How much house can we afford?

[NickGross]

Few years ago, I posted a question if we can afford to buy a house. Thanks for all the advice that I got from this forum, my wife and I were able to save cash for a down payment.

Our current net worth is 425k. 200k cash. 200k in retirement. 25K value of our SUV. We have no debt and with perfect credit score.Affordable Movers in Los Angeles affmov.com

We are earning close to 190K because my wife just switched to part-time to prepare for the baby. I'm at 170k but I expect to increase my salary to 190k-200k in the next couple of years.

I know the housing market is really insane right now and we are willing to wait til next year but we are thinking of "testing the water", get pre-approved and see what's out here in LA this coming summer.

I heard rules like we can afford a house 4x of our income or mortgage should be around 28% of your take home.

We have the down payment for 750k house and assuming we can buy a house for that price range, it will be around 28% of our take home with the current low interest rates.

We are not even sure if we can buy our dream home with 750-800k price range especially if we want to be closer like an hour away from my job. Fortunately, my industry is now transitioning to either fully remote or hybrid approach where we just need to work 2-3x a week in the office.

I maxed my 401k and after all our expenses including rent of $2,400 and putting down $1000/month to IRA ($500 each), we have about $4000 left to go to savings. Of course a baby or two would change our budget especially saving for college.

Can we afford more than 750k? Or does pushing it more would make us "house poor"?

Hi! From what you've shared, it sounds like you're in a strong financial position. However, it's crucial to consider not just the percentage rules but also your long-term financial goals and lifestyle. Buying a house at the upper end of your budget could indeed leave you "house poor," limiting your ability to save for future needs like college funds or emergencies. It might be wise to stay within a comfortable range to maintain financial flexibility.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Housing prices in CA are nuts.
The same $750k house could be purchased for $200k in the midwest.
Good luck !

The thing is that people are willing to pay that and it becomes an enforced saving and retirement piggy bank for people living in HCOLA. They are able to trade down and bank a lot of cash.

[Fishindude77]

Housing prices in CA are nuts.
The same $750k house could be purchased for $200k in the midwest.
Good luck !

[Sidiusss]

I think the real estate market will see a drop in 2022, so I'd wait a year if I were you, but I definitely agree on getting pre-approved. It's worth picking a house that really suits your needs and monitoring its price fluctuation. Thus, you'll be able to swoop in and get it at the lowest price. Given the current situation, I don't think you'll have to fight off many people if you're aiming for an 800k house. It may not seem too big of a sum for LA, but it's still an immense figure for most. I managed to do the same with the condo of my dreams in Hermosa Beach in Costa Rica. I've been monitoring the price for the last two years, and luckily it dropped 12% this year, I bought it through playasdelcocoproperty.com, and I'm in the process of renovation at the moment.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

I don't think so either within 1 hour of LA $750ks. Sounds too little. But how far are you really willing to travel?

[Leo]

What areas are you looking at? I would say that at $200k you can definitely afford a $750k home. I mean my cousin and her friend make $200k and $150k respectively and bought home $900k and $925k. Sigh and the bank loaned them money. Really you can afford it, but the question is do you want to afford it? Is a different story?

We haven't started the pre-approval process from the bank but just browsing online. Literally anywhere 30mins to 1hr away from Downtown LA with an okay school district where we can get 3 and preferably 4 bedrooms. I don't think we can get a house in our preferred areas.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Yeah it is really crazy right now. Just based on my research online and talking to some friends and family relatives who are in the buying process, prices here in LA is all time high and there are bidding wars, and I've heard stories of houses going way over the asking price and the market is still going up.

Even with some people moving out of state, the demand is still pretty high and there is no supply. Also low interest rates and people wanting more space like ua_guy said are also factors that drive the insanity right now. I am guessing add investors snatching properties left and right into the mix, and competition from people with family money or tech people with stock options.

I hope it cools down but who knows. Maybe when we go back to normal, we'll see higher interest rates, or higher supply due to maybe people who delayed selling because of the pandemic or eviction moratorium ending. I don't know, just maybe.




Probably just a regular 3 bedroom in the suburb, hopefully 1hr away from LA. Unfortunately, SoCal is our home and we have family and friends here. We really want to stay 30mins away from LA and have 4 bedrooms to have a home office space but looks like that is just a dream and we need to lower our expectations.

What areas are you looking at? I would say that at $200k you can definitely afford a $750k home. I mean my cousin and her friend make $200k and $150k respectively and bought home $900k and $925k. Sigh and the bank loaned them money. Really you can afford it, but the question is do you want to afford it? Is a different story?

[Leo]

Leo, I think you've got a good plan & perspective. Congrats on the upcoming baby! With a new baby on the way, I personally wouldn't be in a rush to radically uproot your lives. Moving into a new house is alot of work, and having done it with a pregnant wife (twice...my poor, dear, tolerant wife...), she likely won't want to deal with moving into a new home during the 3rd trimester when just walking around can sometimes be a challenge.

I'd just take it easy, and let it ride for a bit longer. With a newborn, a 1-bed apartment may be a little cramped, but shouldn't be a big problem as long as you don't go nuts with buying a bunch of baby stuff. Maybe wait until Feb/Mar of next year -- the baby will be 5-6 months old, you'll be in a good rhythm of your new life by then, and on average, the winter/early spring tends a slower period for real estate. Of course, that last bit might not be much the case in LA where weather is generally good year round.

In the end, intentional, well-considered choices will be in your best interest vs. emotionally driven, reactive choices.

Thank you! Yes we are very excited and the baby will definitely change our lives.

That is the plan. I'm sure the housing market is still hot this summer so we just wanted to shop but we'll continue early next year Feb/Mar.

Thanks again!

With a baby on the way and 1 primary breadwinner, I'd like to see you bump your EF to at least 6 months. Do the parents on the forums agree?

I think that starting to shop around and get a feel for the market is a great idea. Why not try to see what your options are in the $650-675K range to start?

And maybe do some thinking about whether the house or travel is more important. If you're thinking of $1K per month for the travel budget, that's fine. It's great if travel is your passion. But if you're willing to scale back the travel for awhile and maybe just do some short road trips or even day adventures with the wife and baby, that's quite a bit of money that could go towards the house.

We intentionally reduce our EF to 3 months since my job is very in demand in the market place and I am not worried about job security at the moment. But yes, having a baby might change this and after buying a house, all money after expenses will be in savings or investments.

We'll see if we can even find a decent one for 750k that is closer to LA.

We usually travel once a year to visit my wife's family relatives, attend weddings, etc outside the US and sometimes we add vacation to Europe/Asia to do one fell swoop. On months or years that we don't travel, we'll definitely save the money.

Thanks!

[scfr]

With a baby on the way and 1 primary breadwinner, I'd like to see you bump your EF to at least 6 months. Do the parents on the forums agree?

I think that starting to shop around and get a feel for the market is a great idea. Why not try to see what your options are in the $650-675K range to start?

And maybe do some thinking about whether the house or travel is more important. If you're thinking of $1K per month for the travel budget, that's fine. It's great if travel is your passion. But if you're willing to scale back the travel for awhile and maybe just do some short road trips or even day adventures with the wife and baby, that's quite a bit of money that could go towards the house.

[kork13]

Singuy/Nutria, can we focus & cut the squabbling? No reason to argue......

Leo, I think you've got a good plan & perspective. Congrats on the upcoming baby! With a new baby on the way, I personally wouldn't be in a rush to radically uproot your lives. Moving into a new house is alot of work, and having done it with a pregnant wife (twice...my poor, dear, tolerant wife...), she likely won't want to deal with moving into a new home during the 3rd trimester when just walking around can sometimes be a challenge.

I'd just take it easy, and let it ride for a bit longer. With a newborn, a 1-bed apartment may be a little cramped, but shouldn't be a big problem as long as you don't go nuts with buying a bunch of baby stuff. Maybe wait until Feb/Mar of next year -- the baby will be 5-6 months old, you'll be in a good rhythm of your new life by then, and on average, the winter/early spring tends a slower period for real estate. Of course, that last bit might not be much the case in LA where weather is generally good year round.

In the end, intentional, well-considered choices will be in your best interest vs. emotionally driven, reactive choices.

[Singuy]

Then why did you argue with me?




You wrote, (quoting it all, so that you can't accuse me of cherry picking quotes), "Wasn't there news recently that for the first time ever CA lost more people than they gained? That's actually a pretty seismic shift. NYC real estate tanked by 20%. I didn't think CA would be part of this housing spike." (Emphasis mine.)

Nowhere did you say that NYC prices collapsed because of the pandemic.

And... this fraudulently titled story in the NY Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/25/r...te-market.html

"By the end of the year, the median rent in Manhattan had fallen to a level not seen since 2010, and hundreds of thousands of the most vulnerable renters faced the prospect of eviction. But sales were finally picking up, especially in Brooklyn and Queens, and in the suburbs, they rose steeply before cooling off. Still, deep discounts were the norm at the high end, and new developments across the city faced serious hurdles."

The article goes on about how prices were strong everywhere except Manhattan.

No one is arguing with you. I asked a question because I found it surprising house prices are nuts in Cali when everyone keep saying mass exodus of people from Cali and NYC is what causes prices to spike in Texas and Florida. ua_guy was helpful answering the question. You on the other hand decided to pick a fight for whatever reason.

[Nutria]

There is no difference.

Then why did you argue with me?

But I also didn't say Cali's housing price collapse. I only pointed to NYC as a place negatively affected by the pandemic but they were severely shut down for more than half a year. Cali was not shut down nearly as long. Different places

You wrote, (quoting it all, so that you can't accuse me of cherry picking quotes), "Wasn't there news recently that for the first time ever CA lost more people than they gained? That's actually a pretty seismic shift. NYC real estate tanked by 20%. I didn't think CA would be part of this housing spike." (Emphasis mine.)

Nowhere did you say that NYC prices collapsed because of the pandemic.

And... this fraudulently titled story in the NY Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/25/r...te-market.html

"By the end of the year, the median rent in Manhattan had fallen to a level not seen since 2010, and hundreds of thousands of the most vulnerable renters faced the prospect of eviction. But sales were finally picking up, especially in Brooklyn and Queens, and in the suburbs, they rose steeply before cooling off. Still, deep discounts were the norm at the high end, and new developments across the city faced serious hurdles."

The article goes on about how prices were strong everywhere except Manhattan.

[Leo]

Which leads me to an important question: Why do you want to purchase a house right now? What is driving your thought process/decision making? Is it a "nice to have" or "need to have"? What timeline is acceptable to you, if you were to delay?

Good question. Why do we want a house now?

We are not really rushing but we can til early next year and hopefully the housing market cools down a little bit.

We've been saving and waiting and I think we've been ready to pull the trigger even before the pandemic. I've been following the housing market since 2017 and I'm not sure if there will be a housing crash or the right time to buy anytime soon. I've been hoping for a discount but at this point, looks like it's all just a wish.

We are now expecting our first baby on September and I think we are ready to settle down. Owning a home has been always our dream and having a permanent home I'm sure will bring different sets of emotions, hopefully positive like being secure of having a property, etc.

Our current rent of $2,400 might increase after our 1 year lease contract ends on November and it would be nice if we are putting that to the mortgage instead of rent. We've been renting for 10 years now and we have the down payment for a house. Plus there is a construction going on next to our apartment which is a little loud and we are worried that it might affect our lives once the baby is here. We like our new apartment and we just moved here last November and if we are moving again after just 1 year, it should be a house. That was our original plan anyway, is to just be here for 1 year or temporarily then buy a house after the pandemic.

We don't want to keep waiting forever and be priced out of the market due to rising prices and inflation.

That being said, yes a house is a nice to have at the moment. I think 1 bedroom with a baby is doable even though we are both working from home. An extra space for the baby and home office would be nice.

If this summer is still crazy, we'll wait and check again early next year.

[Singuy]

You didn't answer the question, "What's the difference between tank and collapse?"

There is no difference. But I also didn't say Cali's housing price collapse. I only pointed to NYC as a place negatively affected by the pandemic but they were severely shut down for more than half a year. Cali was not shut down nearly as long. Different places

[Nutria]

That was NYC, not Cali.

You didn't answer the question, "What's the difference between tank and collapse?"