Flu vaccines or global warming?

[GREENBACK]

I'm 44 yrs. old and in very good shape. I've had what military doctors diagnosed as "Some type of flu" in 1983. I was seriously sick for two weeks and went to the ER twice. They said to rest and you'll be fine. I eventually was fine but it was a horrible 2 weeks. I guess it was some form of bird flu(prevalent strain that year) but can't say for sure. Oddly enough, I've had virtually zero illnesses since then beyond a minor cold or something.


I haven't taken a flu shot to this day. I certainly believe in it for the elderly and others with weakened immune systems though. I have lots of skepticism when it comes to the gov't and I don't buy into the global warming argument as it's presented from a govermental perspective.

I will likely take the shot one day but will not buy into climatological junk science, based on a very young model of human history, ever. So many idiots with too much education and too little real world brain power try to convince us that the sky is falling and we fail to look to the sky to see if it's really happening. This somewhat applies to beliefs about H5N1 and global warming. I think it's all just another phase in human history.

[zakity]

The guys and I don't do the flu shots. DH does some years. The guys and I won't be getting the H1N1 shot. I don't feel like it has been tested enough. I feel like it was rushed out and that scares me. But, on the other side of things, we are all extremely healthy. We rarely get sick.

And, we are one of those families that the childhood shots affected adversely. One of my children was developing normally. He was a baby and was saying a few words (ball, mama, dada). He got a shot and within two days, all he said was "ugh". He had to go through three years of speech therapy and OT. He has some developmental delays and still has some speech issues. So, you can tell me over and over that the shot doesn't really cause that, but, you know, it happened to us.

[MonkeyMama]

I am kind of with Greenback here, hehe.

Flu shot - no - not getting them

Global Warming? - I don't know

Fact is, there is so much out there about how ineffective and useless flu shots really are. For that, I don't see the point of the risk. I wouldn't say, "The flu shot is too risky." But no, I don't see the point of getting stuck with a needle, and being exposed to viruses and chemicals, for no good reason. I'd say, "I don't see the benefit."

Global Warming? I believe the earth is getting warmer. Beyond that I don't believe mankind has a clue. Is this bad? Would reducing CO2 emmissions hurt us more than help? (Yes, it could! Scientists have proven it can hurt more than help). Do humans have a good track record "playing God?" Don't we have a long history of solving one problem, while inadvertently creating many more problems?

Which leads me to a point. We are big on recycling and reducing energy usage. Is it because we believe in Global Warming? Pffft. It's because we believe that resources on earth are limited. I wouldn't assume everyone who was "green" was green for the sole purpose of global warming. In my opinion, people who believe that reducing emmissions will reverse global warming, and save the world, are idiots. If only the Earth was so simple! I don't mind reducing emmissions so I can breathe clean air though. There are plenty of valid, tangible reasons to go Green.

For that I am sure I could easily be judged to fit into the mold of "anti-flu shot, pro-global warming." But reality is I think there is a lot of hype out there and most people don't think much beyond what they are told.

[GrimJack]

Flu vaccines have been around for about 40 years now so I am not sure how anyone cans say that the H1N1 is untested (er, you take the virus, infect a bunch of eggs, remove and kill the virus, then load a bunch of hypodermics with the dead virus - Yes, this is a simplification but...). Correlation does not imply causation - kids 'get' autism that were not vaccinated.
The sad thing about the H1N1 flu is that the people who die from it have no warning; they get sick and are dead within 72 hours.
Getting the flu shot is not just for yourself, it is also for 'herd immunity'; so you get sick and take 2 weeks off but so do the people you infected and the people they infected.
W/r/t the mercury content of the shots - you get way more mercury in tuna fish and almost all other fish you eat than you would get in a lifetime of vaccinations.

Global warming is causing serious problems - 70% of Montana's lodge pole pine forests are dead because the winters no longer kill enough of pine beetle to keep them under control. Similar things are happening to all the pine forests (fortunately, much of the forest around our cabin is spruce so we are only going to have to take down 40 trees or so but it is going to look pretty naked).

[PrincessPerky]

Recently read a history book saying 'Norway was warmer back then"...looked into some other historic documents. Seems the worlds temperature has been fluctuating for some time. And yes some trees, animals, ect have suffered quite a bit. Who is to say that is not a normal part of life? would we all be better off if the dinosaurs had not died out?

Not that I have any intentions of stopping any green practices I can manage. recycling, reusing, reducing consumption, composting, and such are all habits that are obviously good for my family. (oh and others)
The long term(as in years, not 10day forcast) weather predictions of recent day are generally wrong, by several degrees. Not that there will be no ramifications, weather has always been a major factor in human death. And there is much good man can do to keep weather at bay (leave the sand dunes on beaches alone to act as buffers against sea storms) But getting all into a panic over the world just causes folk who can look at the big picture to assume the fear mongering idiots know nothing.

Instead of fear tactics, we aught to be looking at local ways folk are effected. Don't tell Joe schmo that using electricity will make the world hot in 2050, tell him the coal burning plant is putting out pollution RIGHT NOW, that is bad for him to breath. That is what got tons of filters in the PA area (no longer the dirty city)

Anyway, point is, the far distant future is uncertain, the immediate effects are easy to see, and prove. Maybe we could bring the out of site issues to folks minds, rather than trying to incite fear over unproven science theories.

On the vaccine, it is mostly just the flu, but I am glad of all that fear hype, less folk are sending their kids to the day care with fevers dosed up on Tylenol to buy themselves 4 hours to work. More folk are actually washing their hands like mom said, and less folk are going to work in spite of the flu. Some are even keeping kids home when Mom has the flu (cause kid is prolly carrying) But no I prolly wont get the vaccine myself.

[cptacek]

As for the vaccine, I think the problem was that it was hyped so much as a completely different flu. People are used to the regular flu vaccines being for 3 different strains for the year, but they expect the people who make the vaccines to have experience with doing that. But then, here comes H1N1! Completely different! Much deadlier! AAGH!!! So naturally, questions start popping up as to "did they do something different to get this vaccine? Are they rushing it? Do we know it is going to work? Will it make me sick?" I think hyping it so much has backfired.

[SoCoolGifts]

Great topic... Sadly the whole Global warming thing has been swept away in politics. It is good to try and save energy and people should want to do it. We should all want to be good stewards of our resources. Problem is it became political. The bigger problem is all the money and reputations tied up in it. Even with the scandal that seems to point to evidence being tampered with and that this whole warming thing is a hoax, I believe that the impact of humans on climate is not a significant factor in the temperature of the planet. I've know for years that no matter what model used by scientists they could never work it backward to accurately 'predict' what happened in the past...so how could they predict the future. The biggest flaw has always been the impact of the sun. When you can't accurately model the biggest energy source in the universe, simple logic dictates you probably don't have a handle on the problem. That does not preclude me from believing we should still conserve resources. I just don't want someone lying to me and telling me to do it.

What does this mean about flu vaccines? Again, I think this too has been impacted by politics. Right now, big pharmaceuticals, insurance companies, medicine in general are under attack and being portrayed as villains. So the logical undercurrent of this is that the flu vaccine is somehow bad or wrong. This type of political impact is cyclical and I think this is where we are right now. As for me, I have never had a flu vaccine and probably won't take one this time either.

[Snodog]

Vaccines are wonderful and have saved many lives, and my views on global warming depend on what day of the week you ask me.

No doubt it is getting warmer but I just don't know if humans are to blame and what if anything to do about it. I've studied all the charts/stats but I still can't determine what role humans play. It is I think unknowable and the scientists are just making educated guesses. Regardless it's still a good idea to take care of the planet.