Why don't Amish pay taxes and social security

[delister]

I heard today that Amish don't pay taxes or social security. Why don't they have to pay these taxes when everyone else does? The argument I heard is that they don't use these services, but I pay taxes for services I never use too. Is this a double standard? Should Amish be forced to pay taxes and social security like the rest of us?

[cardtrick]

Absolutely! I pay taxes for things I never use either. I should be able to opt out too, then.

[Bob B.]

I have several Amish neighbors. It's my understating that they pay federal and state income taxes, property taxes, and sales taxes. They opt out of the entire social security system, and don't pay FICA taxes.

[4theluvofgold]

I would love to Opt out of FICA and invest it myself. Knowing what I have paid I could be sitting pretty.

[bUU]

Keep in mind that they have to be self-employed to take advantage of that exemption. And the exemption came only after a clear pattern was demonstrated, within this group, that members of that religious order practically never accepted the benefits of those programs (any of them) on religion grounds, even though they had paid into them and were entitled to them. That's a reasonable set of standards to offer such an exemption, and deliberately and necessarily not one that you can opt-into precipitously.

[KTP]

Even so, there is no guarantee that one of the Amish children won't get declared disabled at some future point and collect SSD if they leave the clan. At that point it was the parent, who never paid into the SS system, that is responsible for the drain of the system by their child.

Actually on the few times I have watched Judge Judy, every single person is on SSD and yet can stand and talk perfectly. One of the greatest scams of our generation I guess.

[hamchan]

My best friend is on SSD. He can also stand and talk perfectly, but what you can't see is that he is severely mentally I'll. He hides it well in public but anyone who spends much time with him quickly finds out the truth.

[KTP]

My best friend is on SSD. He can also stand and talk perfectly, but what you can't see is that he is severely mentally I'll. He hides it well in public but anyone who spends much time with him quickly finds out the truth.

Exactly. And what if his parents had been able to opt out of paying social security taxes? Who would have born the cost of his SSD payments?

The people on Judge Judy seem to be able bodied and somewhat mentally balanced...well..as best as you can expect. There is a disabled person at our local Costco who is there every time we shop, checking the carts and signing off on the receipts when we leave. He is missing an arm, in a wheelchair, and definitely at least has a speech problem. Still is able to contribute.

[Bob B.]

Even so, there is no guarantee that one of the Amish children won't get declared disabled at some future point and collect SSD if they leave the clan. At that point it was the parent, who never paid into the SS system, that is responsible for the drain of the system by their child.

Actually on the few times I have watched Judge Judy, every single person is on SSD and yet can stand and talk perfectly. One of the greatest scams of our generation I guess.

Trust me. The overwhelming majority of Amish people pay more into government than they take out.

[ua_guy]

What is the sum of the entire US population of Amish people, anyway? How many people are we actually concerned about here?

If we're talking religion and tax exemption, let's end tax exemption for churches and other religious organizations, period.

[bUU]

Not all Amish are eligible. It is limited to certain orders that have demonstrated a pattern.

[Like2Plan]

Even so, there is no guarantee that one of the Amish children won't get declared disabled at some future point and collect SSD if they leave the clan. At that point it was the parent, who never paid into the SS system, that is responsible for the drain of the system by their child.

You actually have to pay in to the SS system in order for your survivors to get a benefit.

Link to SS survivor benefits

[KTP]

You actually have to pay in to the SS system in order for your survivors to get a benefit.

Link to SS survivor benefits

True for SSDI but not true for SSI. Children can get SSI if the parents never paid a dime into the social security system.

http://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10026.pdf

On the Amish paying more into government than they get out. This may be true, may not be true. Even though they use horse carts, they do use the road system. They do not have to post guards at night to fend off Russians, Germans, North Koreans, or pissed off Canadians. In other words, they are free to practice their religion and way of life because of the government of the United States. Try being Amish in Somalia for a few years where there is little government.

Sometimes the things you get from government are not directly related to a cash handout...

[hamchan]

Exactly. And what if his parents had been able to opt out of paying social security taxes? Who would have born the cost of his SSD payments?

The people on Judge Judy seem to be able bodied and somewhat mentally balanced...well..as best as you can expect. There is a disabled person at our local Costco who is there every time we shop, checking the carts and signing off on the receipts when we leave. He is missing an arm, in a wheelchair, and definitely at least has a speech problem. Still is able to contribute.

You are comparing apples to grapefruits. My husband is blind, severely anemic and has mobility issues and still works full time, but mentally and neurologically he is "normal". My friend, I love him dearly, but he makes Howard Hughes seem well adjusted.

[KTP]

You are comparing apples to grapefruits. My husband is blind, severely anemic and has mobility issues and still works full time, but mentally and neurologically he is "normal". My friend, I love him dearly, but he makes Howard Hughes seem well adjusted.

Ok well your friend is not one of the people I am talking about then. He sounds like exactly the type of person SSD was meant for.

The people on TV, unless they are acting, do not seem like typical physical or mentally disabled people.

You can go online right now and find tons of websites describing ways to cheat the SSD system and get benefits.