Obama or McCain

[jeffrey]

I have a challenge for everyone that has commented in this thread - to explain why you support your candidate only being positive about your candidate and not referencing the opposing candidate-

http://www.savingadvice.com/forums/general-discussion/39895-obama-vs-mccain-new-post.html

[chad]

I support John McCain because he's willing to stay in Iraq as long as it takes to make sure we win the war. I know some will say this isn't politically correct, but so be it. I'm glad he will stand up and do what is best even if people don't agree with him. That's what we need in a president - someone that can stick with a decision and not compromise when things get tough. We went and we need to finish the job no matter what it takes. If it means 50 years or 100 years like we have done in Japan and Korea, then that is what we need to do. Americans never give up.

[maat55]

I placed the other thread into the Everything Else area because it was getting way too negative from both sides and definitely wasn't money related (you can go there if you want to continue the negative discussion about the two candidates). It's obvious that a lot of people have very negative views of the opposing candidate. That being said, I think that a discussion of the candidates is positive for those still trying to decide. We'll see if this little experiment will work to help keep out the rhetoric and emotion.

If you like either of the candidates (or any other candidate), feel free to post here why you support your candidate, but all posts have to be positive. No posts are allowed about what you don't like about the opposing candidate.

This should be an interesting experiment and I wonder if people can support their candidate as strongly as they enjoy bashing the other candidate...

I originally started this thread based on its tax aspects and how they might affect our personal finances. But as you have stated, it has gotten way off base. Feel free to lock it.

[JimInOK]

I guess I fail to see the difference in the two threads. My only contributions were not negative, but the discussion either belongs in this forum or it doesn't. How does only positive discussion of a topic belong here, while anything negative regarding the exact same topic does not?

[sweeps]

I stand by my argument that the ability to communicate, inspire and motivate is much more important than any issue that the candidate claims to support.

Candidates often change their mind on issues -- either for the right reasons or the wrong reasons. Remember "Read my lips, no new taxes"? And as I also pointed out, Congress makes the laws, the President doesn't. If you have a pet issue, lobby your Congressmen.

[jeffrey]

I guess I fail to see the difference in the two threads. My only contributions were not negative, but the discussion either belongs in this forum or it doesn't. How does only positive discussion of a topic belong here, while anything negative regarding the exact same topic does not?

This board is a positive board. It's here to help people make decisions to better their finances. There is rarely any negativity even when people don't agree. Unfortunately, that is not the same as with politics and I do not want this forum to turn into a lot of other forums where negativity rules.

The important aspect here is to give information about the candidates and what they will do so that those who have not decided can make an informed decision. Unfortunately, "why I don't like the other guy" posts are often not portrayed fairly which I was seeing on both sides in the other thread. You can achieve the sames things being positive (why you support your candidate) without the mudslinging that is an unfortunate part of today's politics. If people can't remain civil toward the candidates just like we expect people to remain civil to each other here, then the discussion will be ended just as it would for any other topic.

It's really not that difficult of a request. If nobody has anything positive to say about the candidate that they support, this thread will die out quickly.

[genchan]

maat55

I just wanted to say thank you for changing the first post on this thread when the information was presented. A lot of people wouldn't have on the other forums I frequent.

[genchan]

I support Obama for his work on women's rights:

He has an excellent record for women's rights with a 100% approval rating Planned Parenthood and NARAL for the last three years. He also has an excellent record in supporting women in other ways:

Obama Passed Law to Help Combat Violence Against Women.

Obama co-sponsored a bill that would authorize increased appropriations for FY2006-FY2010 for grants to combat violent crimes against women, revise provisions specifying purposes for grants to include use for under served populations and for forensic medical exams of sex offense victims, increase set aside amounts for grants to Indian tribal governments and U.S. territories and possessions, prohibit law enforcement officers, prosecutors, or other government officials from requiring sex offense victims to submit to a polygraph examination as a condition for proceeding with an investigation or prosecution of a sex offense. The bill would establish a sexual assault services program, directing the Attorney General to make grants to states, territories, and tribal entities for rape crisis centers or other programs and projects to assist those victimized by sexual assault, culturally specific community-based organizations for various services on behalf of sexual assault victims, and state, territorial, and tribal sexual assault coalitions. The bill would also award grants to accredited schools of medicine to develop interdisciplinary training and education programs that provide health professions students with an understanding of, and clinical skills pertinent to, domestic violence, sexual assault, and dating violence. [109th, HR 3402 (S. 1197), Passed by Unanimous Consent, 12/16/05; PL 109-162, 1/5/06]


Obama Passed A Law To Create The Victims Economic Security And Safety Act(VESSA), Which Helps Victims Of Abuse Seek Treatment Without Losing Their Job.

Obama was the chief sponsor and voted to created the Victims' Economic Security and Safety Act. The bill provided that an employee who is a victim of domestic or sexual violence, or who has a family or household member who is a victim of domestic or sexual violence, may take leave from work to address domestic or sexual violence by seeking medical attention or obtaining health or legal services. The Chicago Tribune reported, "But VESSA, as it is known, allows time off for personal issues not covered by the FMLA and is designed to help victims keep their jobs." Obama said he sponsored the bill after being approached by several advocacy group for battered women. "They came to me and indicated how difficult it is for victims of physical and sexual abuse to deal with the repercussions of an assault and then try to balance it with work and everything else." [93rd GA; HB 3486; 3R P 58-0-0, 5/20/03; Signed into law 8/25/03, PA 93-0591; Chicago Tribune, 8/20/03; University Wire, 8/22/03]


Obama Passed Law To Increase Penalties For Repeat Domestic Offenders.

Obama was the chief co-sponsor and voted for House bill providing that domestic battery or a violation of an order of protection is a Class 4 felony if the defendant had a prior conviction for certain enumerated offenses, including first degree murder, aggravated domestic battery, and criminal sexual assault. A person commits stalking if he or she has been previously convicted of stalking another person and knowingly (on one occasion) follows that same person or commits certain threatening acts against that person or that person's family. [92nd GA; HB 4081; 2002; Signed into law 8/22/02, PA 92-0827]


Obama Passed Law To Increase Penalties For Committing Battery In Or Near A Domestic Violence Shelter.

Obama was the chief co-sponsor of and voted for bill providing that a person commits aggravated battery if he or she (or the person battered) is in a domestic violence shelter, or if the person battered is within 500 feet going to or from the shelter. [92nd GA, SB 0175, 3/29/01, 3R P; 55-0-0; P.A. 92-0516, 1/1/02; 91st GA, SB 1406, Session Sine Die, 1/9/01]

Obama Passed Law Improving "No Contact" Court Procedures in Domestic Abuse Petitions. Obama helped amend the Civil No Contact Order Act, including simplifying the forms for filing a petition.

The law allows for the court to appoint counsel to represent the petitioner if the respondent is represented by counsel and changes what a civil no contact order may contain. [93rd, HB4395, 3R: 57-0-0, 5/5/04; PA 93-0811, 7/26/04]

Obama Passed Law Requiring Clear Language be Included in Emergency Orders of Protection.

Obama co-sponsored and helped pass a law that requires the government be specific about the restrictions placed on the recipient of an emergency order of protection. This legislation prevents perpetrators of domestic violence from claiming ignorance of the law. [93rd GA, SB2495, 3R: 57-0-0, 3/25/04; Concurrence: 53-0-0, 5/26/04 PA 93-0944, 8/17/04]

Obama Passed Law Raising Standards Related to Domestic Violence.

Obama sponsored a bill and voted to amend the Nursing Home Care Act and the Hospital Licensing Act to require licensees under those Acts to comply with standards relating to domestic violence established by the Joint Committee on Accreditation or other accrediting organizations approved by the Department of Public Health. [91st GA, SB0850, 1999, PA 91-0163, 99-07-16]

Obama Passed The Dru Sjodin National Sex Offender Public Database Act of 2005.

Obama co-sponsored a bill that would require the Attorney General to make publicly available in a registry via the Internet, from information contained in the National Sex Offender Registry or in state sex offender websites, specified information about sexually violent predators and persons convicted of a sexually violent offense or a criminal offense against a minor, who are required to register with a minimally sufficient state sexual offender registration program; and allow registry users to identify offenders who are currently residing within a specified radius of a given location. Requires registry information to include the offender's name, address, date of birth, physical description, and photograph, the nature and date of commission of the offense, and the date on which the offender is released from prison or placed on parole, supervised release, or probation. Linda Walker, Dru Sjodin's mother, said that Dru's Law "is a step in the right direction, but more work needs to be done to protect women and children. 'I think it has to stay in the forefront of our nation's agenda.' she said." [109th, S. 792, Passed by Unanimous Consent, 7/28/05; Referred to House Subcommittee, 9/19/05; Aberdeen American News, 10/6/06]


Obama Passed A Bill To Protect Children From Known Sex Offenders.

Obama co-sponsored a bill to improve the national program to register and monitor individuals who commit crimes against children or sex offenses. The bill would require the Attorney General to maintain a National Sex Offender Registry at the Federal Bureau of Investigation, as well as a National Sex Offender Public Registry. The bill would also require adults or juveniles who are convicted as adults of sexually violent offenses, certain offenses against minors, or other specified crimes (covered individuals) to provide specified information to designated persons in their domicile, work, or school states for the rest of their lives (with specified exceptions). The bill would require such an individual, initially and thereafter as specified, to register with and appear before such designated persons to provide identification, home, work, school, and vehicle information and to have a photograph and fingerprints taken. [109th, S. 1086, Passed by Unanimous Consent, 5/4/06; Held at desk, 5/8/06]

Obama Passed Law Expanding Rights Of Alleged Victims of Sexual Assault.

Obama sponsored a bill and voted to amend the Criminal Code of 1961 to eliminate the 48 hour time requirement after the collection of the sample in which an alleged sexual assault survivor must return to the hospital performing the sample analysis of all controlled substances and alcohol ingested by the alleged victim a signed written authorization in order to have the sample analysis performed. [93rd, HB4771, 2004, Third Reading: 5/19/2004, PA 93-0958 8/20/2004]

Obama Passed A Law To Make Administering A Date Rape Drug Aggravated Battery As Well As An Aggravating Offense To Criminal Sexual Assault.

Obama sponsored a bill and voted to amend the Criminal Code of 1961 to provide that administering a controlled substance to a person without his or her consent for nonmedical purposes constitutes aggravated battery. The bill provided that delivering a controlled substance to a victim without his or her consent as part of the same course of conduct as the commission of criminal sexual assault or criminal sexual abuse is an aggravating circumstance that enhances these offenses to aggravated criminal sexual assault or aggravated criminal sexual abuse. Further amends the Criminal Code of 1961. [90th GA, SB 1224, 3R P 54-0-0, 3/24/98; HA 1 Concur P 55-0-1, 5/20/98; PA 90-0735, 8/11/98]

Obama Passed A Law to Expand the Definitions of "Sex Offender" and "Sex Offense" and Mandate Offender Disclosure.

Obama sponsored a bill and voted to amend the Sex Offender Registration Act to include in the definition of "sex offender" a person who is convicted or adjudicated for a sex offense under the Uniform Code of Military Justice. The bill included in the definition of a "sex offense", a 3rd or subsequent conviction for public indecency or a conviction for custodial sexual misconduct or permitting sexual abuse of a child if these offenses are committed on or after the effective date of this amendatory Act. The bill provided that the sheriff shall disclose sex offender information to the boards of institutions of higher education or other appropriate administrative offices of each non-public institution of higher education located in the county where the sex offender is required to register, resides, or is attending an institution of higher education. [92nd GA, HB 5874, 3R P 55-0-0, 5/7/02; Adopt CC Report P 54-0-1, 5/31/03; PA 92- 0828, 8/22/02]

Obama Passed Law to Require EMS For Sexual Assault Survivors To Include Coverage For Emergency Contraception.

Obama was the chief co-sponsor and voted for adding, as an additional criterion for IDPH approval for a hospital's plan for emergency services for sexual assault survivors, that the plan must provide sufficient protections from the risk of pregnancy by the sexual assault survivor. Bill requires that hospitals providing such services develop and implement protocol that ensures that each sexual assault survivor receives medically and factually accurate information about emergency contraception. [92nd GA; SB 0114; 2001; Signed into law 7/25/01, PA 92-0156]

Obama Passed a Bill Eliminating Good Behavior Time For Sex Offenders.

Obama sponsored and passed a bill to amend the County Jail Good Behavior Allowance Act by stipulating that any convict may not receive time off for good behavior if he has been incarcerated for sexual assault or aggravated sexual abuse. [91st GA, SB 0485, 3/11/99, 3R P; 54-1-2; P.A. 91-0117, 7/15/99; Senate Floor Transcript, 3/11/99, p. 74]

Obama Passed Law to Extend Statute Of Limitations On Certain Sexual Offenses.

Obama was the chief co-sponsor and voted for bill extending the statute of limitations for several criminal sexual offenses, including aggravated criminal sexual assault. [91st GA; HB 0329; 1999; Signed into law 8/11/99, PA 91-0475]

Obama Sponsored Illinois Senate Version Of The Bill That Would Seal Sexual Assault Victim's Records.

Obama sponsored a bill that would amend the Criminal Identification Act to provide that the victim of criminal sexual assault, aggravated criminal sexual assault, predatory criminal sexual assault of a child, criminal sexual abuse, or aggravated criminal sexual abuse, may request that the State's Attorney file a petition with the trial judge to have the court records of the case sealed. The bill provided that, upon order of the court for good cause shown, the records may be made available for public inspection. [91st GA, SB 943, 1999, 3R P 58-0-0, 3/23/99, Total Veto Stands, 11/18/99]

SB 943 Was Amended To Include The Exact Bill Language Of HB 854 Before Obama Signed On As A Sponsor.

Obama was the chief co-sponsor of and voted for SB 943, which would amend the Criminal Identification Act to provide that the victim of criminal sexual assault, aggravated criminal sexual assault, predatory criminal sexual assault of a child, criminal sexual abuse, or aggravated criminal sexual abuse, may request that the State's Attorney file a petition with the trial judge to have the court records of the case sealed. The bill provided that, upon order of the court for good cause shown, the records may be made available for public inspection. Obama signed onto the bill after the original language was amended to include the same language of HB 854. [91st GA, SB 943, 1999, 3R P 58-0-0, 3/23/99, Total Veto Stands, 11/18/99]

Obama Passed Equal Pay Act In Illinois To Give 330,000 More Women Protection From Pay Discrimination.

Obama co-sponsored and voted for the Equal Pay Act which provided that no employer may discriminate between employees on the basis of sex by paying ages solely on the basis of the employee's gender. According to the AP, the "Illinois Equal Pay Act expands the federal Equal Pay Act of 1963 to give about 330,000 more women in the state protection from gender-based discrimination in pay" by applying the law to companies that employee 4 or more people, rather than the federal standard of fifteen. Obama attended the bill signing on Mother's Day of 2003. [93rd GA; SB 0002; 2003; Signed into law, 5/11/03, PA 93-0006; AP, 5/11/03; Chicago Tribune, 5/8/03; Chicago Tribune, 5/12/03]

Obama Passed A Law To Create The Victims Economic Security And Safety Act(VESSA), Which Would Help Victims Of Abuse Seek Treatment Without Losing Their Job.

Obama was the chief sponsor and voted to created the Victims' Economic Security and Safety Act. The bill provided that an employee who is a victim of domestic or sexual violence, or who has a family or household member who is a victim of domestic or sexual violence whose interests are not adverse to the employee, may take leave from work to address domestic or sexual violence by: seeking medical attention for, or recovering from, physical or psychological injuries caused by domestic or sexual violence to the employee or the employee's family or household member; obtaining services from a victim services organization for the employee or the employee's family or household member; obtaining psychological or other counseling for the employee or the employee's family or household member; participating in safety planning, temporarily or permanently relocating, or taking other actions to increase the safety of the employee or the employee's family or household member from future domestic or sexual violence or ensure economic security; or seeking legal assistance or remedies to ensure the health and safety of the employee or the employee's family or household member, including preparing for or participating in any civil or criminal legal proceeding related to or derived from domestic or sexual violence. The Chicago Tribune reported, "But VESSA, as it is known, allows time off for personal issues not covered by the FMLA and is designed to help victims keep their jobs." Obama said he sponsored the bill after being approached by several advocacy group for battered women. "They came to me and indicated how difficult it is for victims of physical and sexual abuse to deal with the repercussions of an assault and then try to balance it with work and everything else." [93rd GA; HB 3486; 3R P 58-0-0, 5/20/03; Signed into law 8/25/03, PA 93-0591; Chicago Tribune, 8/20/03; University Wire, 8/22/03]

Obama Passed Into Law a Requirement that Women And Minority Scientists/Engineers Be Represented And Consulted on Specific Technology and Science Efforts.

In 2007, Obama sponsored an amendment, which became law, to the America Competes Act requiring that minorities and females be represented and consulted during the development of innovation/competitiveness strategies at the National Science and Technology Summit (NSTS), on the President's Council on Innovation and Competitiveness, and elsewhere. [S.Amdts. 923, Agreed to by unanimous consent, 4/25/07; S. 761, Incorporated into H.R. 2272, which became P.L. 110-289, 8/9/07]


Obama Passed Into Law An Amendment Creating A Mentoring Program For Women And Underrepresented Groups At DOE.

In 2007, Obama sponsored an amendment, which became law, to the America Competes Act that established a mentoring program to support women and underrepresented groups as they progress through education programs proposed by the Department of Energy. The amendment was included in the final version of the bill that passed Congress and was signed into law. [S.Amdts. 905, Agreed to by unanimous consent, 4/25/07, S. 761, Incorporated into H.R. 2272, which became P.L. 110-289, 8/9/07]

[zooracer]

I stand by my argument that the ability to communicate, inspire and motivate is much more important than any issue that the candidate claims to support.

Candidates often change their mind on issues -- either for the right reasons or the wrong reasons. Remember "Read my lips, no new taxes"? And as I also pointed out, Congress makes the laws, the President doesn't. If you have a pet issue, lobby your Congressmen.

The inferior mind is concerned with personalities, the average mind is concerned with events, the superior mind is concerned with ideas.

[zooracer]

This board is a positive board. It's here to help people make decisions to better their finances. There is rarely any negativity even when people don't agree. Unfortunately, that is not the same as with politics and I do not want this forum to turn into a lot of other forums where negativity rules.

The important aspect here is to give information about the candidates and what they will do so that those who have not decided can make an informed decision. Unfortunately, "why I don't like the other guy" posts are often not portrayed fairly which I was seeing on both sides in the other thread. You can achieve the sames things being positive (why you support your candidate) without the mudslinging that is an unfortunate part of today's politics. If people can't remain civil toward the candidates just like we expect people to remain civil to each other here, then the discussion will be ended just as it would for any other topic.

It's really not that difficult of a request. If nobody has anything positive to say about the candidate that they support, this thread will die out quickly.

I had a nice little chuckle to myself after reading your post.

You see, for most conservative's in this country, McCain is not really much of a choice.
In fact, after 8 years of Boosh's cooperation with the other side of isle...resulting in our largest national debt in history (and a massive debasement of the dollar)....I have converted to libertarian.

From just about everyone I have spoken with, it seems there really arent many good points about McCain.
I know for myself, the biggest reason I'm voting for McCain is because Obama scares the crap out of me

So, when involved in a political discussion about the next president, all I REALLY have to talk about is WHY I'm voting for McCain....which is basically based on a list of Obama's faults

This will basically be a "hold your nose and vote" election for me.


Given that, there is one thing I like about McCain and that is his plan to balance the budget with LESS spending/cutting the pork.

I also like his idea for more nuclear power.

[PrincessPerky]

You know if every libertarian votes for a libertarian we might have some change in the govt...

[sweeps]

The inferior mind is concerned with personalities, the average mind is concerned with events, the superior mind is concerned with ideas.

Ideas are worthless if the "superior mind" can't get them implemented.

[zooracer]

Ideas are worthless if the "superior mind" can't get them implemented.

Okay, my last response on our little side-track and I'll move on.

Getting things implemented, in my opinion, is not necessarily a good thing when it comes to the federal govt.

Getting things implemented is really what we have been doing for 8 years now, and now we have a very dangerous level of national debt. If you dont believe me that it is truly dangerous, consult with any economists with something of a reputation, and they can explain how it causing us problems and how it can only get worse.

For the last 8 years we have "implemented"...from the farm bill to the incentive checks...and in my opinion it has not been good.

We should be less impressed with how a person, or president, "communicates", and be more concerned with his/her actual comprehension of the economy, energy, global relations, etc....

I want a minimalist in office...not a used car salesman Dont "inspire" me, just stop spending my damn money!

[zooracer]

You know if every libertarian votes for a libertarian we might have some change in the govt...

trust me, I have fought over this.

Do I vote libertarian, or write in Paul, to send a message...with no chance of my candidate winning....

Or do I vote to keep socialism out of this country....

It has been a tough decision

[tifnglen]

Side note: Is there anyone that is truly Democrat or Republican? I am voting for Obama but I dont believe ALL of his views. Anyone agree with McCain or Obama even 85%?? (not trying to be negative just curious)