we are focusing too much on STEM (oh, neato term) education -> money isn't everything

[sv2007]

Everywhere I go and everything i hear (WRT my school aged kid), is that we must focus educating kids in science, tech, engineering, and money. Even at 1st grade.

I feel schools are focusing way too much on money and jobs compared to when I grew up. Oh heck, I don't think we had any type of careers discussion until the 5th grade (I remember clearly because the speaker asked what each of us wanted to be, and I said "scientist" and he asked "what kind?" and I had no idea that there are different kinds. I just know the mad scientists from the cartoons were cool enough that I want to be one.)

Now, even 1st graders have this career day where they talk about what they want to be; and they are very specific too (not like me, who didn't know anything about real jobs even at 5th grade). And a lot is based on the money that job makes. I'm afraid the old favorite fireman is out based on pay.

Could this be part of the effect that the US income/wealth is becoming less evenly distributed? Creating the haves and have nots that everybody must strive to become rich or risk being poor? I.e. no middle ground.

I think I like the US of the past when we have manufacturing jobs and a solid middle class. I don't know if this polarization of income/wealth inequity is good for the US long term.

[corn18]

I don't know why we have a bimodal distribution of income / wealth in the US. But I disagree with the topic of your post: "we are focusing too much on STEM (oh, neato term) education". As a high tech company, most of the requests we have open for people right now are for STEM types. And they have been open for a long time. The hardest slots to fill are engineers. They go very fast. So, if we were focusing too much on STEM, I should have my pick of STEM people. Just not the case. And I know that this applies across the country.

So, no, we are not focusing too much on STEM. Simple supply and demand.

BTW, I'm short on quality non-STEM people as well.

Tom

[feh]

I think I like the US of the past when we have manufacturing jobs and a solid middle class. I don't know if this polarization of income/wealth inequity is good for the US long term.

Income inequality is definitely not a good thing for society or the economy, but it is the reality.

In the future, one can either be the person designing/programming the robots, or one of the people being replaced by a robot. Of course, things aren't that black and white, but blue collar jobs will continue to be replaced by automation. This is not a new phenomenon; it's been going on for decades.

So, as a nation, we can either pine for the "the good 'ol days" and be left behind, or we can prepare for the future through education/training.

For folks that aren't cut out for college, there are skilled trades that pay well and can't be automated. But, the days of getting only a high school diploma and working in a factory to support a family of 4 are over.

[Snydley]

I agree with your title and your post. I cannot believe how little the arts or any outside-the-box thinking is taught/encouraged anymore- it's terrible. I interview PhD candidates for the Med Center where I work and I was recently speaking with the head of admissions about how we are anticipating a reduction in candidates with the required creative thinking skills to succeed in biomedical research. 'Professional test takers' (as I see many of the kids today) will not do well in a PhD program where innovation is critical and there are no guarantees.

My daughter is in 4th grade and I am sick of all the STEM stuff shoved down her throat all.the.time. I wouldn't mind so much if they encouraged the arts (creative writing, drawing, music, etc) to the same or even a close degree at STEM. She spends hours a day in school doing math, and even though she has easily mastered this subject, she says she absolutely hates it (probably sick of doing problem after problem after problem).

She came home from school one day so excited because she was told to write a entire story after being given only the opening scene. She was working on it at home even though it wasn't assigned for homework, and kept reading us her story as it was progressing. I asked her about it a couple weeks later (she didn't mention it again after that day) and she told me they never got around to finishing or discussing it in class.

[creditcardfree]

My daughter, a junior, is in a STEM program. She wasn't introduced to the idea until 8th grade. I honestly don't think she would be pursuing it if she hadn't been exposed to it. So from that standpoint it does need to be part of the curriculum at some point to attract those that have those skills. I don't know that my daughter is aware of the money she will make if she makes through engineering school.

I also have a daughter who is an artist, and much more creative. We've taken her to a lot of art museums, she had great art instruction in elementary and high school. We provided her a lot of art materials as well, so she could try all sorts of things. She was also exposed to Digital Design classes that were community college classes taught at her.

I guess my point is that I'm glad my daughters were exposed to arts and STEM. There is a need for both, and everything in between. I think community colleges do some of the best service because they are offering classes based on the needs of the community, in most cases.

If the focus is on money in a child's school, I would suggest talking to the teacher, principal and the school board, as this is the wrong emphasis. The better emphasis would be helping a child find their unique skills and gifts, which aren't always clear in first grade or even 11th grade.

[greenskeeper]

Income inequality is definitely not a good thing for society or the economy, but it is the reality.

Income equality is everyone living in grass huts.

[feh]

Income equality is everyone living in grass huts.

Don't be obtuse.

[disneysteve]

My daughter was very good at math and science, so her teachers constantly pushed her in that direction. However just because she was good at it didn't mean she liked it. She loves to write. She enjoys art. She published her first novel when she was 18. She's now an English major, American Studies and Philosophy dual minor in college. I don't know what she'll end up doing for a living but I bet it will be something she enjoys and is passionate about.

We need to encourage students finding and pursuing their interests and passions whatever they may be.

[corn18]

Don't be obtuse.

reductio ad absurdum might be more apropos

[MakeAStash]

The M in STEM represents Math. Wages are based on supply and demand. The demand for STEM skills in the workplace determines the salary. If too many STEM students were being churned out, those job wages would be lower.

I see many teens following an artistic path, a field where supply outstrips demand, thus dooming most of them to low paying alternate jobs, ones for which they did not receive an education. They start out behind everyone else and struggle through life. That's not something I want for my children.

[kork13]

The M in STEM represents Math. Wages are based on supply and demand. The demand for STEM skills in the workplace determines the salary. If too many STEM students were being churned out, those job wages would be lower.

I see many teens following an artistic path, a field where supply outstrips demand, thus dooming most of them to low paying alternate jobs, ones for which they did not receive an education. They start out behind everyone else and struggle through life. That's not something I want for my children.

Completely agreed. High salaries are being handed out for STEM jobs to compensate for the high cost/duration of training & accreditation, and because demand far outstrips supply. A friend of mine (trained as a mechanical engineer) has been through 4 jobs in as many years, because each time he's getting poached into ever-better & higher-paying opportunities. Companies are literally finding him and begging him to join them.

We live in a rapidly developing technological society. We aren't putting nearly enough emphasis on STEM training & fields. It's not at all about money, and if that's the only reason that teachers are encouraging them, they're doing their students a disservice. STEM jobs are, and most certainly will be, the most in-demand jobs in our society, bar none. I certainly have no desire to squash the arts -- introduce kids to them, and give them opportunities to enjoy them, but we should absolutely focus on preparing them to succeed in the fields that will offer them opportunities to hold vital jobs in their futures.

[Mjenn]

Money isn't everything, but no matter what this new president manages to accomplish, the future is not in manufacturing its in ideas. Ideas create jobs and keep jobs in the US because you cannot outsource that skill set.

It isn't just about money, it's about building and continuing to build the economy. No it isn't just about STEM, you also need a lot of support services, you also need a lot of design skill sto package and sell your ideas -- but the art of making things? There is always going to be someone else who can make it cheaper and faster.

So what is left? Skills --- people --- ideas --- STEM. Is it the only answer? No. But it is an important one.

Also, so much agree with the out of the box thinking. We visited some friends in the US and her kindergartener was getting reports sent home because his coloring homework went outside the lines. Cannot believe this is what we need to teach our kids today. My kid goes to a trilingual school in Europe where the kids are given a lot of freedom to plan their own day and figure out not only how to solve the problem, but what the problem is. There isn't a lot of homework or tests, but the kids do the work because they are curious and interested. It is amazing to watch the complexity of things they tackle.

That said, I wanted to be an astronaut for most of my childhood. Now I work in consulting on communication and IT. A bit of a shift.

[greenskeeper]

Don't be obtuse.

Plenty of countries out there with "income equality" please feel free to move to one if you wish. Here's a hint.....they're all hellholes.

[creditcardfree]

As an parent of a talented art student, I find the low opinions of artists as shallow. There are jobs in the arts. If you think you have never bought something that an artist designed, you would be wrong. And these artists don't create for money, they create because these are their talents AND as a bonus it makes them happy. Why should we say they shouldn't be paid for those talents?

We've talked to our daughter about having marketable skills as well as multiple streams of income to support herself as an artist.

[Mjenn]

Plenty of countries out there with "income equality" please feel free to move to one if you wish. Here's a hint.....they're all hellholes.

Actually live in one of the top ten countries for income equality, it's a pretty nice place. Earn at the higher end of a very equal income and it is very comfortable.

Country next door is often polled as the place with the happiest citizens in the world. Also even more equal when it comes to income than where I live.

In exchange for a slightly lower salary I get great, inexpensive childcare, long vacations, an amazing amount of parental leave I can share with my husband and a work life balance that allows both my husband and I to pursue our careers aggressively -- something that would not have worked out if we stayed in NYC. So, yeah, we are staying here.

ETA I don't live in a hut, I live in Scandinavia. So mostly IKEA.