Schools and equity

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Here's an interesting story I have 2 kids, one in 6th grade and one in 8th grade, so both in middle school. Both are in public middle schools in the same school district. 8th grader goes to local middle school, 6th grader won lottery and got into school district choice middle school. You have to lotto in. We won the lottery last spring around march and were informed we had gotten one of 45 spots.

Anyway last night was curriculum night at the Choice School. I go an was actually offended by the school. It's a very cool school and they do a lot of field trips, activities, extracurriculars. For example the second week of school DK2 went on a school sleepaway camp for 5 days. It's paid for by grants, PTO, school district, fundraising and parents. I paid $200. I paid the school fees of another $50 for supplies, I also bought school supplies from a list which was extensive. I probably spent $75 for DK2. DK1 on the other hand her supplies was $20.

Well instead of curriculum it was a night of fundraising and explaining what the choice school does to hit me up for money. Both the normal and choice middle school have PTO (parent organizations). Well DK1/Normal school is $25 membership and a "donation" of $75 is the ask. Fine. This is what we paid during elementary school. $25 membership and $75 ask and if you have a company match wonderful.

DK2 Choice school in the spring asked for $200 ask and $25 fee. I refused and said I would consider it in the fall if she decided to stay in the program. I was HARASSED and have the emails to prove it that the office manager kept asking me and harassing me about the donation which left a bad taste in my mouth. To register for a public school and be harangued about a donation. I am still not sure if DK2 will stay in the program so I refused. Anyway it turns out this donation in the spring was not a school fee but a donation ask for the PTO. Something I certainly didn't understand in the spring and I'm even more glad that I didn't pay the fee.

Well last night DK2 Choice school asked again and said we need another $425. Um, what. I was a taken aback and more irritated than ever. They sat there and said we have to volunteer minimum 25 hours at the school (fine I knew that), but mentioned all the committees including the "equity" board. And I was like "so you are now asking parents for $425 more after talking about equity?"

Fees for the school that I've managed to figure out has been

$50 fee
$200 camping - 1st trip
$30 - 250 - extracurricular fee on wednesdays x 4 for four quarters in the year depending on what your kid picks (mine was $30 this quarter)
$500-1000 for april trip within the state (prior they used to go international to the turn of $5k but equity! it was hard for certain families to afford so they had to "scale" back)
$200 - june camping trip

Then $425 plus $200 PTO fee.

I honestly am going to write to the school district equity board and ask where is the equity? I have a kid in normal middle school and she's going to cost me $20 for supplies, a polo shirt for band, $100 for PTO. And then the other kid is expected to fork over money non-stop for a public choice school?

Am I wrong for being offended? Should i be like yes absolutely this is normal and I should just be grateful and forking over money? I get the need for volunteers but it seems like they are talking out of both sides of their mouth about equity yet seeing nothing wrong with asking a lot of money from families. I know I'm in the minority because in order to attend this school most kids have a parent able to volunteer and not work or flexibly work. Most people only have 1 child so they can drive their kid to school. So the type of parents and kids who go are a specific type.

But I just feel like there is a bad taste in my mouth with the amount of money being asked to fork over. I guess because I have two kids in middle school I feel very awkward giving to one school but not the other. FWIW, I haven't given to the choice school anything more than my PTO $25 dues and the fees directely asked for by the school. I haven't done the PTO ask.

Am I being crazy?

[disneysteve]

So the one school does more high end activities and trips and asks parents to pay more in fees. That seems to make sense. The money for all of that stuff has to come from somewhere. Parents like yourself choose to send their kids there. If those costs weren't communicated in advance that's certainly a problem worth complaining about. You may have made a different choice had you known about that.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

For sure. They said well the minimum volunteering is 25 hours. But really you should be doing 60-80 per family. Um if you had also communicated that I'm sure more than a few would opt out

[ua_guy]

Your post reads like there was a gap in communication from the school about expectations and the true financial committment. I agree with DS that it makes sense that all the extra activities and involvement cost more money, but the price tag should be accurately reflected up front, and the difference between a donation and a charge should be explicitly clear.

I'm not a parent so I don't know, but how do you deal with the fact that one kid gets normal, boring public school and the other gets all this enrichment and extra stuff? Do they feel like it's unfair, or does it not really phase them?

[kork13]

I dunno, to me it sounds like a school & PTO that's too big for their britches. This isn't a private school where you're paying monthly tuition & everything needs to be paid for by parents -- this is a publicly funded middle school. You've gotta be kidding me. Public schools don't run that way. It's great that they want to offer lots of cool opportunities to their students, but as a public school, they can only either provide those opportunities out of their own budget, or make it abundantly clear that the activities (and associated costs) are 100% optional.

Mostly, I'd tell the PTO to shove off. Nothing to do with any PTO is mandatory, and I wouldn't put up with their crap. I'd probably find myself being a bit (very) rude and telling them never to contact me again, or they'd hear from a lawyer on my behalf ... buuuut, I don't take well to demands from people with an inflated sense of their own importance. I'd make sure that they very quickly learn to leave me alone.

As for the school itself, ask for official documentation stating what the mandatory fees are from the school. They'll have it readily available -- if not, then I guarantee the "fees" are not actually mandatory. Trips are optional. Fun, but 100% optional, and maybe they need a more critical eye looking at their budget to ensure they're being responsible with that budget. I'm okay with reasonable extracurricular fees tied specifically to what your child is doing. Likewise, asking parents to spend a few hours a month volunteering in the school (classrooms, tutoring, library, sports teams, whatever .... NOT with the self-important PTO) is totally reasonable & fine, so long as they have options to accomodate busy working families.

BTW, this seems like a great justification for filing a complaint with the school district superintendent's office .... or the state's education board. Not only demanding high-dollar payments from parents that are actually (and unknowingly) optional, but harassing you because you don't fund their spending sprees? Please.

[disneysteve]

I dunno, to me it sounds like a school & PTO that's too big for their britches. This isn't a private school where you're paying monthly tuition & everything needs to be paid for by parents -- this is a publicly funded middle school. You've gotta be kidding me. Public schools don't run that way. It's great that they want to offer lots of cool opportunities to their students, but as a public school, they can only either provide those opportunities out of their own budget, or make it abundantly clear that the activities (and associated costs) are 100% optional.

Mostly, I'd tell the PTO to shove off. Nothing to do with any PTO is mandatory

But if you’re going to opt out of the trips and activities, why bother putting your kid in that school? Presumably parents choose that school because of that stuff.

[kork13]

But if you’re going to opt out of the trips and activities, why bother putting your kid in that school? Presumably parents choose that school because of that stuff.

Call me crazy ... Maybe a better quality of education? Whether through academic rigor, teaching style/philosophy, teachers themselves, environment, smaller class size, maybe a specialized curriculum, or many other factors.

The problem isn't that they offer the trips & activities -- it's how the school seems to communicate (or not) with parents. Clarity on what is required, what is a choice for parents to make. Not to mention treating parents with respect, acting like educators not bill collectors.

I may be reading too much into it. I just get the impression that there are segments of the school & parents that are trying to make it into something it's not, and doesn't need to be. I mean honestly ... It's middle school. International trips & week-long retreats are a bit much.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Your post reads like there was a gap in communication from the school about expectations and the true financial committment. I agree with DS that it makes sense that all the extra activities and involvement cost more money, but the price tag should be accurately reflected up front, and the difference between a donation and a charge should be explicitly clear.

I'm not a parent so I don't know, but how do you deal with the fact that one kid gets normal, boring public school and the other gets all this enrichment and extra stuff? Do they feel like it's unfair, or does it not really phase them?

There are fees from the school $200 for camping trip and then there is the PTO/PTSA bein a bill collector and being a jerk about not "donating" to the cause. I am miffed. Why? Sure I'll pay the school whatever fees they want. But I'm actually offended. I've donated the "asked" amount every year to the PTSA at whatever school the kids have been at. But it's been usually $75 and $25 to join each PTO. And so I've felt okay donating to the cause. And YES it's a public school.

But I've never been called out until this spring when I was being SHAMED in an email about not donating $200 and told it's not needed for registration. I asked the district and no it's not required. What does below read as?

Hello again!
You are receiving this email because we have not yet received the $200 family contribution and $25 PTO membership fee that are part of the EAS registration process.

Payment can be made online via Zelle (follow these instructions) or by check payable to “EAS PTO”. It is not necessary to separate these payments – one payment of $225.00 will be great! If paying by check, you can drop it off at the school office or put it in the mail.

We would appreciate delivery of your payment by April 5^th.
More information…
As noted in your student’s EAS Registration materials and at your school tour, family contributions are essential for EAS to offer the unique curriculum that sets us apart from other general education and choice middle schools. We ask families to make an annual minimum contribution of $200 per student per year in lieu of all other fundraising. While this is not the only additional cost for EAS families, it does enable us to continue offering the Adventure Ed curriculum that is the hallmark of our program. Families are also asked to become members of the EAS Parent Teacher Organization (PTO) at a cost of $25 per year.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

But if you’re going to opt out of the trips and activities, why bother putting your kid in that school? Presumably parents choose that school because of that stuff.

So there are trip, that we have to pay additional costs to the school. Those I pay. I'm not so sure about this whole non-equity schools. I think it's very glaring since I have kids in different schools in the same district?

Smaller classes. It's only 145 kids and 5 classrooms. It's a more intimate setting. I'm not sure we are staying.

[disneysteve]

Call me crazy ... Maybe a better quality of education? Whether through academic rigor, teaching style/philosophy, teachers themselves, environment, smaller class size, maybe a specialized curriculum, or many other factors.

The problem isn't that they offer the trips & activities -- it's how the school seems to communicate (or not) with parents. Clarity on what is required, what is a choice for parents to make. Not to mention treating parents with respect, acting like educators not bill collectors.

I may be reading too much into it. I just get the impression that there are segments of the school & parents that are trying to make it into something it's not, and doesn't need to be. I mean honestly ... It's middle school. International trips & week-long retreats are a bit much.

I totally agree about the communication issue. It sounds like the whole thing has been handled incredibly poorly and that they weren't at all up front about the costs before you enrolled. And the harassment is certainly unacceptable.

It sounds like there are academic benefits to the school, too. But if you put your kid in for those reasons and then opt out of all of the special stuff, that puts your kid at a huge disadvantage both socially and, most likely, academically, because the curriculum probably incorporates those experiences. I'm guessing that's the "Adventure Ed" stuff the message refers to. The trips and extracurriculars probably build on and feed into the classroom experience. If your kid is the only one in class who wasn't on the trip and it's being discussed in class, then what?

The whole thing sounds like a mess and they need to get their act together in the application/lottery and open house process (if there is an open house). They need to spell out all costs before parents decide if the program is something they want to and afford to do for their kid.