What is your view on giving, tithing, etc.?

[PrincessPerky]

I figure my percent on net.. because nothing comes out pre tax (nothing offerd thru the company)

[Aleta]

Gruntina: Thanks. I asked because so many people base their percentages differently. In the book 'ALL YOUR WORTH' by Elizabeth Warren, her percentages are based on net worth. I think it's better to use the gross to see even what percentage of your taxes you're paying out of your gross. You're doing a great job.

[PrincessPerky]

Gruntina: Thanks. I asked because so many people base their percentages differently. In the book 'ALL YOUR WORTH' by Elizabeth Warren, her percentages are based on net worth. I think it's better to use the gross to see even what percentage of your taxes you're paying out of your gross. You're doing a great job.

Oh my I think I am mad enough at the govt without seeing the cold hard numbers!

[Aleta]

I know what you mean but when you know the numbers, you look at your taxes differently. One of the reasons that advisors like passive income is that you don't pay social security on it, just income tax.

[ActYourWage]

Gruntia: Do you base your %;s on your gross or net take home pay?

My wife and I base our %s on our gross pay. Giving that is.

[Scanner]

I'll admit, this is one of the factors that prevents me from joining a church - I am not quite sure how to work it into the budget.

So, I figure it's not fair for me to "take" from the church and not "give" so I just don't consume religious services at their own financial peril.

[ActYourWage]

I'll admit, this is one of the factors that prevents me from joining a church - I am not quite sure how to work it into the budget.

So, I figure it's not fair for me to "take" from the church and not "give" so I just don't consume religious services at their own financial peril.

You can join a church and the choice to give back in way of money is your choice and that is between you and God. If you came to my church and I knew you didn't give, I wouldn't look at you any different. I'd just be glad you were there!

[cschin4]

Tithing really isn't about the church. It is about yourself. God doesn't need anyone's money. However, tithing is an act of obedience and faithfulness. In OT times, they sacrificed the best and firstborn animal as act of faith not knowing if they would ever have another animal. Regularly giving a portion of the income you have now is the same thing. People sometimes think they will give "when". When they are Bill Gates style millionaires, etc. But, in reality, givers are givers throughout their lives. And, misers are misers know matter how much they have. Giving a portion on a consistent regular basis is an act which encourages one to give. And, if you can't give happily and cheerfully, then the tithe means nothing and is of no consequence to God.

[Joan.of.the.Arch]

I do not have a formula for giving. I do not give to a worship community, though the charitable work that I give the most money to is faith-based.

I really do not count all my giving in money terms. There are little services I can often give it to people who cannot afford it by the usual means. Sometimes it does cost me money to give in this way. For example, I will give "taxi" rides to people. All sorts of people for all sorts of reasons. I once had a regular date with an old man who was in the Salvation Army program to get off alcohol. I drove him to his chemotherapy appointments and back "home" to the Salvation Army center. It wasn't part of an organized program on the part of wither the hospital or the Sal Army. A friend of mine who is a social worker was aware of the man's unmet need and asked me to do it, so I did. I also have taken a woman with no income to appointments for laser surgery (funny-- Medicaid was paying for eye surgery but not for the eyeglasses she would need.) I've driven people to work regularly until they could get enough money to buy a car. Twice, I drove a woman to a chiropractor who offered free care to a indigent people. That was another situation where a friend asked me to help out someone I did not previously know. I've taken people to the grocery store regularly or just sporadically. I see ownership of a car as a blessing that should be shared. I have a heart for the poor and one of the biggest problems of the poor in my city is transportation.

Having a spouse with a decent income gives me the ability not to have to work for a living. I spread that blessing by being available to others who do not the luxury of time to take care of some pretty important things. And I believe that is just as important as giving money. There are all sorts of things I do along those lines. I went to city hall a couple weeks ago to get an affadavit showing inheritance of property neighbors who were really pressed for time. I taught a young man to parallel park so that he could get a driver's license, even arranging to borrow an automatic car for him to learn on and take the test with as mine is standard transmission. With the driver's license and his aunt's 1984 Honda, he was able to get to his first year of community college. Today I spent a couple hours with a 3 year old who speaks no English but whose parents both work. I will spend a lot of time with her in the next months to help transition her to daycare as her visiting grandparents must leave the country in a couple months. It used a gallon of gas to go there and back, plus I bought a couple little things to catch her interest in order to begin to gain the trust of this reserved little girl who has already been majorly uprooted twice in her life.

You know, some of that sort of giving means you become a friend of someone you did not know before or barely knew. As you make friends, it becomes something you just do for a friend, maybe a friend of a sort you never dreamed you'd have. Then, it is hard to call what you do an act of charity. So, if you were keeping accounts on your giving (10% of gross or whatever), you'd have to delete that from the column of "Giving" wouldn't you? And you'd have to take on more to meet the 10% goal....No. I do not keep count of my giving. I do not budget for it. (I've said here before that I am one user of this forum who does not budget at all.) And I do not write out a check at the end of the year to top it up at 10% of gross or any other number.

Yes, I do give to beggars on the street and parking lots, but that has not happened for a while. I know a lot of people think that is wrong, but I do not....I give to an investigative/educational effort regularly, though I admit not as often as the solicit....I drop money in the Salvation Army buckets in winter.

I don't know. I have no real policy, but I find lots of ways to give both money and time personally, and that is my preferred way. I prefer to address the needs I personally see.

[maat55]

[QUOTE=Joan.of.the.Arch;179514]

Yes, I do give to beggars on the street and parking lots, but that has not happened for a while. I know a lot of people think that is wrong, but I do not....

I heard an expert on the radio one time say that it's not good to give beggers money, but that you could give them bussiness cards to the local shelters. What they truly need will be provided there.

[Scanner]

You can join a church and the choice to give back in way of money is your choice and that is between you and God. If you came to my church and I knew you didn't give, I wouldn't look at you any different. I'd just be glad you were there

ActYourWage,

Thank you, but I don't think it's about how you or anyone else would look at me(In fact, I'm sure of it). I just don't think it would be ethical of me to sit in church, consume the seats, space, air conditioning, the time of the pastor and not pay my way for that.

I know you say, "Well, we don't care." but I think that's being a bit disingenuous when probably 10-20% of worship services are dedicated to collections (whether passing up the little basket or a lengthy sermon on tithing or outside enrollment in tithing).

I am reminded of a Simpson's episode that poked fun at my own occupation. Homer's back goes out and he goes to the chiropractor. The chiropractor says, "Don't worry, Homer. . .everyone thinks that we are going to recommend you come back 3x/week for a long time. I assure you it's not that way at all. Now lay down on the table so we can get you on a schedule to come back next week."

LOL.

It's the same way with church and tithing. "I assure you we only want to tend to your spiritual needs. Now. . .come next week for my sermon on tithing."

That Simpson's episode, thru it's witty humor, taught me to just be open about my practices, as I think the church's, temples, and synogogues should be open about theirs and not apologize or hide the fact they want 10%.

I think they are inadvertantly doing a "bait and switch."

Anyway, until I can figure out how I can work 10% in, I think it's just fair to everyone that I not be a "freeloader."

10% would represent about $10,000/year. . .more than we contribute to retirement (although if we max our Roth's and 401(k), it should top that this year). . .it's hard to figure out how to work that in.

So. . .for now, the best thing I can do for charity is continually strive not to end up as one.

I have thought since I am a bit of a "miser" during my lifetime, of bequeathing 10% to charity and 30% each to our 3 kids to atone for my life spent as a miser

[Gruntina]

ActYourWage,

I just don't think it would be ethical of me to sit in church, consume the seats, space, air conditioning, the time of the pastor and not pay my way for that.

I know you say, "Well, we don't care." but I think that's being a bit disingenuous when probably 10-20% of worship services are dedicated to collections (whether passing up the little basket or a lengthy sermon on tithing or outside enrollment in tithing).

Anyway, until I can figure out how I can work 10% in, I think it's just fair to everyone that I not be a "freeloader."

When I first attended church, I did not tithe for a few years. Church is going to continue to 'work' regardless if new person or member is tithing or not. That is not the point of the church and church has been around for a long time and nothing will change that.

Church is not like a public theme park where you have to pay for your rides. It is open to anyone of all kinds. Granted there are good and bad churches but both are always around if you search.

I tithe now because I want to give more and more along with services and enjoyment of gathering friends for fun, fellowship, ministries and missionaries. I love what I do and the life I have. If you are a believer, God only wants you to give yourself and accept you as you are.
I just find the more I give into my relationship with God, there were more opportunities and things happening in my life that keeps popping up. Every person has different needs and gifts so there are no clear cut rules.

A true gift is to love or give and expect nothing in return. There are churches that offer their service without expecting finance in return. They are happy to see you. You should not have to feel like you must give something to receive anything either otherwise you might have your joy stolen away.

But because God is the center of my life instead of just a small part of my life, this is why I include tithe in my budget as one of the top priorities hence the question the OP was asking. It does not mean it is right for everyone but it just works for me at the moment.

[disneysteve]

That Simpson's episode, thru it's witty humor, taught me to just be open about my practices, as I think the church's, temples, and synogogues should be open about theirs and not apologize or hide the fact they want 10%.

Synagogues work differently than churches in this regard. Typically, synagogues have a set dues structure. In most, all members in the same category pay the same dues, though I have heard of some that base your dues on your income. In ours, for example, there are set dues for single adults, single parents, families with no school age children, families with school age children and senior citizens (I think I'm missing a category or two on the list but you get the idea).

That said, there is also a confidential system in place for those who are unable to afford full dues. When we first joined, we were on a reduced payment plan. I had just finished school and had over 100K in student loans and was just getting started in my career and we had just bought our first home. We didn't have lots to spare for synagogue membership. But as the years went on, we gradually increased what we paid until we got up to full dues. Now we pay full dues and make various extra donations throughout the year, which indirectly helps subsidize those who aren't currently able to pay full dues.

Synagogues don't pass a plate around at services. Donations are done more privately than that. Yes, there are fund drives at certain times, but others don't see what you've given (or haven't given).

[PrincessPerky]

I know you say, "Well, we don't care." but I think that's being a bit disingenuous when probably 10-20% of worship services are dedicated to collections (whether passing up the little basket or a lengthy sermon on tithing or outside enrollment in tithing).

Then you are going to the wrong church.........

Seriously, I don't go to church because I paid to be there (the AC is on regardless of my attendance) I go for me, and my children. I like to learn about God, and I love to sing the songs. The folk to talk to are pretty cool, and the occasional food is a bonus.

weather or not my piddling giving is 1/500th of the church costs is beside the point. I give some of what God has given me back.

I started with a dollar a week, for my son to put in the basket, maybe 5. maybe a quarter. oddly enough I was never without something for him to put in....guess I never was that broke

[LivingAlmostLarge]

To the person who said cynical people need to go to church. I never went to church because back when we were broke they expected my mom to tithe. She didn't. I still don't think she's going to hell and neither am I. Here's my post on what she did here.

She stopped going to church and she began giving back. I do too. So it's not about the giving.

I read NeedtobeDebtFree and he rarely has money for extras. And yet he tithes, and everytime I suggest giving in time and effort he ignores the suggestion. I wonder what his family and him (JW Thornhill) are learning about tithing? That you give to look good instead of giving them time and learning to be selfless? And have true faith????