Separate Finances Argument With Spouse

[uRabbit]

Division creates division. My wife is a SAHM, and even if I joke about being the one that makes the money, it causes a bit of tension.

I agree with everyone else - there is no yours and mine in a marriage, there is ours. Or, at least, that's the way it SHOULD be.

[Petunia 100]

I disagree with the majority on the issue of separate finances. I think whatever works for you is the way to go. Plenty of happily married couples keep separate finances.

However, what you are describing is not equitable. He uses your car for free, but repairs are your problem. He gets a discount on his car insurance for adding you, the discount is 100% his and you can pay full price. He wants an electronic device, he wants you to pay for half. You hemmed and hawwed before agreeing. If a person hems and haws before agreeing, chances are good they would rather say no. Why didn't you just say no? Now you owe him half the cost of an item you didn't want in the first place!

You need to stand up for yourself. You are being walked on. Your husband is mooching from you. Respect yourself, don't allow it.

[ActYourWage]

I too am in the keep your finances joint camp if you are married. I try but I cannot understand how couples can keep separate finances.

The issues the OP has listed is something that needs to be looked at long and hard. I hope you two can make things work.

[Pansori]

Wow, I guess I am in the minority here. My SO and I... who do live together and plan to be married in the next couple of years... keep our finances separate. He can go either way on the issue, but I prefer it that way. Like the OP we split everything down the middle, and all of our accounts are individual except for one joint savings account.

That being said, I take care of the finances. I tell him what credit card to use, how much to put in saving, how much to keep in checking, what bills to pay and when, etc. etc. etc. While I know most people would not tolerate this kind of control my SO does not mind this set up at all. We have been together for going on 3 years and have not had any issues. His only concern is that he does not want to pay interest on anything.

Now when we do go out somewhere or are looking at spending something and I want him to pay it, I will ask. I have never had an issue where he refused, nor would he ever refuse. If there is ever an emergency with me he would not hesitate to cover the cost, nor would I for him. We also don't have any expectations of paying each other back. We often offer to buy each other things, and sometimes will randomly cover each others' bills (for ex., I made his cc payment last month).

I just have no desire to share my finances with anyone (even someone I love dearly) nor do I want to be overly responsible for someone else's.

That being said, in the OP's case I believe her husband is extreme and in the wrong. They both drive the car, they should both share the obligation. Plus, come on, he's her husband. How could you NOT want to help someone out who you love?

[disneysteve]

DBF and I have been together for 15 years now and living together for 12.

Wow, I guess I am in the minority here. My SO and I... who do live together and plan to be married in the next couple of years... keep our finances separate.

Just to be clear, I do NOT think that people should combine finances when they are single, even if they live together. That just gets messy. If you are single, you don't have any legal protection if the other person misbehaves with your money.

Once you are married, however, all money is joint even if you choose not to look at it as such. If you don't believe me, just ask any divorce attorney.

[snafu]

You and DH have different views about money, it's use and distribution, so you need to get this
sorted before it becomes a huge issue. There is nothing stopping you from taking the initiative and drawing up a written plan detailing how regular and intermittent expenses will be paid. You need to develop a savings program and an emergency fund that pays for things like car repairs.

A lot of couples give themselves an allowance to spend as they please, covering things like his cigarettes and alcohol and an equal sum for you to save/spend as you wish. Basics like rent, food [special or regular], utilities are typically covered by joint contribution split 50/50 or by earning percentages. How do you want to cover auto operations, maintenance and insurance? Will you each track mileage or ? How do you decide vacation spending or clothes budgets?

Personally, we're old school, all earnings go in one account and I parse them out according to need. For example, I take 10% of everything that comes in, no matter the source off to savings. At the end of the month, I sweep the account and any sum not allocated likewise goes to savings. The only reason I pay the bills is because I'm detailed oriented...that translates to DH 'forgets.'

[Pansori]

Once you are married, however, all money is joint even if you choose not to look at it as such. If you don't believe me, just ask any divorce attorney.

I had a divorce attorney. My ex had one as well. They basically said you take your crap, he takes his. Anything that was joint was split. Part of the reason why our divorce ended up not being so entangled is because we kept a portion of our finances separate. Which is a major reason as to why I decided no more blending of finances with anyone, boyfriend or spouse.

[dawnwes]

I agree. We don't have any separate money.

That isn't a husband. It is a roommate. What part of "and the two shall live as one" didn't he get when the two of you decided to get married?

I'm with Brian 100%. When you both say "I do", that's the end of "Mine" and "Yours". It all becomes "OURS".

ETA: This is NOT a financial question, by the way. Your problem is NOT about money. This is a much, much deeper relationship problem.

[JoshuaHeckathorn]

I'm also a huge advocate of sharing everything in a marriage. In my opinion, it's the only way to go, and it'll save you a lot of time and agony along the way. If you need to keep something separate for personal spending money, agree on a small amount that each of you can spend however you like each month. Everything else should go into a joint account to cover all your monthly living expenses, including unexpected expenses for car repairs or medical care.

[MonkeyMama]

I had a divorce attorney. My ex had one as well. They basically said you take your crap, he takes his. Anything that was joint was split. Part of the reason why our divorce ended up not being so entangled is because we kept a portion of our finances separate. Which is a major reason as to why I decided no more blending of finances with anyone, boyfriend or spouse.

This isn't always so simple.

I live in a community property state so there is very little his/hers to begin with. Even if we kept our finances separate they would be completely entangled by law since we are married. Every penny earned in marriage is joint.

I think if all parties agree you can divide it however you like. Doesn't mean your spouse can't fight you for it just because you kept it separate.

Personally, I think couples who combine their finances think as divorce as less likely an option. Though I am very practical, I am also too committed to my marriage to play the "separate finances in case we divorce" angle. I know a number of people who have - and they all seem to end up divorced. Of course, it was something they felt was a likely possibility all along. I do know divorce happens, and that is why I have a career and can stand on my own two feet. But keeping our money together or spearate means little in the long run - we've earned it all in marriage anyway and court would split our assets 50/50 if we couldn't agree. If the legalities were different and I had to protect myself, so be it. I don't think separate finances automatically = divorce. I just think often it is not a good sign.

[thekid]

You can opt out of community property with a prenupt.

My wife and I have and we keep our finances separate (splitting joint expenses down the middle).

We both have suficient money to cover all our spending (joint and separate) and save.

We have just found this to be easier and to work well for us. Pooling would probably introduce some degree of tension as I tend to be a little more of a spender.

Like I said, this works well for us. I do not think there is a universal answer. You just need to find a system with which both are comfortable and that is fair to all (the latter part seems to be missing in the OP's situation).

[skydivingchic]

We are well aware that we live in a community property state and that how our finances are viewed by the legal community will change after we get married. Though I would point out that we certainly don't plan on getting divorced, so how the legal community views our finances is basically a moot point. Regardless, the legal viewpoint and the day to day mechanics are two separate issues. And the mechanics will not change one iota after our wedding. Why in the world would we change a system that has worked well for us for all these years simply because we said "I do"? We both have similar financial philosophies and goals and we don't fight about money. I'm not saying that separate finances works for all couples, but it gets really, really old hearing people say that combined finances is the only option. Its not. Discuss the issue with your partner - well before marriage - and figure out what works for you two. Just because combined finances works for the majority of the forum posters does not mean it will work for all couples.

To the OP. If we were sharing a car like you and your husband, we would consider it a shared expense. That means gas and repair bills would be split, either 50/50 or based on a mileage split, depending on the exact situation. The situation you described has you using your car for mutual benefit and I assume you also use it for your own purposes sometimes. In that case we would figure out a mileage split. So if you drive the car for mutual benefit 80% of the miles, 80% of the gas and repair bills would be split 50/50. So you would pay for 60% of the gas and repair bills (20% exclusive use plus half of the mutual use), and he would pay 40%.

However, I would reiterate that this sounds like a much more fundamental problem. It sounds like you agreed to a financial situation you weren't really comfortable with. You need to sit down with your husband and figure out a situation that is agreeable to both of you, including how car expenses get split (or combined, whatever works).

[Like2Plan]

I suspect this is less about whether the OP and her DH keep their money together or separate. First of all, for some couples it may take a little trial and error and tweaking their system to get something with which they are both comfortable. It seems that both the OP and her DH keep score on every financial transaction and they would do the same even if their assets were joint. I sense that even with keeping everything "separate" BOTH the OP AND her DH think each are getting the short end of the stick. As long as they are both keeping score as they do, I doubt they will ever arrive at a system that they feel is "fair". Maybe there is no system that is perfectly "fair", but maybe something can be achieved where each gets what they need.

No matter how you keep your finances I think both spouses should have the same standard of living. I mean, really--you have one spouse that saved for retirement and the other did not or could not because they didn't make enough--so when they retire one is eating catfood and ordering hot water with catsup while the other spouse orders steak? Or, one spouse becomes unemployed--do they have to move out into a cardboard box? Or, one spouse gets sick and can't work...

Good luck to the OP-- sometimes it takes a while to hit on the winning formula.

[Pansori]

This isn't always so simple.

I live in a community property state so there is very little his/hers to begin with. Even if we kept our finances separate they would be completely entangled by law since we are married. Every penny earned in marriage is joint....

I agree it is not always so simple, but in my case it was, so I choose to stick with it (I do not live in a community property state, btw). I'm not saying separate finances is for everyone... obviously the vast majority believe the latter. But for myself I would rather keep things separate as possible, whether or not we are married. That does not mean I love or trust my SO any less than those who choose to combine their finances, simply that we have a system that works great for us, so why deviate? That being said I'm not entirely ruling out combining our finances in the future, but for now we'll keep things as they are.

Personally, I think couples who combine their finances think as divorce as less likely an option. Though I am very practical, I am also too committed to my marriage to play the "separate finances in case we divorce" angle. I know a number of people who have - and they all seem to end up divorced.

Correlation does not imply causation.

Why in the world would we change a system that has worked well for us for all these years simply because we said "I do"? We both have similar financial philosophies and goals and we don't fight about money. I'm not saying that separate finances works for all couples, but it gets really, really old hearing people say that combined finances is the only option. Its not. Discuss the issue with your partner - well before marriage - and figure out what works for you two. Just because combined finances works for the majority of the forum posters does not mean it will work for all couples.

Very well put!

I do firmly agree with everyone that the OP and her spouse have deeper issues. Separate finances or not, the spouse should be the first to jump at the opportunity to help her when she is in a bind.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Separate finances can work I believe. I don't do it, but it can work if you make enough. When you don't make enough to cover the bills is a different story.

But you should talk and stick by the rules laid out. Then it might be easier.