Filing Chapter 7 : (

[noppenbd]

Not to dogpile on but...

People who do this sort of thing don't just cheat "BofA", as in some evil monstrous corporate entity, they cheat the stockholders of BofA (which is everyone who has any money in a large company mutual fund or S&P 500 index fund), and the other cardholders or account owners who may see higher fees or rates as a results of higher writeoffs.

Don't do it.

[Markwallace]

Thanks for everyone's contribution to the topic so far.

Bankruptcy is a big deal, I get that. In essence it could ruin most peoples lives. But I asked myself, what exactly are the major ramifications. There are just a few, albeit large, considerations why people are and should be so afraid of bankruptcy. Homes, Cars, and Education.

The house I am in now, I plan on staying for the rest of my life. So I dont care about being financed for a new one. It doesn't affect me, its not in my name and I pay my share of the mortgage. Cars... I have no need for a lexus or anything else. A smart buyer pays cash and they buy 2-3 year old reliable used cars anyways.

Education. If you have kids you are destroying their chances of college if you try to help finance it with a bankruptcy settlement on your credit report. 1. I dont have kids nor do I want them. 2. I think a kid should pay for college on his own anyways.

So I am curious as to SPECIFICALLY how declaring bankruptcy is going to hurt me. I dont ever want to use credit again in my life, the first thing I read or see on TV when giving out advice for saving money is DO NOT USE CREDIT...

It will take me 5-10 years to pay off this debt(doubling up payments).. all those payments, all those finance charges could instead be going right into an IRA account and a side account for a new(used) car in the future. Instead of wasting it away and never seeing it again.

So tell me, please, how exactly is bankruptcy going to hurt me. Without using generalizations like "its going to ruin your life" or "you never know if you need credit"... specifically how is it going to hurt me. I see no downside.

I realize I can get a second job, 3 jobs.. to pay it down. But I ask you why. The ONLY thing I have distilled from the community's responses so far seems to be the moral notion of "you borrowed it, so you should pay it back"... is that the extent of it? That is the final consensus why I should not go through with the process... I am not questioning the merits of such a statement, simply whether that is the basis and core of your retort.

[sweeps]

Because it's the right thing to do.
Because you don't want Karma to bite you in the a--.
Because not just creditors but also employers and insurance companies use your credit report to determine how responsible you are.
Because bankruptcy costs you in attorney fees, and filing may not be as easy as you think. You may be required to file for Chapter 13 instead of Chapter 7.
Because bankruptcy is a cost to everyone, not just the lender. That includes you.

[Markwallace]

Because it's the right thing to do.
Because you don't want Karma to bite you in the a--.
Because not just creditors but also employers and insurance companies use your credit report to determine how responsible you are.
Because bankruptcy costs you in attorney fees, and filing may not be as easy as you think. You may be required to file for Chapter 13 instead of Chapter 7.
Because bankruptcy is a cost to everyone, not just the lender. That includes you.

I pass the means test easily. I have close to 20,000 in debt, high interest and I make $9.00 an hour working. I have no assets, car or house.

Bankruptcy costs about $450 if filing alone $900 or so with a lawyer. My case is relatively simple, no business liquidation or assets. Just an individual with outstanding credit debt, so I would be filing without a lawyer.

Basically you are confirming my initial suspicions, that it's a morality play. You use words like "Karma" and "right thing to do". I am not arguing with you, those are admirable reasons. I should say we disagree as to extent of "karma" involved though. If it makes you feel better at the end of the day to make a $40 payment to a company that makes billions in profit each year, so be it. I suppose everyone has their own moral compass they must abide and live by.

[sweeps]

Then why not just go rob a BoA bank? Seriously. Under your logic they deserve it and they won't be materially affected by your robbery, so no harm, right?

Also if you have no moral compass, if you're only interested in the money, you seem to have missed my line about employers and insurance companies (and many more) that use your credit report to determine your responsibility level. You may not get that next job; your car insurance premiums may double; you may not be able to open a checking or savings account at a bank that pulls your credit report. So yes, there is a real financial effect from declaring bankruptcy even if you truly do not need credit in the next 10 years (unlikely).

[tripods68]

MarkWallace,

You seems like a very intelligent person. BK hurts you if you try to get a "real" job. Any potential employers conduct some kind of background check which include your credit history/score. I worked in the financial services throughout my career, except when I was in the military. I also hold a Series 6, Life Agent license, and Certified Notary in State of California. Each time I had to do a background investigation and finger prints in all. So if you hope to improve your career, having a clean credit history is a plus. Otherwise, no Employer that do any type of background check will HIRE you! Good Luck.

By the way, filing BK on a $15K credit balances is not a whole lot. You could make that up quickly by taking odd jobs. Just my two cents.

[Markwallace]

Then why not just go rob a BoA bank? Seriously. Under your logic they deserve it and they won't be materially affected by your robbery, so no harm, right?

That's a bit of a stretch. I believe you are getting a little to excited and carried away. Do you work for BoA?


Who said I had no moral compass? If anything I would suggest yours is a bit distorted. To have such strong feelings when it comes to such a topic as money. I wonder what you must think of the executives that pilfer millions...

I may not get a next job, my premium may rise, i may not be able to open a checking account.

Those seem like scare tactics perpetuated by an industry that gouges billions a year from low income families. I find it laughable that it is alright for BoA to loan shark these poor families, who have no choice but to use credit for houses and other necessities, yet the insinuation of someone like me not paying their debt is beyond comprehension to you. I believe your moral compass is severely out of whack. There are wars and genocide going on, famine, people dying because they cant afford a doctor(2 a day in my state as reported on national radio)... yet you are so inflamed by the suggestion of me not paying down my debt. Frankly, I consider you worse then I will ever be on the basis of morals. You clearly have some form of interest in this matter.. be it a bank shareholder or employee... and you feel like I(and people like me) are taking out of your greedy little pocket at the end of the day. I think in the end you are the one, who only cares about your own circumstances and how much money is in your account... to the detriment of everyone else around you, who could use a little much needed moral guidance.

[Markwallace]

MarkWallace,

You seems like a very intelligent person. BK hurts you if you try to get a "real" job. Any potential employers conduct some kind of background check which include your credit history/score. I worked in the financial services throughout my career, except when I was in the military. I also hold a Series 6, Life Agent license, and Certified Notary in State of California. Each time I had to do a background investigation and finger prints in all. So if you hope to improve your career, having a clean credit history is a plus. Otherwise, no Employer that do any type of background check will HIRE you! Good Luck.

By the way, filing BK on a $15K credit balances is not a whole lot. You could make that up quickly by taking odd jobs. Just my two cents.

I will never have a "real" job. So no concerns about that.

I have worked manual labor jobs my whole life so far, as well in the military. I would rather work outside then sit behind a desk my entire life where all the "real" jobs are. I don't need money, I pay next to nothing in expenses
(aside from these credit card payments which i simply have stopped paying as of yesterday), I'd rather spend my time at the park or beach after work then staying extra hours and pretending to like my boss and sucking up to clients I don't like.

Again, I am still waiting for a legitimate reason to pay them down. And no, I don't care about Bank of America's feelings. This is between 5 cards anyways, so "sweepers" precious company isn't taking the full hit. Your stock portfolio shouldn't take to much of a hit sweeper, since all you care about is yourself anyways.

[sweeps]

What is it with the trolls lately?

Mark, you obviously have your mind made up so go do it. Max out your cards, take out a few more loans, and then file. I'll forget about this in a few hours -- you'll have the next 10 years to think about it.

Bankruptcy exists for people who really didn't mean to get in over their heads. It's for people who inadvertently got into a bad situation and now need a way to start over. It's not there for you to manipulate the system and prove a point to a bank.

[bjl584]

Have you attempted to negotiate with the credit card company to see if they will give you a lower rate, or forgive some of what you owe? My Mom went through some credit trouble about 10 years ago, and she was able to settle for 50 cents on the dollar with one of her cards. I personally wouldn't run up the remaining balance on the cards before filing though. A judge will most likely see right through that, and any leniency that they would have given you will most likely be out the window. There may be something illegal about that too. Right now, you are not breaking any laws. Keep it that way.

[Markwallace]

What is it with the trolls lately?

Mark, you obviously have your mind made up so go do it. Max out your cards, take out a few more loans, and then file. I'll forget about this in a few hours -- you'll have the next 10 years to think about it.

Bankruptcy exists for people who really didn't mean to get in over their heads. It's for people who inadvertently got into a bad situation and now need a way to start over. It's not there for you to manipulate the system and prove a point to a bank.

Note: everyone who disagrees with sweeps is a troll.

[vsjhoc]

All of my debt is in the form of credit card debt. Around $15,000 or so. I have 5 cards total and most of the debt was personal products and supplies for an ill fated business I tried to get off the ground.

Bankruptcy costs about $450 if filing alone $900 or so with a lawyer. My case is relatively simple, no business liquidation or assets. Just an individual with outstanding credit debt, so I would be filing without a lawyer.

Aside from moral compasses and whether or not they have needles ... this seems inconsistent. Was it individual debt or not?

[simpleyme]

I see you do not want ethics to play into this but this line of thinking may be why you have a low paying job and no assets

about 15 years ago my friend declared bankruptcy and did what you propose her lawyer told her to charge up her cards, she went on a shopping spree, totally pissed me off as it was pure theft if you attempt this you should not tell others as they will think you a thief

I am pretty sure they changed it so that you can no longer do that ,you should ask your attorney who will of course insist that you pay up front in cash

[tripods68]

Why are you asking us why you should pay down your debt. That is your responsibility. When you make charges your credit card, you agree to its terms to pay it all back. If you are not responsible enough to pay it back then you don't deserve it to have one. It's really that simple. No one forced you to charge those bills. Now you want a legitimate reason why you should pay them down. You're making excuses for yourself. Why even come here and ask for our opinion. If you don't want to pay it down, that's on you.

I'll name some labor jobs that you could do to help you earn serious money.

-Cable installer makes somewhere $12K - 80K per year
-Carpenter $12K - $50K per year
-Lawnmower or landscaping jobs makes $5K - $24K per year

All these labor jobs pays really well if you work at it FT, which suit well to your liking. Making $9.00 an hour for a labor job tells me that you are LAZY to find a "real" labor job. Do you think Mexicans only do this type of job? Do you feel doing this kind of jobs is somewhat beyond your character? Do you still leave with your parents?

How about this, a truck driver makes anywhere between $10K - $60K plus a year, except some Employers do background check too. Maybe you can apply before your BK hits your record. Don't mean to offend or come across as judgemental ASS. But you need to stop making excuses for yourself. No one looks at themselve in the mirror except you. So try to be honest and make an honest living of yourself. Filing BK is cop out!

[Markwallace]

It was individual debt. I attempted a business and items such as a fax machine, computer, printers, etc were purchased to facilitate it during that time.

It was a home business. I was trying to start a call center to sell magazines and plastic poker chips. It was, how would you say.. 'unsuccessful'. I am in possession of several hundred thousand poker chips if anyone is interested. But I digress, the cards contain predominantly personal items.

Specifically:
Video games, plasma tv's, computers for gaming... I went to disneyworld. What else, I bought one of those vending claw machines... with the stuffed animals that the claw grabs. That was for personal use and is in my bedroom.

Sorry for the confusion as those two statements I made could have been interrupted as misleading.