Feeling angry about others' debt woes

[BuckyBadger]

Some people of all income levels are good savers. Some people of all income levels are poor savers. It has nothing to do with how MUCH you make (in general, of course, if you REALLY do make barely enough to survive, it is certainly hard to save) only with how good you are with money.

But everyone has weaknesses. You let your boyfriend stay with you rent free to the tune of almost $4,000 a year. Consider someone who makes ten times as much as you - to him, being foolish with money in the range of $40,000 is the same as you with your $4,000. These sorts of things scale. (Your hypothetical person who makes $4,000 a month is probably grossing just under $60,000. To that person, $8,000 worth of poor choices would be equivalent to yours.)

Sure, if someone makes about $26,000 a year (like you, my estimate based on your post and an estimate of your taxes) it's crazy that someone can "waste" so much money. But to them it's very similar as the money that you waste in your budget.

It's a lot more productive to try to increase your situation that fret about how other people aren't living up to their potential. None of us are perfect. And who's to say that your foibles are less bad than someone else's, just because the dollar value on yours is lower?

Like Steve, my husband and I save a large percentage of our money and then don't worry about how we spend the rest. I'd say that we're "lucky" to have enough income that we can do an "anti-budget" like that, but it's not just luck. We chose a path and we stuck to it an now we are enjoying the fruits of our labor. That path involved a lot of hard work at the outset with the payoff of well-paying jobs in the end.

[theduc]

I'm sure they can justify their behavior too: "I can't go though again what I went through with my last used car. Repairs, unreliable, breaking down all the time, stuck on a highway... all the horrors. So I am not willing to take a risk again. So it is cheaper overall really to buy a brand new car under warranty. Sure it costs me, but I know what I'm getting. So they will just defend less than optimal choice, because they feel like that's what they need and that's what makes their life better. So here is your explanation.

The same justification in Nika's example could be put to comparison with your roommate situation... "I can't go through again what I went through with my last roommate/used car/house/insert expense here... Repairs, unreliable, breaking down all the time, etc..." Often the "solution" is to NOT make the smarter financial decision out of fear of the past. These are times when we think with our hearts and not our brains... if that makes sense.

[phantom]

I can't say it really bothers me when other people are careless with their money. As long as they're not asking me to pay for their mistakes, people can be as careless as they like.

Of course, I am definitely a little baffled by people who earn more than I do and are still in financial messes. But, at the same time, I imagine that if I could switch off the part of me that cares about my financial future, I could easily end up in a mess. It might take some work for me to blow through what a top-paid pro-athlete makes at first. But, I imagine that if I thought my supply of money seemed endless but was actually finite, I could accidentally overspend at any pay level.

[greenskeeper]

I can't stand when people bitch about money problems when it is THEMSELVES who made those choices to put them in that position.

"Not my fault, blame someone else" is the new motto nowadays.

[dunnrobert700]

I only get angry when I acknowledge that somehow, some way, on aggregate, I'm going to end up being the among the net losers for being responsible and making sacrifices and my government is going to force me and those like me to bail out those who indulged themselves.

[NetSkyBlue]

I only get angry when I acknowledge that somehow, some way, on aggregate, I'm going to end up being the among the net losers for being responsible and making sacrifices and my government is going to force me and those like me to bail out those who indulged themselves.

Everyone whose home is now devalued because of others' buying more than they could afford and then subsequently losing their homes is in that boat, I guess.

I just shake my head... My not-so-very-money-savvy little sister is getting married this month. Quitting her job, and moving 1000 miles away with no new job lined up. Her fiance is in the Navy. They have no savings, but he gets a housing allowance of $2400 a month. They're going to buy a house in Florida, with nothing down on it. I asked what she's going to do in a few years when he's transferred to another base. She thinks they'll just rent it out and buy another house somewhere else. I ask what happens when their renter turns out to be a bum and she needs to evict him/her whilst living on the other coast (potentially). She thinks "that won't happen to me." Sigh.

[Tonyall]

I remember the first time it really hit me how insane so many people are with money was when I was in the military. So many guys that made as much, if not more, than me would be broke within a couple of days of payday (if not earlier). It was just nuts how irresponsible so many people were.

I made some money out of it loansharking though.

[Petunia 100]

Oh he does contribute to utilities and groceries, as well as doing most of the housework and virtually all the laundry. It's just the rent (of which, half would be $362.50) that he is unable to afford. And I'm not willing to go through what I went through with my previous roommate. I really didn't come in here to defend my boyfriend, but FWIW, it would cost me more money and time if I lived alone.

That really wasn't my purpose in posting, I'm sorry. I was just appalled that people can burn through multiple thousands of dollars on things like dinners out, new clothes, booze, the latest gadgets, etc. How do they not meet their savings goals in no time flat? And how is it that they want all those frivolous things more than they want to meet their savings goals?

Oh, it's just the rent he can't afford? That makes it a bit difficult to rent your own place, no?

You're blowing through multiple thousands of dollars a year, too. You're choosing to spend it on your adult boyfriend, someone else chooses dinners out and new clothes.

That is your choice to make, but recognize that it is your choice to prioritize supporting your boyfriend over meeting your savings goals.

[Baby_nurse]

Oh, it's just the rent he can't afford? That makes it a bit difficult to rent your own place, no?

You're blowing through multiple thousands of dollars a year, too. You're choosing to spend it on your adult boyfriend, someone else chooses dinners out and new clothes.

That is your choice to make, but recognize that it is your choice to prioritize supporting your boyfriend over meeting your savings goals.

Bingo. You are the one who is making the choice to float your boyfriend's half of the rent rather than meeting your goals. Being upset about how much someone else makes or spends is pretty pointless.

[Grigory]

This kind of situation is something I like to call SEP: Somebody Else's Problem. The First Amendment applies in many ways to many people. They have the right to choose how to live their lives, so it's their burden and theirs alone.

There are over 7,000,000,000 people on this planet. You can't save them all, not even if you try your damnedest. Just let them be and enjoy your own life.

[cascade11]

How much is the OP saving for retirement? I'd say that is a far more important issue than trying to save for a house downpayment. I'd keep renting and socking away money for retirement and let that money grow for me first, before saving up for a house.

[MaraJadeC]

While I do feel bad for folks who make choices that will ulitmately leave them in an insecure position, there is little I can do about it, so I try not to let it worry me.

My thoughts exactly. I have my own life to think about.

[NetSkyBlue]

How much is the OP saving for retirement? I'd say that is a far more important issue than trying to save for a house downpayment. I'd keep renting and socking away money for retirement and let that money grow for me first, before saving up for a house.

I have 5% of my income being transferred into a 401k, with 4% employer match, and employer "discretionary" lump sum deposits once or twice a year. I have had this for 7 years and am fully vested. I know this is still on the low side for retirement, but I do look at a house as part of my retirement savings. I want to have a fully paid-off home to live in, hopefully with plenty of appreciation, that I can sell and use to move in to a smaller place, or care facility, should I need to. I'll be 30 this year, and expect to be 38 before I will have saved $50k for a downpayment.

If I get a 15 year mortgage, I would have it paid off at age 53, if not before. I know I can't put it off too much longer, if I want to be young enough and healthy enough (and still working) whilst having the mortgage. Having a mortgage payment in my 60s doesn't really appeal to me. Even if I can't yet retire fully, hopefully not having a mortgage payment will allow me to work less in my later years.

[Petunia 100]

I have 5% of my income being transferred into a 401k, with 4% employer match, and employer "discretionary" lump sum deposits once or twice a year. I have had this for 7 years and am fully vested. I know this is still on the low side for retirement, but I do look at a house as part of my retirement savings. I want to have a fully paid-off home to live in, hopefully with plenty of appreciation, that I can sell and use to move in to a smaller place, or care facility, should I need to. I'll be 30 this year, and expect to be 38 before I will have saved $50k for a downpayment.

If I get a 15 year mortgage, I would have it paid off at age 53, if not before. I know I can't put it off too much longer, if I want to be young enough and healthy enough (and still working) whilst having the mortgage. Having a mortgage payment in my 60s doesn't really appeal to me. Even if I can't yet retire fully, hopefully not having a mortgage payment will allow me to work less in my later years.

Is the 50k a 20% down payment in your area? Does it represent more?

What sort of home is that in your area? Are you looking for a nice 2 bedroom condo? A 3/2 SFH? A fixer-upper? A McMansion?

[NetSkyBlue]

Is the 50k a 20% down payment in your area? Does it represent more?

What sort of home is that in your area? Are you looking for a nice 2 bedroom condo? A 3/2 SFH? A fixer-upper? A McMansion?

50k represents 30-40% down. I would be looking at homes in the 120-150k range, which are mostly 2 bed, 1, or possibly 2, bath "starter home" type houses, in respectable parts of town. 99k - 115k might get you a condo or townhome, which I am not interested in. Most middle-upper middle class families in my area live in homes in the 200-300k range. You might spend 80-90k on a run-down house in a poor neighborhood, but I don't want to live next to neighbors with rusted-out cars on the front lawn, either. Or deal with cracked foundations, being in a flood zone, caving-in roofs, or other problems that homes in those economically depressed areas have.

The reason I want to put down more than the standard 20%, is because I don't think I could afford payments on a 15 yr mortgage on a loan greater than 100k, especially not with any hope of paying it off early.

The way I see it, I only have a few options for low payments:

1) Buy a cheaper property at only 20% down. Maybe if I'm really lucky, I'll find something just under the low end of my scale, but honestly most properties that I would consider acceptable to live in fall within this range.

2) Take out a longer mortgage. Undesirable, given how old I'd be when I pay it off, not to mention the interest!!

3) Put down more money in order to have a smaller loan. Really, 100k is the most I can afford payments on, without some great change to my financial situation.

ETA: my ideal property would be a 200-300k home outside of town, sitting on 2-4 acres, but I do realize that's not within the limits of my finances.