Kitchen and bath update question

[JoeP]

We are about 3 years away from paying off our house, and owe about $44k on a 4.3% fixed rate. As far as improvements, we added a porch, extended the driveway, replaced some carpeting, updated some flooring, installed some hardwood, and finished half the basement. Bought for $173k and it is worth $220k conservatively. We plan on staying in it for another 8-10 years.

The kitchen is nice, but a little dated: formica counter tops, solid oak cabinetry that needs a facelift, sink is thin stainless, lighting is not optimal. We're thinking of remodeling, but want to balance our enjoyment versus cost versus residual value. A minor facelift "feels" like it would be a good compromise, and this would include new coutertops, new lighting, refurbish woodwork, better sink, maybe a newer stove and fridge (staying away from tile flooring). I expect a fresh kitchen would gain the value by maybe $10k, and if the bathrooms with similar countertops and cabinetry were updated, maybe $15k total value increase.

I don't want to borrow against the house via a HELOC, and I'd hate to tap into the $16k we have earmarked for a replacement car, and saving a few hundred a month seems like a slow way to do it. Also, we have one starting college in 2.5 years and another one a year later, so the current mortgage payments would be used for their education.

Part of us wants a nicer kitchen and bathrooms, and part wants to keep the money for college and other expenses even if that means we'll get low-balled because of outdated kitcten/bath. What is the general thought process for addressing this kind of project and the financial conflict?

[creditcardfree]

In 8-10 years, your update may be dated is my first thought. If you are updating for you do it now, but within reason of what homes in your area have. If you go too high end, the money will never be recouped. Also, if you are only doing the upgrade for resell, I'd wait until two years out so your upgrades are current.

[cypher1]

In 8-10 years, your update may be dated is my first thought. If you are updating for you do it now, but within reason of what homes in your area have. If you go too high end, the money will never be recouped. Also, if you are only doing the upgrade for resell, I'd wait until two years out so your upgrades are current.

Agree for the timeframe you plan on staying there. JoeP are you a DIYer or planning on contracting out all projects? I don't know what your budget is, but thats going to be the biggest factor IMO. I agree with trying to find a balance for cost vs enjoyment, while still retaining resale value.

I'm also in the middle of updating mine for a slight face lift in order to enjoy for the next 5-8 years instead of completely remodeling. I've been working with a kitchen from late 90s, golden oak stained cabinets, off white laminate counter tops, white appliances, corroding cast iron sink, dated track lighting and off white 12"x12" tile pattern for flooring. Since I'm doing most of the work I decided upfront I wouldn't be touching flooring or replacing appliances until they fail.

I've already updated the track lighting ($90), painted all cabinets/drawers with expresso paint (Satin Behr ultra $33) which I already had when I painted my rail system for entryway/doors. Added brush nickel knobs for cabinet hardware I got from a friend for free since they updated theirs.

Pricey upgrades (at least for me):
Besides pricing remnant granite slabs/installation now, the other big add-ons are replacing sink with undermount(Ruvati RVH7200 $370), faucet (Moen Indi $220), misc plumbing and garbage disposal (~$130). I have quite a few gift cards from Amazon I cashed in from CC rewards.

I will say it never ceases to amaze me how a little paint can change anything for perspective. While I got flack for painting over oak instead of staining, everyone who saw the end results changed their minds. So before you go all out remodeling everything, changing the look of your existing cabinets with a little labor, and upgrading counter tops and additional lighting could be a more reasonable direction for the price.

[JoeP]

I've been working with a kitchen from late 90s, golden oak stained cabinets, off white laminate counter tops, white appliances, corroding cast iron sink, dated track lighting and off white 12"x12" tile pattern for flooring. Since I'm doing most of the work I decided upfront I wouldn't be touching flooring or replacing appliances until they fail.
...
I will say it never ceases to amaze me how a little paint can change anything for perspective. While I got flack for painting over oak instead of staining, everyone who saw the end results changed their minds. So before you go all out remodeling everything, changing the look of your existing cabinets with a little labor, and upgrading counter tops and additional lighting could be a more reasonable direction for the price.

We probably have the same cabinets and countertops. I am thinking maybe having the cabinets stripped and re-stained and sealed, and getting new countertops. Same appliances, too, white and black. Fresh lighting would really warm up the room, since there is only 1 window.

I will agree with other comments about putting too much money into a remodel now that will become obsolete in 10 years, so we may look at a lightweight improvement effort that we can enjoy.

[snafu]

I believe it's critical to do a serious assessment of your home, location, square footage and typical standard in your specific neighbourhood. Try looking at your on-line real estate board interior photos of comparable homes offered for sale. In my mind your home is your sanctuary to enjoy for at least the next eight years rather than merely an asset with potential to increase in value. With current exceptionally low interest rates, why not consider a personal Line Of Credit to cope with costs of a planned update/upgrade? If you and DW make up a time chart with each and every project you may be able to mostly cash flow with the aid of a LOC.

Are you willing to DIY any projects? Does the local HD offer Saturday DIY classes? Like cypher and typical SA viewpoint, I find a can of good quality paint and updated hardware makes a huge difference. If you have genuine wood cupboards in decent condition and tolerable layout, I suggest you first try painting a current colour and replace hardware. Alternatively, the guys who spray paint cupboards do a phenomenal job fast, less costly with less upheaval than removing and replacing cupboards.

How old are appliances? Light fixtures can be surprisingly expensive. Do the lighting outlets in your community offer Black Friday specials? The 'L' [Halogen] bars or track lighting use your existing wiring offering both optimum lighting and a DIY project. If 'rocker' switches are sale priced at the big box stores, they add a lot of modernization but the downside is you need to replace switches throughout. I've seen Halogen bars reasonably priced on local, on-line sites [FB sale page, Kijijji, Craigslist]. Before adding granite, it's best to look at radon and long term care concerns.

Consider starting in a small bathroom to hone your skills. Since the kitchen is the heart of the house, any work in progress in that area causes incredible repercussions for day-to-day living. Where to prepare and cook meals, where is stuff, where to eat all need advance planning.

We bought an old, original owner's [1976] condo choosing location, square footage, modest HOA fee, beautiful landscaping and cost [per sf] via negotiation handled by our realtor. We knew we could do most of the cosmetic work ourselves and over time cash flow the expensive projects like hot water heater, furnace, flooring and windows. We're able to track the limited sales in this complex and see the smaller units selling for more than double our purchase price with only cosmetic changes. Only one large unit has been offered for sale so it's hard to do an accurate price comparison.

Off topic... with DD planning for college in 2.5 years, she could start researching scholarships, awards, bursaries, grants to help with costs in 2015. So many small awards and bursaries are not even applied for and merely need a short paper explaining why DD is an excellent recipient.

[ua_guy]

It's really going to depend on the market when you go to sell it. If it's a buyers market, sales are slow, and things like new kitchens are selling houses, it might be wise to have all that updated for a sale in that market, and the only way to save money is going to be some DIY stuff and choosing contractors very carefully and for specific jobs versus setting them free to handle the whole remodel.

In a warmer market where inventory is constrained, it can still be a sticking point, but generally things are on your side as the seller. Rather than spending time and expense updating the kitchen, you might be able to concede some in price. A lot of people have no idea what a full kitchen remodel *can* cost, so sometimes knocking off $5k or $10k because they think some of the finishes are dated can be a great way to actually get a better value from your house without having to do remodel work. Especially if your buyers are looking for a starter home.

If you can live with it, I'd say wait it out. Let the kids get off to college and see how that goes, save money in the meantime.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Do it an enjoy the next 8-10 years. What are you saving the money for? I at least tell my mom that all the time who can't do a house remodel or even expensive tile because she's so worried she'll over price herself. Sometimes money and homes are meant to be enjoyed. Are you on track to retire and save? Great then enjoy the house.

Besides if anything happens would you have to remodel it anyway?

[dawnwes]

We are remodeling the kitchen and master bath. But we are looking to sell in the Spring.

I honestly LIKED my kitchen cabinets in oak, but several people (including 2 realtors) have told me they look dated, so we have opted to get them painted. We very badly needed new countertops as the old ones were horrible, but we got used to them. We have granite as of last week. And we got new floors (hardwood). The old flooring was not in good shape.

Do I wish we had done it sooner? Not really. It didn't bother me to have dated things, as long as they were functional.

Can you do some of the work yourself? We have done a lot in this house but DH has run out of time as his job has become far more demanding.

Dawn

[scfr]

What about doing just the lighting for now? You could really up the enjoyment factor (especially with winter fast approaching) without breaking the bank and it could be done in a way that won't become dated. Under cabinet lights, perhaps?