Baby expenses...wife and I disagree

[ThriftoRama]

One thought on the breast pump. Don't buy one, rent one from the hospital.

The ones you can buy in the store don't work for crap. The rentals are strong, and make pumping both fast and efficient. They will also help you produce more milk, because the suction is strong.

You do not know how breast feeding will go for you until the baby comes. You might need help getting production going, the kid might not latch and you might need to pump and put it in a bottle.

Trust me. I know.

My sons were very very hungry, and even though I produced a lot of milk (40 plus ounces a day), it wasn't enough. The pump helped me keep up the pace. My first didn't latch either, no matter what, so I pumped then fed it to him in a bottle.

I tried many store-bought pumps that cost from cheap to a lot of money, and the hospital rental was by far a god send, and affordable.

[Gailete]

The pump helped me keep up the pace. My first didn't latch either, no matter what, so I pumped then fed it to him in a bottle.

Back in the day when my second and last son was born, maternity stays were 4 days long! I had very successfully nursed my first son so didn't expect any trouble, but the new baby wouldn't latch on (part of his autism right out of the gate so to speak). I was literally desperate as I knew there was no way I could afford formula. Part of the problem was how big he was as at 10# 7 oz he was difficult to hold comfortably. One of the very experienced nurses saw how upset I was getting and showed me a completely different way to hold him and bless her heart it worked. That little one was so hungry and once he figured out what to do he did it, which is always been his way. Never had another problem with breast feeding again except when I was over at the in-laws where they DID NOT approve of breast feeding and if they boys needed fed I would be banned to a bedroom without a chair to even help prop my arms for holding the baby. Anyone who has ever tried to breast feed a baby as big as that one (he was up to 30# by his birthday) will understand how hard it is to hold a baby that big to feed him even with a bottle without arm rests or a comfortable place to sit. My MIL main problem was she couldn't believe that a baby could get enough milk even though the evidence of a growing fat baby was in front of her! But knowing how essential it was to feed the baby, I made it work although I know some woman can't I truly think that is a cultural thing a great part of the time, in that so many women don't there aren't a lot of them around close by to give one little word of advice at the right moment when a young, new mom needs it. They certainly get plenty of advice on bottle feeding or what is the right disposable to buy. I guess that is what I would love to see is a cohort of women who can show by example and verbal guidance to poorer women, who are willing to learn, how to raise a healthy child with limited funds and to help them understand that there are options.

[Mjenn]

Since this thread has already been hijacked to the nines (welcome to the wonderful world of internet parenting) just thought I would throw out there what the WIC offers for breastfeeding mothers.... since you don't seem to be such a fan Gailete. Sounds an awful lot like what you suggested... but with some government benefits thrown in. Again, I am all for people pulling their own weight, but I refuse to make poor women the whipping post in all of this.
From the WIC website:

Research has shown that there is no better food than breast milk for a baby’s first year of life. Breastfeeding provides many health, nutritional, economical and emotional benefits to mother and baby. Since a major goal of the WIC Program is to improve the nutritional status of infants, WIC mothers are encouraged to breastfeed their infants. WIC has historically promoted breastfeeding to all pregnant women as the optimal infant feeding choice, unless medically contraindicated.

WIC mothers choosing to breastfeed are provided information through counseling and breastfeeding educational materials.
Breastfeeding mothers receive follow-up support through peer counselors.
Breastfeeding mothers are eligible to participate in WIC longer than non-breastfeeding mothers.
Mothers who exclusively breastfeed their infants receive an enhanced food package.
Breastfeeding mothers can receive breast pumps, breast shells or nursing supplementers to help support the initiation and continuation of breastfeeding.

[Gailete]

Part of being able to even use WIC is to know that one is even eligible for it! When one is already on the states dole for other things, some things like WIC you hear about immediately. It wasn't till I had both kids on solid food, etc. that I found that I most likely would have been eligible for benefits. I probably would have signed up and been glad for the help.

But you certainly misunderstand me. I am not against WIC or programs that help, but I do believe that much more in the way of education needs to take place. One of my jobs at one point was as a grocery store cashier. We had many young women come through with their WIC checks that had absolutely no understanding of what they were allowed to buy and what they weren't or the nutritional reasons behindthem. They didn't understand the difference between 100% fruit juice and fruit flavored drink. Same with whole cheese compared to plastic cheese-like slices. I knew what was allowed on WIC since I had to be sure they didn't get what they weren't supposed to, but most had no education about the items they were getting nor were they apparently getting any training in keeping costs down by picking up the whole cheese that might be on sale that week compared to the more expensive brands that week. I realize that they had limits on what they could buy, but every program I see there is no education behind it no matter what they written rules say there will be.

The OP poster wanted to know what was needed and what was luxury items when having a child. There are cheaper options to bringing up baby. I went one of the cheapest routes and used that as an example of what is needs and what is wants in a poor family. Your income is certainly a component of what might be necessary. The poorer you are the less your want list had better be. Most of us couldn't afford baby carriages like Prince George has. I was happy to have a $10 umbrella stroller because that was what I could afford. I knew I had to make personal sacrifices if you could call them that to have my children. I object to women with no money that have a child or children and somehow expect to have for their children what people with more money have and in that expectation expect others or the government to pay for it. If you aren't working, have no baby father around helping support the child then there comes to a point that they need to get some help understanding that they can't have what they can't afford, even if it includes disposable diapers or formula. It is not even logical to me to think any other way. You might think it logical and that is where we differ. I was poor when I had my children and thus my 'needs' were simple. If we had had tons of money, my needs probably would have expanded. That is how the world works, but those that haven't money and somehow expect the world to expand to support them and their particular needs just doesn't make sense to me.

[ladonnarosso]

As a first time mom to a now 8 week old baby boy, I say let your wife register for whatever she wants! If she's having shower then someone else will be buying those "unnecessary" things. After you've had the shower you can look at those things and go back and figure out what you really NEED and what is not necessary if you're spending your own money. I would say wait to buy almost everything until after the baby is born because you won't really know what your baby is like until you meet him/her. The only things you need right away would be a car seat and a place for your baby to sleep (preferably something portable like a bassinet or Moses basket). Everything else will be given to you, provided by the hospital, or won't be needed right away. Diapers, clothing, blankets; all of those were given to me when I gave birth by the hospital and then grandparents and friends brought even more. Congratulations and good luck! It's definitely an adventure but so worth it for those little smiles.

[Gailete]

Diapers, clothing, blankets; all of those were given to me when I gave birth by the hospital

That's a surprise! When I was a student nurse in the 80's doing my maternity rotation, I had to help discharge a new mom and baby. She had come to the hospital without anything for the baby and the nurse insisted she take off the t-shirt off her baby that the hospital provided to the babies to wear while there, not allowed to go home. So basically all the baby had to leave with was its diaper and a name that his mom literally didn't know how to spell (she had to have her aunt tell the birth certificate lady how to spell it as it was a rather odd/different name).

One of my favorite things to do when I have time is to make Project Linus quilts for babies in need, so hopefully at this point, quite a few babies have gone home wrapped in a quilt I made for them. Even if they had no t-shirt, they at least had a warm quilt.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

I wonder what women did before who couldn't breastfeed but formula really was too expensive and not widespread? I'm just pointing out that breastfeeding is super low rate in the country I think in part because of the formula companies. That before like cloth diapers people made do with them when there was no formula and no disposable diapers.

IF you can afford it great, but raising kids is only as expensive as you want it to be. I know many people who raise kids on pennies or pretty much nothing.

But it's the expectations people have. I have a friend yesterday at the playground who said "My dad gave my kids $20k at birth and now it's worth $60k for 4.5 year old, and $40k for 2.5 year old" and she's worried about paying for college. I pointed out they have enough in their accounts for one year of college now I wouldn't worry. She said what about paying for medical or law school or private school? Again I pointed out that they can take out loans, you may be able to cashflow more in 15 years because you are making potentially more money and less bills, and they may get scholarships. But this is the same friend who pays $25k/year for preschool. So her expectations for her kids far exceed what many would consider normal (including me).

Another friend has said she's paid on average $50k/year from age 2 to 14 and still going for school for her 1 kid. She's like "how do normal people afford it?" My response "they don't. People don't pay for private school to the tune of $45k/year. They make that much to live on."

Me? My mom when I was born was making $400/month and my "dad" wasn't working and left before age 1. I'm fine. So you can obviously raise a kid as cheap as possible or as expensive as possible.

You just choose based on your income and sometimes many people live like the jones and live WAYYY beyond their means.

I know the Joneses and they can afford private school at $45k/year. She has a trust fund that at birth of her first kid she set aside $250k for college for said 1st kid. She had a trust fund to buy her first home. She's a nice person.

But her reality/perception of what you need to raise a kid is warped and unreal. What she spends on one kid's clothes a year is probably close to what most people use as a mortgage payment. But she can afford it.

[Like2Plan]

A baby doesn't need much in the way of material goods. Most of the baby accessories are really for the convenience of the baby's parents--ie can you get by with fewer clothes?--yes, but you will have to run laundry more often. (This could be a major inconvenience if you don't have a washer/dryer). The froo-froo outfits are adorable, but as a rule they aren't that practical on a day to day basis. Sometimes, you have to change the baby's clothes multiple times during the day due to spills, mishaps etc.

I would say set a budget on how much you want/are able to spend and try to make decisions based on what your budget will allow. That might help to sort out how to allocate the money to what is most needed. I like LivingAlmostLarge's suggestion to see if you can borrow something and try it out before buying an item.

[Gailete]

I wonder what women did before who couldn't breastfeed but formula really was too expensive and not widespread?

They hired a 'wet nurse' if they could afford it, or a kind neighbor took over feeding her baby and theirs, or they made 'formula' out of cow's milk or goats milk and feed it them through a ceramic dish with a spout on it, or regrettably many babies died because mom had died at childbirth and so there was no one to feed them.

Interesting family, the Jones'

[siggy_freud]

This is a point really worth emphasizing. All babies are different. Your best friend's baby might have loved her swing and played in it for hours. Your baby might scream uncontrollably as soon as you put him into it. It would suck to go spend a ton of money on things that end up never getting used because your baby can't tolerate it.

How true this is. My friend had a kid two years ago, and people spent hundreds of dollars during his first b-day on massive amounts of toys. At age two his favorite two toys are still bubbles, and balloons. I buy him clothes now . . .

[LivingAlmostLarge]

My 3.5 year old is a stroller kid till this day. I bought a bob single and double strollers. The single I would walk easily 20 miles a day, yes i walked for hours. I would walk from my house into the city, then walk back with her in the stroller. Pack a lunch and it was one of the few ways she would sleep that and in the car. Till today she's a terrible sleeper. Oh and the longer I walked the longer she would sleep. Plus if I walked her she'd be content to watch and chill out. Still loves sleeping in the stroller. I still walk my kids a lot.

Other friends got rid of their strollers by 1 year because their kids hated it. My kids loves the carseat and the stroller. And the 1st never napped, never slept in the crib. So big waste of money the crib until my second kid. But other parents sweat by the crib. Besides the fact by 18 months my 1st could climb out of the crib no problems. While I have friends whose 3.5 year olds can't climb out of their cribs.

[Gailete]

My kids liked the stroller, but I sure didn't. The handles on strollers (at least the cheap ones) don't adjust to height of the mom or the one pushing. For me to push the stroller always meant I was leaning over and it killed my back because I so tall. Same with pulling them in a wagon, the handle was too short for me.