratively of course. Parents want/insist on being actively involved in every aspect of their kids' lives. While that's very nice, it is keeping the kids from growing up and taking responsibility for things themselves. I see examples of this all around me.

I know a woman who every morning calls her son, who is away at college, to make sure he's awake for classes. The son has no impairments or disabilities or special needs. He is perfectly capable of caring for himself. So rather than letting him be an adult and responsible for himself, and suffer the consequences if he fails to report on time, mom is taking charge.

Another woman was upset recently because her son, who is 25 and in grad school out of state, didn't call her to let her know he had arrived somewhere he was going.

Another mom, when her daughter was having an issue with a class in college, personally called the professor to discuss it. We happened to be sitting with this mom at orientation when the Dean specifically warned us parents not to do this. She scoffed then and proceeded to ignore that advice.

There is also the financial piece of this which is huge. Parents don't want to see their kids suffer. They want them to enjoy all of the amenities of life, whether they can afford them or not. So the parents subsidize the kids to make that possible. What does that accomplish? It removes the kids' motivation to succeed. Why work harder if mom and dad are already paying for everything? Why strive to move up the corporate ladder if I already have all of my needs and wants met?

So I think this is generational, but it isn't the young people who are to blame. It is their parents' generation causing the problems.

**Bob B.** · 03-03-2015, 07:54 AM

I think there are a lot of factors. DS is spot on.

Clearly, graduating now, or any time in the past six years, is a much different job market than when I graduated college in 1995.

I heard a guy speak about the generations about 10 years ago, before the term "Millennial" was really widely used. At that time, the oldest Millennials were just entering the work force. This is one of the examples he used to illustrate the mindset of a Millennial (clearly over-generalizing, clearly there are exceptions):

Older Person: What do you want to do when you graduate college?
Millennial: I wan to be an astronaut.
Older Person: But, you're an art history major. There has never been an astronaut that was an art history major.
Millennial: Then I guess I'll be the first one.

I also think that to an extent the younger Baby Boomers are enabling their kids to not work by paying their bills for them (again, clearly exceptions, but I have seen examples of this.

My parents are older baby boomers (I'm a gen-Xer). The older baby boomers and WWII generation would have never dreamed (for the most part) of becoming their child's best friend, allowing them to study for a useless degree, or paid their children's way through their 20s.

**disneysteve** · 03-03-2015, 08:30 AM

Originally posted by Bob B. View Post

I also think that to an extent the younger Baby Boomers are enabling their kids to not work by paying their bills for them (again, clearly exceptions, but I have seen examples of this.

This also ties in to the huge trend in kids moving back home after college. When I graduated (1986) that was a sign of complete and utter failure and you would be hanging your head in shame and getting harassed by your friends. Today it has pretty much become the norm and people don't seem to have any problem with that. It boggles my mind.

**Goldy** · 03-03-2015, 01:13 PM

I think DS is spot on with this one. When I look at my friends from high school the couple I have who have crashed and burned were the ones with family issues, either being too protective or just being messed up. While I technically fall into the Millennial group (1984) it absolutely drives me nuts to be a part of it.

I have a few friends who are still living at home at 30 due to having low paying jobs outside of their career path. On the one hand I respect them for making a budget conscious choice, but on the other hand its like move on already.

**ua_guy** · 03-04-2015, 07:32 AM

Originally posted by 97guns View Post

i have a niece that is 31, she went to college and has a meager degree in environmental protection or something to that nature. she never had a job in her field and has been a valet gopher for the past 4 years and before that a gas station cashier yet she complains about not having money and barely getting by. her father had a long talk with her over this weekend about her career not going anywhere, her lack of savings and growing credit balances.

she was in total agreement with everything he had to say but i think it was just to appease him and to blow it off in reality. i see this lack of achievement and motivation in a lot of people from this generation but i dont think it is a generalization because my other 2 nieces have done very well for themselves.

should we continue and try to intervene or let her live her life the way she wants, all we want is success for our family. i look at others i know that are working well into their retirement years and many others with many working years ahead of them but with no savings and we do not wish this for any of our family.

It sounds like her situation speaks more to a lack of direction. She had motivation to finish college and she has motivation to hold a job. But translating that into career goals and a career income can be pretty tough.

It sounds like she is trying to appease and probably preserve whatever situation she has right now. It might be a good idea to create some action items and start setting a timeline to yank family assistance if she's not fully supporting herself.

It's never too late to pursue career counseling and job placement options. Many of those services are free, and so are the assessments in terms of skills/career interests. She might not want to do anything related to her area of study...sometimes that's how it turns out. People complete degrees just to complete them and be done.

Figuring out what to "do" with life in post-grad years isn't a single or simple answer. I think complacency is often confused with absolute terror about what to do next in life...focusing on debt and indaequate savings are only symptoms and I'd encourage your family to dig a little deeper and try to work with her on some goals-- work related and otherwise!

**LeanneRob** · 03-05-2015, 02:11 AM

I did. My brother didn't really start doing anything til he was late 20's but now very successful. sometimes they just need a break I guess

**Drake3287** · 03-05-2015, 09:57 AM

Lot's of good suggestions and comments. If you have a close relationship with your niece and can offer help, then try it. For many people, after a certain age things will only get more difficult. Someone in there 20's fresh out of college have a few years to get on the right path of life but there comes a certain point (maybe after 30?) that people hit a road block.

At some point she'll have to explain her work history to some would-be employer. Nothing wrong with working in a gas station but you need to explain your direction in life at some point.

**snafu** · 03-06-2015, 06:54 PM

I wonder if any of these 'failure to launch' graduates would consider moving to wear the jobs are.

Just a moment...

http://www.moneytalksnews.com/looking-for-job-you-may-want-move-one-these-cities/

Some cities are booming, jobs plentiful, others are not, jobs are disappearing...

**Scanner** · 03-07-2015, 07:04 AM

I will only add GENERALLY to this thread vs. specifically, regarding your niece.

I am Generation X so I straddle the Baby Boomers and Millenials.

If you ask me to side with any generation (excluding the Greatest), I'll side with Millenials every time.

I think the Baby Boomers are one of the most self-centered (and in a way, you can't blame them, Madison Avenue has made them the Center of the Universe so they think they ARE) to ever face our nation. Generation X and Millenials are being handed the bill after you partied.

For better, for worse, the election of Obama was the ushering of the Boomers to the pasture, letting the door hit you in the rear. I know he's been "meh", but there you have it.

I do see signs of hope. Recently, there is a small movement among Millenials to get a bill passed forbidding of National Borrowing that then hands the bill to the next generation (no long term debt). I think they sense this awful cycle we are in as a nation.

But I wish your niece luck in her pursuits.

do you have any unmotivated family members?