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How screwed is my friend?

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  • How screwed is my friend?

    A friend is starting a new job with the federal government, and has asked me for help dealing with choices related to the benefits package. In the course of helping him, though, I got the feeling that he's completely screwed. You all are smarter than I am about these things; tell me what you think.

    The Story: My friend moved overseas straight out of college in the 1980s, to work in a low-paying but rewarding job in a very expensive country. 20 years later, he was pulled aside by a fellow expat who told him, "the window is closing. You're already in your late 40s and have devoted you life to a field that you can only pursue here; if you ever hope to return to America to live, you need to do so right now and reinvent yourself before it's too late." So my friend did, getting a master's degree, and pursuing a second career -- just as the economy tanked. Finally, in 2014, he's got his first real job with prospects and so-so pay -- at the age of 52.

    The Problem: My friend has nothing. No savings (if he ever had any, grad school ate them). No retirement benefits from his two decades abroad. Not even any social security built up (except for part-time work during college and a 1-year contracting position a couple of years back, he's not been employed in the U.S. until now). No family, either, for what that's worth. Basically, he's got a music collection and a friend or two who are worried about him. That's pretty much it.

    The Bottom Line: Here he is at 52, earning not that much money (65k, but in DC where cost of living is astronomical) and with nothing saved already. Even his federal pension is likely to be miniscule; if he retired at 67, it would be unlikely to be much more than $12k/year in current dollars.

    The Question: Can he ever retire? Should he even bother taking retirement planning seriously? Or should he just get reconciled to dying in the saddle?

  • #2
    Yes, he should still take planning for retirement seriously! It is never to late to start, but I know I sure would rather have something saved then nothing. If you don't take it seriously and save something, then you are guaranteed to have nothing. He will likely need to work longer to compensate for not saving earlier.
    My other blog is Your Organized Friend.

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    • #3
      Yeah, I was being a little facetious -- I know retirement planning is always worth taking seriously. I'm just seeing this guy at 67 with a $12k pension, maybe $250k in a 401k, no property of his own, and I just don't see how he retires -- ever. Am I being melodramatic?

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      • #4
        It's true. He may never really retire, but I sure would be socking away as much money as possible, and living frugally. He'll need to do that from here on out. The more he can trim his lifestyle now the better.
        My other blog is Your Organized Friend.

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        • #5
          By saving 50% of pay, which includes learning to live frugally, most workers can retire in about 15 years.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Aristippus View Post
            The Question: Can he ever retire? Should he even bother taking retirement planning seriously? Or should he just get reconciled to dying in the saddle?
            If you fail to plan, you are planning to fail. He can certainly retire at some point, but it might take a complete mind shift with his attitude about money.

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            • #7
              It's not too late; much can be accomplished in 15-20 years.

              He simply needs to earn and save as much as he can. May want to look at living in a less expensive area, also.
              seek knowledge, not answers
              personal finance

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              • #8
                I'm curious as to why he left his overseas job. It sounds like he had a successful career there, and may have reacted to some bad advice. Is there more to the story?

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by JoeP View Post
                  I'm curious as to why he left his overseas job. It sounds like he had a successful career there, and may have reacted to some bad advice. Is there more to the story?
                  Not that I know of. The real issue was that he was just making enough to get by, so had no savings; he would not be able to return to the US upon retirement unless he wanted to live in poverty (he'd never contributed to social security), and would not have any benefits in the country where he was living (because he was not a citizen and couldn't become one). Plus I think he's someone who always thought he'd return to the US, but didn't really have a plan and suddenly realized that the opportunity might be slipping away. All that said, he's someone I'd not been in touch with for 25+ years until he moved to DC and looked me up, so I'm sure I don't know the full story. I can attest, having helped him out a bit since he got here, that he's not someone who seems to have many "life skills" and he seems utterly bewildered by the prospect of living an adult life in the US. It's been a challenge.

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                  • #10
                    It would probably be in his best interest to live some place less expensive, and possibly get a part-time job to help save up money. Maybe renting as a house mate will help as well. What is his area of expertise, and current job?

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                    • #11
                      If he can live a very low key lifestyle and save/invest the maximum in a deferred plan. The next step is learning about investing. If he is willing to do what is necessary to turn things around, anything is possible.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Aristippus View Post
                        The Question: Can he ever retire? Should he even bother taking retirement planning seriously? Or should he just get reconciled to dying in the saddle?
                        So in 20 years working overseas (and paying no taxes I assume) he wasn't able to save up any more at all? Sounds like poor choices to me.

                        If he wants to retire he needs to get a second job or a better paying job. Then live frugally and tuck away as much as he can towards retirement.

                        Hopefully he will make better choices in the next 20+ years and not blow his money away.
                        ~ Eagle

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Eagle View Post
                          So in 20 years working overseas (and paying no taxes I assume) he wasn't able to save up any more at all? Sounds like poor choices to me.
                          I don't know why you'd assume he was paying no taxes. I would assume he was paying no US taxes, but paying host country taxes -- which are far, far higher in the rest of the developed world than they are in the US.

                          And I don't know if he made poor choices. Maybe. I know he didn't have a lot of guidance or role models; he grew up dirt poor and, while he managed to put himself through college, never really had any examples of how to live any way other than hand-to-mouth. I'm not really interested in judging, since I can't imagine what it's like to grow up that way; I'm just trying to help.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Aristippus View Post
                            I don't know why you'd assume he was paying no taxes. I would assume he was paying no US taxes, but paying host country taxes -- which are far, far higher in the rest of the developed world than they are in the US.

                            And I don't know if he made poor choices. Maybe. I know he didn't have a lot of guidance or role models; he grew up dirt poor and, while he managed to put himself through college, never really had any examples of how to live any way other than hand-to-mouth. I'm not really interested in judging, since I can't imagine what it's like to grow up that way; I'm just trying to help.
                            Right, I was saying he didn't pay any US income taxes. I guess it depends on where he lived as to what kind of taxes he paid.

                            Apparently, it was poor choices and a lack of knowledege from what you described. Unless he's had some medical challenges or other things out of his control. In any case he needs to create new habits like getting on a budget, saving for an emergency, putting money towards retirement, etc.

                            Living hand-to-mouth or paycheck-to-paycheck is rough. I grew up "dirt poor" but have taken responsibility for my life and my choices in an attempt to improve my situation. While being poor and having poor role models is an excuse it isn't a good reason as to why he is middle aged and has no savings/retirement IMO.

                            On a more practical level some questions:

                            1. What kind of personal finance books have you recommended to your friend?

                            2. Is he on a budget?

                            3. Does he have an emergency fund?

                            4. Is he tracking his expenses with tools like www.mint.com ?
                            ~ Eagle

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                            • #15
                              All good ideas. He's not doing any of that yet; he's not even getting paid yet (he starts in a couple of weeks). I'm just looking for ideas right now, since we'll probably have a come-to-Jesus talk next week. Thanks for those.

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