Argument against individual health insurance

**disneysteve** · 07-29-2009, 06:58 AM

There is no possible legislation that can fix an absence of personal responsiblity. All the drunk driving laws, for example, don't stop people from tanking up at the bar and then hopping behind the wheel. I've always said that you can't legislate away stupidity.

Of course, one could argue that this is a point in favor of a universal healthcare system that covers everyone since people would have coverage no matter what.

**Joan.of.the.Arch** · 07-29-2009, 07:00 AM

I read that entry and then the two classified as "insurance." I did not come across anything to say they had chosen not to insure the wife. I saw no explanation at all. Maybe you remember it from previous blog entries?

But yeah, there are people going to ERs all the time who have no way to pay the bills. Some get admitted and will have even more bills they cannot pay. Bummer...for us all.

**disneysteve** · 07-29-2009, 07:14 AM

Originally posted by Joan.of.the.Arch View Post

there are people going to ERs all the time who have no way to pay the bills. Some get admitted and will have even more bills they cannot pay. Bummer...for us all.

Yep. I often find out patients of ours went to the ER for some minor problem that could have been handled in the office, but the patients don't feel bad about not paying the hospital bill. They see it as some big, faceless corporation. They do feel bad about not paying us because they have a personal relationship with us so it is more awkward to not pay.

**LivingAlmostLarge** · 07-29-2009, 10:17 AM

Part of the problem is that people don't feel bad using the ER and not paying like DS mentioned.

I don't know why they chose not to insure. I think it was "i'm young and healthy and never go to the doctor."

**zetta** · 07-29-2009, 10:24 AM

I get tired of hearing a particular conservative commentator saying everyone has access to healthcare because they can go to the ER. The ER isn't going to treat you for something like breast or prostate cancer.

**LivingAlmostLarge** · 07-29-2009, 11:34 AM

nope, also if you go into the ER to give birth and have complications, I'd like to know whose picking up the bill other than the government and tax payers money anyway?

**Joan.of.the.Arch** · 07-29-2009, 02:04 PM

I've wondered why more people don't go to those urgent care/doc-in-a-box places if they either a) cannot get a quick appointment with their regular doctor, or b) don't have a regular doctor and/or insurance. Certainly there are people who could afford such clinics, but who go to a hospital emergency room instead. Is it just that people don't really know about them? Are their just too many situations the urgent care centers won't deal with?

**disneysteve** · 07-29-2009, 02:09 PM

The urgent care centers handle a limited number of problems, but I'd say the biggest deterrent is that they are expensive and you have to pay at the time of the visit. At an ER, that isn't the case. Even a private doctor may not require immediate payment if you are an established patient. If folks had the money, they could just see their family doctor.

**irmanator** · 07-29-2009, 03:56 PM

our urgent care center has a cheaper co pay than er. But I guess that wouldn't matter if you don't have ins.

**LivingAlmostLarge** · 07-29-2009, 04:28 PM

Urgent care where I live requires a physician referral! WTF?

I think the minute clinics in CVS might work.

Also I gotta say DS, it's possible we could legislate stupidity. We could make it a law that people need insurance. BUT how many people would rebel?

**Seeker** · 07-29-2009, 05:07 PM

Originally posted by LivingAlmostLarge View Post

nope, also if you go into the ER to give birth and have complications, I'd like to know whose picking up the bill other than the government and tax payers money anyway?

We pay the bill too, in the form of increased costs. I think I read somewhere that 15-20% of our premiums are used to support emergency care for the uninsured or those that cannot pay.

**wincrasher** · 07-29-2009, 05:16 PM

Very, very few people are CHOOSING not to insure. A friend of mine sells health insurance. If you can't get in a group policy at work, then you better be pretty healthy to buy your own. And it ain't cheap. Any pre-existing conditions, chronic conditions, overweight, smoke, too old and you are denied coverage or the premium is so high it's out of reach. Even if you are supposedly cured of a condition, such as a breast cancer, it's too bad, they won't cover you at all. I think that's why alot of people stick with jobs they hate, because of the uncertainty of getting new insurance.

Many employers are also not subsidizing their health coverage to employees. Even though it's available, many folks can't afford family coverage. A guy I work with pays $700 a month for himself, wife and 2 kids. And that's subsidized by his company.

My plan is pretty good. I have my own policy. I had to prove I was absolutely healthy, colesterol, blood pressure, etc. and had no prior illnesses of any kind. My premium is $105 per month, $5000 deductable. 100% coverage above that number. They'll drop me though in the year following my first claim.

**LivingAlmostLarge** · 07-29-2009, 06:49 PM

Yep don't get sick. If you have any preexisting conditions forget getting private self insurance. Never insured.

You can't force people into things they don't want to do. And not all people are ignorant or stupid, they make a calculated gamble they don't need insurance.

**markusk** · 07-29-2009, 07:06 PM

I know a lot of folks here are into personal responsibility in terms of eating right, not smoking, etc which can lead to health complications down the road, however there are many many instances people get sick just out of pure bad luck, bad genes, etc. Even if you have "good" insurance through work, how long will your employers allow you to miss work? 3 months? 6 months? What if you needed 1 year of rehab? Can any of us be certain that we will still have a job and thus continue to have health insurance?

Really feel for the blogger. Thankfully the wife and child seem to be fine.

Argument against individual health insurance