Feeling isolated

[Petunia 100]

Yes, I think that is it.

BF is a member of HAGSA (Humanist Association of the Greater Sacramento Area) and they have their meetings on Sunday afternoons at a Universal Unitarian church. UU are all over the country.

[hamchan]

Petunia, I don't even know what I am interested in anymore. I have been poking around on meet-up. I haven't found anything yet that I would be available for that sounds interesting. I'll keep looking.

I probably live in the worst possible area to have friends over. It is a very central location for night life, so there is often no parking to be had. I've had friends drive around for an hour before looking for any spot and finally have to give up. So I don't try to have people over anymore. I have tried to set up times to see them at other places but lately it just hasn't been working out because our schedules never seem to intersect. Or maybe I'm just not that fun to be around anymore. I am considering that as a strong possibility.

[Petunia 100]

I probably live in the worst possible area to have friends over. It is a very central location for night life, so there is often no parking to be had. I've had friends drive around for an hour before looking for any spot and finally have to give up. So I don't try to have people over anymore. I have tried to set up times to see them at other places but lately it just hasn't been working out because our schedules never seem to intersect. Or maybe I'm just not that fun to be around anymore. I am considering that as a strong possibility.

You have serious matters on your mind. All the time, I'll bet. It's probably hard for you to let that go momentarily and have a bit of fun. But you need it, more now than ever.

[hamchan]

Yeah. You're right. I do need it. The more I think about it, I am realizing that while part of the isolation is due to not having much time, the other part is that it's self imposed. It's very hard for me to put myself out there. I feel extremely awkward in a group of people I don't know, so even taking those first steps is excruciatingly hard. I know that I need some social interaction, but the very idea of it seems a little bit horrible. I have never been an outgoing person so I tend to only make friends in cases where I am essentially forced to be around the same people on a regular basis (school, work, church when I was younger and my parents made me go).

[cardtrick]

Seems kind of disingenuous to go to church just to have people to hang out with. No matter, because I work on Sundays too. There is a local atheist group here that has some events that don't sound too painful, but they are all during my work hours as well. TBH I have found that the kinds of atheists who bother to attend atheist events are not the kinds of people I like to hang out with, but I would still be willing to try it if they ever had an event I could actually get to.

Very funny about the A.A. meetings. For the record, I am not now nor have I ever been a substance abuser of any kind.

I've located a mental illness support group I could go to sporadically. Support groups are great, and can be pretty helpful, but not exactly what I would call "a good time." Maybe not the best places to meet friends either. I have enough crazy friends.

haha, I can so relate to that. I also used to experience anxiety (it was pretty bad) when meeting new people. But I was determined to get over it. I realized quickly that once you start practicing talking to strangers, you will get over the anxiety. You might embarrass yourself a few times, but that's a small price to pay. Trust me, it worked for me. It will work for you too. Just a few weeks ago, I met this awesome French girl at the airport. We've been in touch and she's planning on visiting us next year. And we now have a place to stay at, if we ever decide to visit France. She was sitting next to me and I asked her a stupid question (just so I could strike up a conversation) and we started talking. It's very easy once you get comfortable with the idea. In the beginning, you just have to be conscious and force yourself to do it. Just practice every day. For example, at the grocery store if you see someone looking at say soup, walk over and ask them if they prefer a certain brand. Start small and build up your confidence.

I also attended an atheist group meeting and I will echo what you just said. Most of the folks I met were very "strange". Not people I would want to hang out with because they had nothing interesting to talk about and they talked way too much. I got a headache by the end of the meeting.

Consider joining Toastmasters. You can work on your anxiety issues (stage fright is very much related to this) while making new friends.

My goal for next week: Talk to this girl I see every day at the train station. She seems very reserved and thought of striking up a conversation with her seems quite intimidating, so I've challenged myself to at least give it a try. When you think rationally, chances are that she will not start yelling at you just for asking her a silly question. Worst case, she'll just not show any interest.

You've got to rationalize these things and just force yourself to do it.

[hamchan]

Seattle is a different animal. People really hate to be disturbed by a random stranger trying to talk to them. That is why I like living here. If you go to an event where socializing is expected then that's different. But you don't want to just start conversations at the grocery store because it's actually seen as rude. I prefer to be left alone when I'm buying soup, so it's totally fine with me. I mean, if someone does talk to me in public, unlike many people who live here, I will attempt to make polite conversation but I am secretly hoping that they will finish talking to me soon. It's especially horrible on the bus because you can't really get away, and too many time's I've been forced to chat with someone who is not all there.

The weird thing is that my job requires me to talk to lots of people I have never met before, and engage them and sound sincere. I do fine with it in that setting. You would think it wouldn't be so hard in social settings.

[Wino]

As to the atheists, agnostics, and non-attending believers who don't attend services and their comments above:

Places of worship tend to draw a crowd of people who are hard-working, morally upright, honest, and friendly. I have never been to any religious group that did not fit the above description. This has nothing to do with the book that the leader happens to use as his reference point for his lectures.

So, you get what is essentially a safe crowd you can socialize with. As to this possibly being disingenuous, I disagree wholeheartedly. I have a secret I need to let you in on: It's the non-believers who need to be brought in. They're actually the ones who benefit the most from being in the group. Even if you don't attend the services, you'll benefit by being around a higher quality group of people. You can work in the day care center during the services for all the group-leader cares. And maybe after a while, you start to wonder, "Hmm.... maybe all these nice people who've been so friendly and helpful get that way from something they learn from that guy up there in the front with the book. I wonder what he says that has this effect." And the next thing you know, you're actually listening to a few of those lectures from that guy up front.

The point is that you'll see good examples much more commonly than you'll see bad examples in any given religious group as compared to the population as a whole. You don't have to agree with that statement, but I don't think you can reasonably dispute it. Note that I didn't say that all religious people are better people than all non-religious people. Go hang out with MS13 or some meth users or go down at the pool hall to see what other social groups are doing when they aren't around the group. There are a lot of dregs in the society, and this microcosm tends to avoid religious worship, if only because they like to sleep in on the weekend. By the way, if the place of worship can get these dregs inside it, they're welcome to come as long as their intentions are not nefarious.

I guess the disingenuousness is really those of us who try to "sucker you in" to seeing what's going on inside the place of worship by suggesting you socialize with the group as a whole. For those who disagree, that's OK, too. If we all believed the same thing, they wouldn't need to paint cars different colors.

[Petunia 100]

Prime example of the exact attitude many prefer to avoid.

[hamchan]

Petunia, I was going to say the exact same thing. I guess all of my non religious friends are meth heads and pool hustlers. I'll let them know, since they seem to be unaware.

[hamchan]

I went back and reread my OP because I was pretty sure I mentioned that I was raised a Christian and thus have had plenty of opportunity to test drive religion. I am a former PK. My dad is a retired minister. My parents are lovely people, and we went to a lovely church. I still keep in touch with many of the other congregants and I truly adore them. I tried for most of my life to have a personal relationship with Jesus and be a good Christian. I wanted to fit in with my friends and my family. I prayed. A lot. I read the Bible. No matter how much I sought out God and His truth, it always felt hollow to me. Eventually I really just had to be honest with myself, that I was merely in it for the potlucks and game nights. I felt like a fraud. Coming clean about who I really am was not easy for me. I disappointed my friends and family. I broke my parent's hearts. My dad still blames himself, and that kills me. Because my parents are the real deal. They walk the walk in every way. They did nothing wrong. I have the utmost respect for the beliefs of others, but they're not my beliefs, and that is OK.

[Wino]

And Matthew Henry weeps.

[disneysteve]

Folks, nothing wrong with recommending getting involved with religious groups as a social outlet. I did that myself. But it is NOT okay to criticize or insult those who choose not to do so for whatever reason. Religion is a personal choice and we don't all make the same choices in life. So lets move away from the religious discussion.

MODERATOR STEVE

[Wino]

I don't think I insulted or criticized anyone in my responses. I truly think religious groups are at least as good as the other groups I mentioned. If any of the "SA powers" think any of my responses are out of line, by all means, delete them! The last thing I'd want to do is demean, insult or denigrate anyone who is looking for a way to develop necessary social contacts.

In my defense, my original post suggested not only church, but many other social outlets whose pursuits might be counter to the ideals of many religious people. I guess I've just found religion to be so helpful to me that I cannot help but recommend it to others who might be conceivably helped by it.

Again, if I was out of line, I apologize, and ask that the posts be deleted with prejudice.

[Wino]

SVery funny about the A.A. meetings. For the record, I am not now nor have I ever been a substance abuser of any kind.

I apologize if it seemed I was indicating you were an abuser or recovering abuser. I have found that friends of Bill whom I met to be supportive of me trying to improve myself, no matter what my obstacles might be. My only objective was to help you find groups that are healthy, not just "social." I apologize for any aspersions this might have cast unto your character.

[MonkeyMama]

I don't think I insulted or criticized anyone in my responses.

Um, you did.

It's not the suggesting church that crossed the line. It was the last lengthy post is what was very insulting. We don't need to beat a dead horse, we can move on, and I thank you for apologizing. But we do wish you understood what you were apologizing for. & I look at these type discussions as an opportunity to educate. Most atheists have been raised in the church. It's hard to live in the U.S. and not have had a lot of exposure to the church. We generally have pretty sound reasons why we are not interested in that outlet; have already been there and done that.