Trumpcare?

[Singuy]

The dirty little secret is that ALL Obamacare plans are high deductible plans now.

Because of this statement, I went onto the exchange just to take a look for Florida, which is NOT a medicaid expanded state.

Someone who is 59 making 39k/year

I got the following. There are 8 plans with deductibles under 1000, and 4 without deductibles.

Estimated monthly premium

$765.97
Was: $1,191.03

Deductible
$0

Individual Total
Out-of-pocket maximum
$5,000
Individual Total
Copayments / Coinsurance

Emergency room care: $350
Generic drugs: $10
Primary doctor: $25
Specialist doctor: $60

I don't see what you mean by "ALL". Can you please elaborate on this "dirty little secret"?

[TexasHusker]

Because of this statement, I went onto the exchange just to take a look for Florida, which is NOT a medicaid expanded state.

Someone who is 59 making 39k/year

I got the following. There are 8 plans with deductibles under 1000, and 4 without deductibles.

Estimated monthly premium

$765.97
Was: $1,191.03

Deductible
$0

Individual Total
Out-of-pocket maximum
$5,000
Individual Total
Copayments / Coinsurance

Emergency room care: $350
Generic drugs: $10
Primary doctor: $25
Specialist doctor: $60

I don't see what you mean by "ALL". Can you please elaborate on this "dirty little secret"?

Perhaps not technically all, but functionally all: someone making $39K a year isn't going to spend over 20 percent of his income on "Affordable" health premiums, and just for himself.

Absurd.

[Singuy]

Perhaps not technically all, but functionally all: someone making $39K a year isn't going to spend over 20 percent of his income on "Affordable" health premiums, and just for himself.

Absurd.

I agree the cost is higher than I would like...but before obamacare, this 59 yo wouldn't qualify for ANY health insurance due to pre-existing conditions....

So this person can just get his treatment and not pay...is that something you want more?

[TexasHusker]

I agree the cost is higher than I would like...but before obamacare, this 59 yo wouldn't qualify for ANY health insurance due to pre-existing conditions....

So this person can just get his treatment and not pay...is that something you want more?

Who says he couldn't qualify for insurance? What state ? Almost all states had high risk pools ...

http://www.tampabay.com/news/health/floridians-who-opt-into-the-new-federal-high-risk-health-insurance-pool/1106319

[Singuy]

Who says he couldn't qualify for insurance? What state ? Almost all states had high risk pools ...

http://www.tampabay.com/news/health/...e-pool/1106319

Did you read the article you sent me? It said the high risk pool is a temporary plan as a transition to obamacare. Prior to this temporary plan, there was nothing...in fact the first sentence of the article says so.

"Help is on the way for people who are uninsured because of a pre-existing condition such as heart disease, diabetes, cancer or AIDS — if they can afford it."

"The plan is a temporary fix that's supposed to cover this high-risk group until Jan. 1, 2014, when more permanent components of the health reform law take effect."

[disneysteve]

TH, what comes across in reading your posts is that because the ACA resulted in your plan costs going up, that means the entire program is a disaster and needs to be scrapped.

The ACA resulted in millions (20+ million) of people getting insurance who didn't previously have it. We can talk about how that is being paid for and what the effects of that are, but to suggest that this is a bad thing and needs to be eliminated makes no sense to me. The plan proposed by the new administration would result in millions of people losing their coverage again and costs going up significantly for many others, particularly those 50 and older (like me).

I'm a doctor. I work on the front lines of this battle every day. I've seen how much good the ACA has done. I've seen literally several hundred patients pour into my practice because they finally have health insurance and are now able to get treatment for things they've been forced to ignore for years like high blood pressure, diabetes, and more. Taking away their insurance puts their lives at risk and drives up ER and hospital use where they rack up bills that they never pay.

[TexasHusker]

I don't know that I've ever said it needs to be scrapped. But don't outlaw my affordable high deductible plan that suited me fine. I don't mind the gubmit requiring to buy insurance; I have a problem with the gubmit telling me WHAT type of insurance to buy.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

I think we need to consider either true free market healthcare or single payer. We keep doing this hybrid and our insurance is the worse in the world. I don't see how it can keep working. I mean we should let the market determine healthcare, but the truth is if we uncouple insurance to employment and go fully free market I would give it not even 5 years before an uprising. Mostly because if healthcare could be free market why hasn't a single other country done it?

[TexasHusker]

I think we need to consider either true free market healthcare or single payer. We keep doing this hybrid and our insurance is the worse in the world. I don't see how it can keep working. I mean we should let the market determine healthcare, but the truth is if we uncouple insurance to employment and go fully free market I would give it not even 5 years before an uprising. Mostly because if healthcare could be free market why hasn't a single other country done it?

Agreed on most.

As to your final question, most countries throughout the world have greater governmental influence over the ENTIRE economy. Obama was working hard to convert the U.S. economy to a more Euro-style one, in which the Feds have much more regulation, oversight, and control over the exchange of goods and services.

Few countries have airlines that are not government owned. Few countries have colleges which are not government owned. Few countries have media which is not government owned.

Most of the world heavily leans toward socialism.

[disneysteve]

I don't know that I've ever said it needs to be scrapped. But don't outlaw my affordable high deductible plan that suited me fine.

I never really understood the terms of the ACA that required companies to stop offering existing plans. What was the deal with that anyway?

There is an inherent problem with high deductible plans, though. They encourage people to delay treatment since they have to pay for it out of pocket. I know that my wife and I have both delayed getting things taken care of since we went on the HDHP last fall. Now that our new insurance is in effect, we will be catching up with the stuff that we put off during that time.

[TexasHusker]

I never really understood the terms of the ACA that required companies to stop offering existing plans. What was the deal with that anyway?

There is an inherent problem with high deductible plans, though. They encourage people to delay treatment since they have to pay for it out of pocket. I know that my wife and I have both delayed getting things taken care of since we went on the HDHP last fall. Now that our new insurance is in effect, we will be catching up with the stuff that we put off during that time.

Your first point has always been my issue. The government shouldn't be in the business of mandating copays etc.

As for number 2, we go to the doctor regularly for checkups etc. But providers often do not make this easy with bills that are either erroneous or way over-inflated. We negotiate fees ahead of time. No deal? Then no deal!

[disneysteve]

Your first point has always been my issue. The government shouldn't be in the business of mandating copays etc.

I agree, except for with government plans, of course, like Medicare and Medicaid.

As for number 2, we go to the doctor regularly for checkups etc. But providers often do not make this easy with bills that are either erroneous or way over-inflated. We negotiate fees ahead of time. No deal? Then no deal!

I guarantee you are in a small minority. Most people, when faced with paying for care out of pocket, will forgo the care as long as possible and only do stuff that is absolutely necessary.

[hamchan]

Perhaps not technically all, but functionally all: someone making $39K a year isn't going to spend over 20 percent of his income on "Affordable" health premiums, and just for himself.

Absurd.

You will when your alternative is an early and unpleasant death. You will when your average annual medical expenses add up to over 500,000 without insurance. Some of us don't really have a choice.

[hamchan]

I never really understood the terms of the ACA that required companies to stop offering existing plans. What was the deal with that anyway?

There is an inherent problem with high deductible plans, though. They encourage people to delay treatment since they have to pay for it out of pocket. I know that my wife and I have both delayed getting things taken care of since we went on the HDHP last fall. Now that our new insurance is in effect, we will be catching up with the stuff that we put off during that time.

Many of cheaper plans sold prior to the ACA lacked coverage for certain things, had annual and lifetime limits on payouts, etc. People weren't allowed to keep these plans because they were no longer compliant with the minimum coverage requirements in the ACA.

[TexasHusker]

You will when your alternative is an early and unpleasant death. You will when your average annual medical expenses add up to over 500,000 without insurance. Some of us don't really have a choice.

No one except the uber rich has a choice; we all need health insurance. What I don't like is the gubmit coming up with Gold, Silver, and Bronze, and all other individual health policies are henceforth illegal.

That's not right.