Upscale restaurants are downscaling

[disneysteve]

Great line, simplyme.

cschin4, I don't disagree with you. There is something to be said sometimes for fast and cheap (just talking about food here ). And there are certainly expensive places that aren't at all worth it. In general, though, you simply can't compare the food quality, service or overall experience of a good, chef-owned, independent fine restaurant to that of a franchised chain like Chili's or Friday's or Houlihan's. I'd much rather pay $60 for a memorable meal than $30 for one that I'd rather forget.

[GREENBACK]

I would also say that a lot of mom and pop restaurants can be very good though not fancy or expensive by any means. I've eaten at some places that had a great rep only to be disappointed in the food. If I eat at a mom and pop place at least you don't pay an arm and a leg if the food isn't good.

I'm a meat and potatoes guy so I tend to seek out places that give me bang for the buck.

[disneysteve]

I would also say that a lot of mom and pop restaurants can be very good though not fancy or expensive by any means.

That's also true. We took a trip to York, PA a few months ago and ate at a number of local places. None were fancy or expensive or upscale. Mostly diners and such. But they were family owned and operated, had friendly service and good food.

[Scanner]

I agree on the Burger King comment.

I am a burger connoisseur (or I like to think so and also buffalo wings) and I would rate Burger King up there, in probably top 5 of my favorite destinations for a Burger. There is a local grill around here who has the best.

When Red Robin opens up, I am trying them.

I do think 5 Guys (an East Coast Chain supposedly known for burgers) was overrated although my son like the fries in peanut oil. I guess they had a lot of hype to live up to.

PS: Applebees wings are pretty good. . .I'll give them 4 out of 5 stars - the meat is just right, the breading is low, but the sauce has a hint of sugar which I don't like.

PPS: As far as McDonalds. . .I have to say that depends on the restaraunt you go to. In my town, we have 3 alone - 2 standalones and 1 within Walmart. The one in Walmart is terrible. The other one we go to, the service is inconsistent. The one a little further away - never really had a bad meal there. However, the McTasty is really not that great of a burger and a poor competition to the Whopper. I recommend the Quarter Pounder or my favorite, the Double Cheeseburger for $1.00, now $1.39. They also make a good grilled chicken club.

How's that for "slumming", LOL?

Actually, if you like fries, you really can't beat McDonalds. I like them but my dietary lifestyle really prohibits me from seeking them out. Another reason I like Burger King - the Apple Fries.

[disneysteve]

Actually, if you like fries, you really can't beat McDonalds.

They do have the best fries (not counting NJ shore boardwalk fries).

I don't eat at McDonald's, but once or twice a year I get a craving and go for an order of their fries and a milkshake.

I must say, though, that we had lunch there when we were in DC last summer (they were in the museum we were visiting) and I had one of their premium salads and was really impressed. It was quite good.

[tulsa_sr5]

Disneysteve, npr had a bit about this last week, focused on restaurants in the DC area that had seen a big slow down in people dining there on expense accounts trying to move the menu to loweer prices and pull in locals. Stuff like using the front legs off rabbits to get a little more meat and keep prices down.

scanner - I haven't tried applebees wings, but 4 out of 5 seems really high!!!! i love wings, and most wing only places are lucky to get 4 stars from me. Any breading at all knocks them down to 2 stars tops.

[cschin4]

What's wrong with slumming? I don't see a problem with it? I eat what I like. I really don't care if it meets someone's criteria for Food Channel or not. There is nothing "unhealthy" about eating an Arby's roast beef sandwich or a hamburger. At Wendy's, my kids can get that with mandarin oranges or yougurt and a glass of milk on the cheap.
As for fries, I don't care for fast food fries. I love, love, the crinkle fries they make at the Little League Concession stand. I look foward to that at the start of every ball season!

[m.f.walters]

I can speak to this as a restaurant owner. We are chef-owned independent with upscale style food, made from scratch, but keep our menu prices under $13.00 And that's HARD!!! We are constantly on the search for interesting cuts of meat that we can make delicious and keep our margin. We are doing a lot of braising right now. But we are really struggling with overhead- trash service is unbelievably expensive and getting worse. Health insurance for our employees is going up another 15% next month, and don't even talk to me about electric rates in New England! I'm sure most diners don't even consider how much weather costs a restaurant-every snowstorm reduces sales and costs a fortune in snow removal and salting. And since all the frugals on this site like to take food home to eat later, add in the cost of takeout packaging (that frequently is forgotten on the table anyway!).
I could go on.
The chains fight the same battles, but get savings in volume.
Be kind to the independents. We work hard to put out great food at affordable prices and still try to make a living like everyone else. Now if the food or service is bad, take your money elsewhere. But my motto in this economy is to support the independent business person, be it food, tires, or clothing. We all need to support each other. If it costs a couple bucks more to do that, I think it is worth it, to keep our neighbors businesses open.

[m.f.walters]

Oops, forgot to mention that 2 upscale and expensive restaurants downtown are offering $5 lunches just to keep the staff happy and food turning over. I know they're losing money to do that though. We haven't had to do that. (yet!)

[LivingAlmostLarge]

mfwalters, where in New England are you? I haven't seen any cheap "mom and pops!" A night out at a non-franchised place for my DH and I run $15-20/entree in Boston, so a night out runs us easily $60 tax and tip, more if my DH has a beer.

FWIW, we dined out an organic place last night and it was good, but $30 for takeout for 2. So the food was fresh and you could taste the real cheese local to the area, no prepackaged stuff, but I would not call it cheap.

Also most restaurants in the New England area have been raising prices, $1 each year. And portion sizes are shrinking fast.

We avoid eating at chain restaurants even if we are on vacation. One execption? McD for breakfast. Somehow I love their breakfast sandwiches. But we never eat there otherwise.

I love burgers. But I can do better at home. Only during the winter when grilling is impossible. If only we still lived in 72 year round and could grill at year! We used to never eat out burgers, etc.

[Scanner]

Tulsa,

I haven't detected breading on the Applebee wings but the sauce has a little sugar as I noted, thus the downgrade to 4 out of 5 stars.

We have a local pizza joint in town where the guy actually grew in Buffalo - he is the only one who gets 5 out o 5 stars. I am afraid though he may be going out of business with the economy.

[GREENBACK]

Only during the winter when grilling is impossible. If only we still lived in 72 year round and could grill at year! We used to never eat out burgers, etc.

It was a little insane maybe or might have been extreme cabin fever but I grilled steaks outside last week and it was 15 degrees below zero F. Was a little tough to be patient but the steaks turned out good.

[Goldy1]

I prefer medium priced places. I don't like the idea of buying frozen food ie. I imagine stuff like chicken fingers or mozzeralla sticks at a chian restaurant are just deep fried boxed crap I can get at Sam's.

I know by not ordering drinks restaurants aren't making too much off me, but there are so many costs down to that pat of butter you put on your bread

[Bernz]

I have not seen any closing of upscale restaurants where I am at, which is the Western suburb of Chicago. In fact, I even mentioned to my wife the other night during our dinner at one of the restaurants that there seemed to be no slowing down of these type of restaurants as the place were packed that night.

[disneysteve]

I've seen a couple of upscale places close, but I don't know that it is related to the economy. I think it is just part of the normal cycle. The restaurant business is tough. Styles come and go. A place can be the hot new joint one year and fall out of favor the next year even though nothing has changed.

New restaurants are always opening in our area, even now. Two chain seafood restaurants recently opened on the same stretch of road and an excellent independent Greek seafood restaurant down the street closed soon after. Even though the Greek place was far, far better than either of the two new places, they just couldn't compete with the big bucks backing the chains and the instant name recognition. But none of that had anything to do with the economy. The new places aren't any cheaper (one is probably more expensive) than the place that closed.