Tithing while in debt

[momof1in150]

Of course my first post has to be about tithing - such a hot topic that one should stay far from but it is close to my heart. I work as our church admin asst. and we are currently $6000 behind in pledges. Our church relies on the pledges to run the church, this includes everything from salary to electricity to paper to coffee cups, without pledge income we would have to close our doors.

Tithing and pledging are two different things. If during your church's annual campaign you pledge to pay a certain amount to the church you need to honor that commitment. Tithing is 10% and not everyone can tithe. If you can't meet your pledge commitment talk to the pastor or Finance secretary so that they can adjust the budget.

Just as you make a commitment to pay credit cards, mortgages and car payments by making a pledge to the church you are making the same commitment.

So, to answer the OP, YES, you should honor your commitments to your church when you are in debt.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Actually I'm the OP and I specifically said when you are BEHIND paying your debts. Meaning late on rent, late on mortgage, behind on bills. I wrote in the OP that itw oudl be acceptable to tithe monthly when all bills are caught up, but what about when you are behind payments?

I can UNDERSTAND tithing when in debt, no problem there, line item like retirement. BUT what about when you are not current with bills?

Somehow I just don't get how people who tithe can't take the time to read specific question. They just look at two words, debt and tithe and don't bother to read the post.

[disneysteve]

I work as our church admin asst. and we are currently $6000 behind in pledges. Our church relies on the pledges to run the church, this includes everything from salary to electricity to paper to coffee cups, without pledge income we would have to close our doors.

How does your church do its budgeting? Do you plan your spending based on pledges? Where do tithes fit in? As new members join the church, do you get income info from them and find out whether or not they intend to tithe 10%. And does your church receive funding from outside of your congregation, like from a central church group of some sort?

I've often wondered about these things. As I mentioned earlier, I'm Jewish and synagogues work differently than churches. Members pay dues to join the congregation, so we know how much income we can anticipate each year (assuming everyone stays current with their bills). We have various fundraising events throughout the year and have to estimate the income from those, but the bulk of the money comes from dues and is pretty predictable.

[momof1in150]

Steve,

Here is how the United Methodist Church typically works:

Each October we have a Stewardship Campaign and we try to get everyone to fill out a Pledge Card for a commitment for the following year. We finish this campaign in early December and then give the information to our Finance Committee. They request budget info from all other committees. Some of these include Education, Membership, Trustees, Worship, Missions, PR, Staff Parish Relations, etc.

In January the Administrative Council meets (committee chairs) and hashes out the budget. Our entire budget for the church is based on pledges from members. We have a line for church usage (a preschool rents our Fellowship Hall during the week) and loose plate change (the money that is just placed in the offering plate). Most of the time committees take budget cuts because many items are fixed - heat, salary, insurance, mission shares.

We don't get any outside help from our Conference. We have to pay Mission Shares to our Conference each Quarter and those come first above anything else. Our mantra - pay Missions before anything else.

We do have a place to indicate if you are tithing. Some people do but a majority don't tithe.

We are a small church with a membership of less then 300 but we have 80 children registered and attending Sunday School and we paid over out $90,000 in Mission programs last year (financial and other donations). We have a sister church in New Orleans that we financially support to help them get on their feet after Katrina. We support local to global Mission Programs. That is why staying current on your pledges is critical to churches.

[fairy74]

I think momof1in150 makes a good point about the distinction between a tithe and a pledge, however not all Christian denominations have a pledge (I'm Catholic and had never heard of a pledge before reading that post). I also agree with the OP tithing is fine if you are current on your bills, not ok if you're not....just my two cents.

[fairy74]

I did have a question about pledging (for anyone who's church does this) is everyone encouraged to pledge regardless of their current financial situation? Or is it more voluntary? I guess I can understand pledging and making a commitment for people who already have their financial house in order (or those who could get it that way with a little effort) but for people who are already behind on bills and deeply in debt it seems like adding one more bill on. Just currious how this works?

[momof1in150]

Pledging is voluntary. Many people fill out our pledge card by marking - "I am unable to commit to a monthly pledge" We have many people that put $5 in the offering plate but other that can put $100s. It takes everyone. Many that can't give financially give with time and talents.

[anonymous_saver]

Sorry for being so blunt, but I think it is extremely foolish to give to charities or to tithe when you are in debt.

Sure if you have lots of extra money, you can do with it what you want, but even then I'm not so sure - because even though you are out of debt, are you still saving enough for your retirement or emergency fund, or other necessities?

Just my two cents.

[momof1in150]

Sorry for being so blunt, but I think it is extremely foolish to give to charities or to tithe when you are in debt.

Sure if you have lots of extra money, you can do with it what you want, but even then I'm not so sure - because even though you are out of debt, are you still saving enough for your retirement or emergency fund, or other necessities?

Just my two cents.

This is your opinion and you are entitled to it. My children receive a Christian Education from my church every Sunday and we have many activities that are funded through our church so we support them with our weekly pledge. I would do this because I truly feel that if you take care of God's house then God will take care of you. It hasn't failed me yet.

[Gruntina]

Sorry for being so blunt, but I think it is extremely foolish to give to charities or to tithe when you are in debt.

Sure if you have lots of extra money, you can do with it what you want, but even then I'm not so sure - because even though you are out of debt, are you still saving enough for your retirement or emergency fund, or other necessities?

Just my two cents.

For me charities are last on my priorities. However, I see tithing and charities as two completely different meanings and actually, tithing is my number one priority. For me it means I am giving my thoughts and concern with how I spend ALL of my money in a way I think is best since I am including God in all of my decision. But again that is just me and my spiritual thought.

[disneysteve]

Sorry for being so blunt, but I think it is extremely foolish to give to charities or to tithe when you are in debt.

Do you think people shouldn't donate to charities if they have a mortgage? That's debt. How about a car payment or student loans or even a credit card balance? If everyone in debt suddenly stopped supporting charities, this country would fall apart overnite.

As long as you are current with all of your obligations, I see nothing wrong with supporting the charities of your choice. Now tithing is a whole different issue because, as many have said, it isn't about finances and debating it is pointless.

[Quynne]

Somehow I just don't get how people who tithe can't take the time to read specific question. They just look at two words, debt and tithe and don't bother to read the post.

Yes, it does seem that your question was lost a bit. Has it really been your experience that only tithing people don't take the time to read posts clearly? Well...those on tithing and debt? I guess I can see that. Tithing is such a hot topic that some look for any opportunity to express their opinion. Not unlike many other topics that go off topic.

However, I think I answered your question. I did say debt...sorry...that can cover a multitude of things. I expressed that my debt and behind payments is outside of God's will and for that reason I didn't see it as conflict to continue to tithe. Now.....there have been weeks where we didn't tithe. My husband will pay the mortage and not tithe if that is what is needed. However, he will make up for that tithe the next week or with the tax return. I think we tithed 48 weeks out of 52 last year. We get a statement from the church for tax purposes. Now..I understand the logic behind not tithing. However...that is also why I said this was NOT an finanical issue but a spiritual one. I promise that is not a cop out. I just don't feel I could counsel someone not to tithe. I have also learned that if I cannot pay my bills on 90% of my income that other 10% isn't going make a difference. There is more wrong with my budget or spending than 10%. I also believe that God can do more with my 90% than I can do on 10%. So, you see...it is a conviction. Sometimes logic just doesn't enter into spiritual decisions. I do see nothing wrong with NOT tithing on a hard week and making up for it later. I could be wrong about that but I really don't see that as a problem.

This is sorta off topic...but...did you all know that the guy who wrote the Purpose Driven Life says he reverse tithes. He lives on 10% and tithes 90%! I guess when your 10% is a million dollars you can do that. lol. Rick Warren..that is his name...I don't care much for him anyway.

[Aleta]

Yes I heard that . But he didn't start out like that. He eventually eased himself down to tithing 90% and living on 10%.

[tabbycat31]

I have a quick question to those of you who do tithe?

How is giving to your church different from giving to say the American Cancer Society, United Way, or the SPCA.

Just curious.

[Aleta]

I think if you look over the years including the Katrina funds collected; many of the funds didn't go straight to the victims. United Way has had a problem in the past also. Anytime that you are giving to an organization that you can't monitor, it's risky. That's not to say that you shouldn't give to those organizations. I personally give to a few myself, but not large sums of money.

When you donate closer to home, there is more accountability in the bookkeeping especially if they have an outside auditor. There are so many people inside of your churches or synagogues that you can personally help knowing that they are receiving 100% of the funds that you give. I think that when a family is in financial trouble, that you can give a gift card as well. I think that it's more personal and you can keep on top of any wrong doing in the place of worship.