we are focusing too much on STEM (oh, neato term) education -> money isn't everything

[Singuy]

Plenty of countries out there with "income equality" please feel free to move to one if you wish. Here's a hint.....they're all hellholes.

Really?

According to the Gini Index, I couldn't find one single country I want to live at(perhaps HK but that's a city) that is MORE UNequal than the U.S

There are plenty of nice European countries to live in that are way more equal than the U.S.

Higher the Gini Index, the more income inequality. U.S is ranked 43.

http://https://www.cia.gov/library/p.../2172rank.html

[Singuy]

Actually live in one of the top ten countries for income equality, it's a pretty nice place. Earn at the higher end of a very equal income and it is very comfortable.

Country next door is often polled as the place with the happiest citizens in the world. Also even more equal when it comes to income than where I live.

In exchange for a slightly lower salary I get great, inexpensive childcare, long vacations, an amazing amount of parental leave I can share with my husband and a work life balance that allows both my husband and I to pursue our careers aggressively -- something that would not have worked out if we stayed in NYC. So, yeah, we are staying here.

ETA I don't live in a hut, I live in Scandinavia. So mostly IKEA.

This is exactly what is wrong with the misleading bias politician uses to persuade their agenda, getting people to vote against their own self-interest.

"Do you want the U.S to be like Kazakhstan, Ethiopia, and Tajikistan? No?..Then vote for me and not that crazy socialist, communist, Bernie Sanders". Yeah lets not mention all the other countries that are more equal. According to the Gini Index, we are more in common with third world countries than first world countries.

[Captain Save]

I would definitely be skeptical.. when you're doing the same as everyone else .. you're setting yourself up to be disappointed..

It's the same thing that happened w/ college degrees.. College was great for my parents .. because back then it was a differentiator .. now that everyone goes to college.. you better get yourself something that sets you apart OR NOT GO TO COLLEGE AT ALL ....

I was just talking about this kid I know who was talking about his parents screwing him over by not paying for college... I asked him if he was good with his hands.. and I told him to see a plumber friend I know.. Learn the trade and earn while you learn.. in 3 years the plumber will raise his salary more than 50% ... and he can get a journey man license in 5 ..and start his own company... there is a shortage of plumbers... Do you konw why? Because 20 or so years ago they were pushing everyone to go to college and not focus on jobs that don't require a bachelor's

[Singuy]

I would definitely be skeptical.. when you're doing the same as everyone else .. you're setting yourself up to be disappointed..

It's the same thing that happened w/ college degrees.. College was great for my parents .. because back then it was a differentiator .. now that everyone goes to college.. you better get yourself something that sets you apart OR NOT GO TO COLLEGE AT ALL ....

I was just talking about this kid I know who was talking about his parents screwing him over by not paying for college... I asked him if he was good with his hands.. and I told him to see a plumber friend I know.. Learn the trade and earn while you learn.. in 3 years the plumber will raise his salary more than 50% ... and he can get a journey man license in 5 ..and start his own company... there is a shortage of plumbers... Do you konw why? Because 20 or so years ago they were pushing everyone to go to college and not focus on jobs that don't require a bachelor's

With the Liberal Arts college graduating almost half of all college students (since it's the study of ...everything), STEM is actually what differentiate you and your fellow classmates. STEM is what weed the not so serious students out. You can still get a degree in Liberal Arts if you failed calculus but gets an A in the study of rabbit feces in South Africa.

[Captain Save]

With the Liberal Arts college graduating almost half of all college students (since it's the study of ...everything), STEM is actually what differentiate you and your fellow classmates. STEM is what weed the not so serious students out. You can still get a degree in Liberal Arts if you failed calculus but gets an A in the study of rabbit feces in South Africa.

STEM differentiates you now because there is a shortage of people .. but I'd be reluctant to push my young daughter that route since even the govt is making a strong push that way... now if that's what she likes and enjoys great.. but if everyone becomes a STEM student.. that is no longer a differentiator ..

[StormRichards]

[Singuy]

STEM differentiates you now because there is a shortage of people .. but I'd be reluctant to push my young daughter that route since even the govt is making a strong push that way... now if that's what she likes and enjoys great.. but if everyone becomes a STEM student.. that is no longer a differentiator ..

It takes a lot of focus and motivation to graduate studying STEM.

We have 41% of college students not able to graduate
Probably more than half of the graduated students are in the Liberal Arts and Business major.

So as of right now we have a small percentage of students who can actually graduate with a STEM degree, and this number is likely not going to increase unless the students(who dislike or are indifferent to STEM) can make the appropriate sacrifices to graduate.

[bigdaddybus]

I am not pro STEM, I am pro jobs. Working in the STEM field and being overwhelmed by the thousands of offshore resources my company requires to meet our business objectives, its easy for me to see that the US needs more STEM trained graduates.

I am all about using AMERICANS for jobs in AMERICA. If US graduates are ignorant enough to get less than useful degrees that is unfortunate.
We hire computer science majors in a low cost of living area starting at $65,000+ with terrific benifits and a pension.

I am a big fan of Mike Rowe and his podcasts and the work he does to push the trades. Construction, plumbing, electricians, steelworkers, law enforcement, fire departments, etc will always be well paying trades.

[disneysteve]

Construction, plumbing, electricians, steelworkers, law enforcement, fire departments, etc will always be well paying trades.

And these are all jobs that can't be outsourced overseas. Your electrician needs to physically be present to do the job. If your house is on fire, a firefighter in Mumbai can't help you.

Many tech jobs can easily be outsourced. I know plenty of IT workers who work from home much of the time. They could do their job just as well from Paris, GA or Paris, France. As long as they have a good internet connection, they're all set. Those are among the jobs that are threatened by globalization.

My job as a physician is mildly threatened with the advent of telemedicine but I don't forsee that becoming the norm. Radiologists, however, have already seen jobs go overseas. Most radiology studies are done digitally today. It doesn't matter if the doctor reviewing the images is in New York or New Delhi.

So one thing to keep in mind is to focus on jobs that require someone to be physically present. A job that is basically computer-based can be done from anywhere. I have a niece who works for Google. She works in the NYC office but as part of a team based in California. Her job could easily be shipped overseas if they decided to and she's got a great STEM degree from a top university.

[StormRichards]

My job as a physician is mildly threatened with the advent of telemedicine but I don't forsee that becoming the norm. Radiologists, however, have already seen jobs go overseas. Most radiology studies are done digitally today. It doesn't matter if the doctor reviewing the images is in New York or New Delhi.

I submitted a picture online for review by a Dermatologist. A prescription was written and saved me a trip to a local office. But that is more of a convenience thing than a process that could be shipped overseas. Sure, the picture could be reviewed anywhere, but a doctor licensed in the U.S. would need to call in a prescription.

My company moved many of the tech jobs overseas, but it has been a failure in my opinion. They lose so much in productivity as employees spend much longer on a tech support call. The language barrier with "Mike" from India makes it very difficult to quickly diagnose and resolve a problem. On multiple occasions this year, I spent close to an hour on a call with India only to have them turn it over to someone local. And then once the local tech is on the phone, the problem is resolved in less than 5 minutes.

[greenskeeper]

Actually live in one of the top ten countries for income equality, it's a pretty nice place. Earn at the higher end of a very equal income and it is very comfortable.

Country next door is often polled as the place with the happiest citizens in the world. Also even more equal when it comes to income than where I live.

In exchange for a slightly lower salary I get great, inexpensive childcare, long vacations, an amazing amount of parental leave I can share with my husband and a work life balance that allows both my husband and I to pursue our careers aggressively -- something that would not have worked out if we stayed in NYC. So, yeah, we are staying here.

ETA I don't live in a hut, I live in Scandinavia. So mostly IKEA.

Really?

According to the Gini Index, I couldn't find one single country I want to live at(perhaps HK but that's a city) that is MORE UNequal than the U.S

There are plenty of nice European countries to live in that are way more equal than the U.S.

Higher the Gini Index, the more income inequality. U.S is ranked 43.

http://https://www.cia.gov/library/p.../2172rank.html

Income inequality doesn't mean a percentage or ratio...it means everyone is equal. Thanks for proving my point.

[disneysteve]

I submitted a picture online for review by a Dermatologist. A prescription was written and saved me a trip to a local office. But that is more of a convenience thing than a process that could be shipped overseas. Sure, the picture could be reviewed anywhere, but a doctor licensed in the U.S. would need to call in a prescription.

There are definitely aspects of medicine that can be done remotely. The urgent care system I work for is starting telemedicine follow up visits for rechecks of wounds like laceration repairs and abscess drainages.

But much of my daily workload can't really be done online. I can't examine a sprained ankle on a webcam. I can't administer your flu shot via computer. I can't do wound care on your leg ulcer via a smart phone app.

[Singuy]

Income inequality doesn't mean a percentage or ratio...it means everyone is equal. Thanks for proving my point.

You mean a country where everyone having the same exact wealth? If that's the case then this place you are referring to doesn't exist therefore can't be "hell holes".

[sv2007]

Do people who train as scientists but have no enthusiasm make good technicians or scientists? Can we teach somebody to love Math/ to see beauty in touching the absolute when the world around us is in so many shades of grey? Even a shade-grey lover?

I've worked in the tech industry for many years, and I can spot the types who's there for the job vs there for love. For the former, their work lack efficiency and future vision: the work solves a problem that may not always work in even slightly changed situations and cannot be fixed because of lack of maintenance/upgrade vision.

I think schools should stay with the same focus of all subjects (and not like how it is too skewed towards to STEM). Let the students who's interested in STEM find it in middle school or high school. A too-early focus on STEM may train a ton of useless engineers...like those left behind in India working for consulting companies : )

Better to have the best in every field than only mediocre in a few currently-hot fields.

[StormRichards]

Do people who train as scientists but have no enthusiasm make good technicians or scientists? Can we teach somebody to love Math/ to see beauty in touching the absolute when the world around us is in so many shades of grey? Even a shade-grey lover?

I've worked in the tech industry for many years, and I can spot the types who's there for the job vs there for love. For the former, their work lack efficiency and future vision: the work solves a problem that may not always work in even slightly changed situations and cannot be fixed because of lack of maintenance/upgrade vision.

I think schools should stay with the same focus of all subjects (and not like how it is too skewed towards to STEM). Let the students who's interested in STEM find it in middle school or high school. A too-early focus on STEM may train a ton of useless engineers...like those left behind in India working for consulting companies : )

Better to have the best in every field than only mediocre in a few currently-hot fields.

Glad you figured out how to use "former" properly. The incorrect use in the Roth/401k discussion really made your post very confusing.

Have you ever considered becoming a guidance counselor? It would be great to have someone with your gift to help guide these young minds into the fields they will love and be efficient at.