Do you know someone who just "doesn't understand" money and spending?

[disneysteve]

A paystub will generally show a 401k loan. But it will only show the amount of the payment deducted for that pay period, and the total amount deducted for the current year. It doesn't show how much the employee has already paid off, or how much more they owe.

But at least if a lender sees the paystub, he would know to ask about that loan. A lender who doesn't require paystubs wouldn't have a clue.

[St. Theresa]

Once upon a time, I was a shopoholic. I was given credit at the mature age of 18 and charged things which were NOT necessities. A night off from work was the worst thing I could have. It meant shopping, going out to eat, etc. I eventually learned that the satisfaction of new things did not compare to the agony of debt. The "newness" soon wears off, while the debt festers and grows.

That said, I've also been in situations where I had to use credit cards for cash advances to pay the mortgage. Bad, I know, but the threat of losing one's home creates desperation.

That said there ARE people who go into debt just because they think they deserve nice things. Others go into debt because, well, just take a look at government statistics regarding income. The lower your bracket, the slower your income has increased. Only the top tiers have seen major % growth and continue to, which of course, is why the lower brackets see less.

So knowing someone's in debt is only part of the story. It's the WHY, that's important. In my case, my ex and I both worked full-time and spent very frugally. When two incomes can't support a family, there's something wrong with the wages.

[tabbycat31]

My coworker's car died this week, and she needs a new engine. She took the $$ out of her rent fund, and paid to repair the car so she can get to work.

Then on her lunch break she goes and gets her nails done.

[disneysteve]

My coworker's car died this week, and she needs a new engine. She took the $$ out of her rent fund, and paid to repair the car so she can get to work.

Then on her lunch break she goes and gets her nails done.

The phrase "little leaks can sink big ships" comes to mind.

[tabbycat31]

she's maxed out on all her CCs and wants to cash out her IRA to buy her 17 yo a car. And she works in a bank with me. I wish she would talk to our financial advisor (even though he's an investment guy, he may help her get out of debt)

[docstudent]

Dido! I have a good friend and mulitple family members that make poor financial decisions and expect other people to bail them out of their self-created nightmare. I've learned to say, no, sorry, I can't help you! I have loaned out over $12,000 in good faith to my family over a five year span of time and I have not received a penny in return. People will use- and those people may even be your family---Being an enabler is not the solution to resolve poor money management........

[rob62521]

My husband's brother and his wife are kind of odd when it comes to money. When their mom died, they inherited some farmland and the property where she lived and a little money. I'm not talking big money, just a few thousand. Bro wanted to sell the house and property for big money, but instead of waiting for probate and paying bills out of the mom's checking account, he wanted his money NOW. We did wait until probate (thank goodness for a lawyer who could explain to him the importance of that), but after probate, my husband did give him half of the money and told him since he refused an offer on the property, he could buy him out. Three years later, bro did sell the property for big money, but in the meantime had cancelled the liability insurance on the property and really complained about paying the increasing property taxes. He and his wife spent part of the money and put the rest in savings. However, it seems that all the money they had. This came out when a few months later the wife decided to divorce him and he didn't have enough money to give her what her half of their house would be worth. He was retired and said he would have to get a job, but could my hubby please agree to sell his half of the farmland so the whole lot would be bigger so he could pay off his soon to be ex-wife? My hubby agreed and although we did OK on the sale, as soon as that was agreed upon, they no longer wanted to be divorced. They sold their house, the farmland, and moved to another state. Their new house cost every penny they gleaned from the sale of their house and farmland and he's now working there because he can't afford to live there on his pension and her small social security. He claims they have no savings now, but they have a newer house and they bought it with all the furnishings.

I know it's their life, but their actions effected ours. My husband sold the family farmland he didn't want to sell to "help" him out and although we did fine by it (well, until we have to pay capital gains taxes anyway), his bro's decisions really didn't help. I think in a year or so, bro will be calling wanting money because they won't be able to live in their 2000+ square foot house on their five acres because his pension, her social security, and his job won't pay for it.

[b4freedom]

My whole family is bad. None of them get it.

For example, this is how my mother pays bills. Let's pretend she has 5 bills:

$5000 credit card debt with $125 due.
$175 electric bill
$180 monthly insurance payment
$70 phone bill
$50 cable bill

Total due: $600

And she decides that she doesn't have enough to cover all her bills, and that she can only "afford" to pay $500 for her bills. So she'll just split the $500 between all of them and she'll send them $100 each.

It just makes my head want to explode.

Yes, she overpays some and underpays others. Of course she never actually looks at the bill to see how much interest/late fees/etc. she is paying. For example, dial up internet for $24.99 is being charged to one card with "credit protection" for $9.99. There are several problems with this. 1) She has high speed internet and doesn't even have a computer that can do dial up. Even though I tell her to cancel, she never manages to. 2) "credit prodection" isn't worth paying for, especially because she pays for it on other cards as well. 3) She has overpaid and has a credit on this account.

Again, makes my head want to explode.

I've tried several times to help her with finances. Now she won't let me because she's "tired of me telling her what to do." So, my brother "helps" her. Of course, he's completely 1000% upside down as well.

[b4freedom]

My coworker's car died this week, and she needs a new engine. She took the $$ out of her rent fund, and paid to repair the car so she can get to work.

Then on her lunch break she goes and gets her nails done.

I bet she still paid the cable bill.

[b4freedom]

That's an awfully big flaw in the credit system. Someone could owe tens of thousands to their 401k and it wouldn't affect their ability to go out and borrow money elsewhere. I wonder if there is any move to close that loophole.

There are a lot of flaws in the credit system. It's really used and abused.

[bishop]

my whole family, but my uncle in particular. When my grandfather was alive, he was having trouble taking care of my grandmother, who has alzheimer's and has had several strokes. Another uncle lived there at home with them (in the basement - in his 50"s and living in his parents basement for 10+ years), and helped out when he could. The first uncle and his wife have huge money problems, and had no where to live, so they got the great idea that they would move into my grandparent's house, and in exchange for room/board, they would take care of my grandmother (instead of hiring a personal care nurse). I told my dad as soon as I heard about it, that it was a bad idea, but no one listened to me. Long story short, the convinced my grandfather to add an addition to the house, and pay them a salary on top of the room and board.
Then, my grandfather passed away, my grandmother had to go into hospice, and my uncle and his wife moved back in with one of their kids. My grandfather's estate (which was debt free before all this) now owes several hundred thousand dollars in constructions costs, legal and medical bills, and my poor dad, being the executor, has to deal with all the headaches. To top it off, when my uncle and hi wife moved out, they cleaned everything out...food, toiletries, cleaning supplies, furniture, clothes...even the friggin mothballs. My dad was so PO'd, he said as soon as he can clear all the stuff up with the estate, he want snothing to do with his brother or his family again.

Moral of the story : have a will, and don;t help your kids out, if they are in the 50's and can't even keep a minimum wage job as a greeter at Wal-Mart.

[jasanderson]

yikes - that's awful!