Help me set a goal.

[Scanner]

I want an Endless Pool. (sweeps knows what this is - for those of you don't know I want one by now, you haven't been reading - www.endlesspools.com ).

Now. . .to be honest, this falls somewhere between the category of "home improvement" and "toy." I am personally somebody who never spends anything on myself, other than necessities, so this is hard.

They cost around $22,000 and probably comes to around $25-28,000 by the time it's done. I would probably slowly design a room around it down my basement.

Our family does need to invest in our health (oldest boy struggles with childhood being overweight as we as parents do too). So, this is a main reason I want it - for body, mind and spirit.

My questions are general, not so much specific.

1. What's a reasonable dollar amount for a goal? Should I save for the whole thing? Or 75%? 50%? 25%? Then use a home equity for the rest?

I was thinking of using JimOhio's "total portfolio" as the saving vehicle and just funding any losses that occur on market corrections. When I got halfway, probably convert to Vanguard's Wellesley fund and fund any losses.

Thanks for the help and suggestions.

[sweeps]

Hi Scanner... this is all subjective of course... Obviously the default savingadvice.com answer will be to save 100%. But it sounds like you really want an EP, you have valid reasons for installing one (health, increased home value, sole source of entertainment), and you have the responsibility to stay within your financial means. If it were me, and I had done a hard analysis of the cost and the resulting HEL payment and it fit comfortably into my budget, I would go ahead and do it.

[simpleyme]

I would save up and pay cash,thats how i bought my DH Harley ,then myself a Harley

then my car ,I would never take out a heloc,not because it debt on your home but if I have to borrow the money it means i cannot afford it

and by the way do I need to try to declare the air is good for my health and I also save a ton on gas in order to prove my wants are needs ;-)

the endless pool looks great i want one ,I had better get saving LOL J/k

[JanH]

Wow, I didn't know there was such a thing. Cool. I can see why you'd like one. What great exercise that would be.

[disneysteve]

I don't recall the specifics of your overall financial picture, but it seems to me 25K is an achievable amount for you to save 100%. I'm one who doesn't believe in financing luxury purchases and I think installing a pool would qualify. So I'd set a timeline goal and save accordingly, perhaps $1,000/month for 2 years if that works for you. If you already have money set aside that can go toward this purchase, you can shorten the timeline accordingly. Also, see if there is current savings that you can shift toward this goal for now, like money you set aside for vactions or your next car, for example. Postpone a vacation or keep your car a little longer and instead add a couple thousand to the endless pool fund.

Another thing to think about, if you haven't already, is the ongoing costs of having the pool. How will it affect you property taxes, homeowner's insurance, utility bills, etc.? What are the maintenance costs - cleaning, chemicals, service and such?

Having said all of that, I really can't argue with the answer sweeps gave above. It probably isn't the route I would take, but it is a perfectly valid way to go.

[FrugalFish]

I have often wanted one of those pools, they are so neat. I would also save 100% before buying and the reason is that I think it's often easier to save the money beforehand if it's something you REALLY want. When DH and I were reno-ing the house a few years back, we would save up money for a project and then do it. We were so motivated that we saved a lot faster than we would have paid off a loan.

That's my .02

[jIM_Ohio]

I was thinking of using JimOhio's "total portfolio" as the saving vehicle and just funding any losses that occur on market corrections. When I got halfway, probably convert to Vanguard's Wellesley fund and fund any losses.

Thanks for the help and suggestions.

what is my "total portfolio"?

[PrincessPerky]

I have often wanted one of those pools, they are so neat. I would also save 100% before buying and the reason is that I think it's often easier to save the money beforehand if it's something you REALLY want. When DH and I were reno-ing the house a few years back, we would save up money for a project and then do it. We were so motivated that we saved a lot faster than we would have paid off a loan.

That's my .02

actually I am the opposite..I can delay a want for eons, but I can't stand debt...

Though financially it makes more sense to save up..those are relatively new tech and tech gets cheaper by the year in many cases...though you would have to research the pool to see if it qualifies as tech.

Anyway a compromise might be to save up about 3/4ths and borrow half -why half, cause you will run over, but still only borrow half if you save 3/4 of the original plan...

[Scanner]

Let's see if I can dig up the ticker symbol:
PRPFX

Not Total Portfolio. . .Permanent Portfolio. . .sorry. Mix of cash, bonds, stocks, precious metals.

[jIM_Ohio]

ahh yes.

PRPFX good place for mid term investments.

[InDebtInDC]

I want an Endless Pool. (sweeps knows what this is - for those of you don't know I want one by now, you haven't been reading - www.endlesspools.com ).

Now. . .to be honest, this falls somewhere between the category of "home improvement" and "toy." I am personally somebody who never spends anything on myself, other than necessities, so this is hard.

They cost around $22,000 and probably comes to around $25-28,000 by the time it's done. I would probably slowly design a room around it down my basement.

Our family does need to invest in our health (oldest boy struggles with childhood being overweight as we as parents do too). So, this is a main reason I want it - for body, mind and spirit.

Respectfully, why an Endless Pool?

If you want to invest in your health, first please let me congratulate you on a good investment. If I may though, would you consider an alternative to this?


For example, if you all subscribed to a fitness club and spend maybe a month or so with qualified personal trainer, I think your ROI would be much higher than an Endless Pool. Some people don't believe in cross training but I do.

Or invest in a home gym. You can get a lot of equipment for less than half the cost.


As far as home improvement goes, how much would an Endless Pool contribute to the value of the house?


Don't shoot me. I'm just presenting the alternatives. Eventually you'll do what you want any way

[jIM_Ohio]

also a reminder that good health is the slowest rate at which a person can die, it's OK to indulge once in a while.

Tongue in cheek on whole thing.

[Scanner]

PrincessPerky,

Okay, it looks like I'll be coming in somewhere between 2/3rds to 3/3rds full cost. I wouldn't do a loan, probably a HELOC.

I'll set a goal of $16,500 right now (66%). I can always have you guys talk me into 100% paying for it.

DisneySteve,

Financial picture:

- 66% Home equity (about $240,000 but who knows in this market - that's based off of zillow.com)
- $100,000 in retirement money
- $15,000 for college
- Equity in business? Hard to say. Chiro. practices have tanked lately with managed care. If I had to sell my business quickly, I could probably get $35,000-50,000 for it and that's with retiring my business loan. I'd pay capital gains on that though
- No consumer debt
- No student loan debt

Yes, I should budget in energy + chemicals.

I have a real culture of swimming in my family. I was a beach lifeguard (seems like years ago - ha, ha, it was) and I want my sons to follow in my footsteps. So. . .I'd be like Coach Dad down the basement as I trained them for exercise. I'd probably swim 2x/day if I had my druthers. I would get the DW aqua-jogging. I have a nagging achilles heel injury that sort of prevents me from jogging so I'd probably actually aquajog myself. As you know, it can take about a year to heal from an achilles heel injury.

If a YMCA was close, it would be a no-brainor. But the closest one is 35 minutes away.

I think there's something to be said for not having to travel to exercise.

[Scanner]

InDebtinDC,

Home gyms are boring.

Even when I was in top athletic shape, I was never a gym rat. I would do a little bit of free weights, some dips for triceps but that was about it. Consequently, I think I'd find it hard to connect with a personal trainer in that regard. Most personal trainers are born, bred, work and die at the gym and know next to nothing about swimming for fitness.

I know from a pure physiological standpoint running + anaerobic weight training will produce the most weight loss.

But it misses the huge psychological factor - what does a person like to do? I see too many of my patients sucked into the gym on New Years Day and they get bored and have stopped going by St. Patrick's Day.

I like to swim. I don't know why but the sound of bubbles in my ears and being weightless in the water is enjoyable. I like to interval train and Fartlek train in the water, along with regular junk miles. I think I am halfway good at it too.

Running? I'm about as good as Donovan McNabb. I'll do it if I have to (to get out the pocket) but I ain't going far and fast, that's for sure.

My oldest son likes baseball. I have tried other sports but he likes baseball. My youngest seems to like soccer; he'll probably break the Scanner trend and I actually may have a runner in him.

I said to my oldest, "Fine. . .but I insist that the Scanners be good swimmers. Swimming will be your "support sport" since baseball really doesn't produce much in the way of exercise." I also offered rowing crew as an alternative but I think he'll bite on the swimming.

Anyway, that's why joining a gym isn't front and center on the table. Plus a baby is coming. . .going to gym and hanging out there is for 20 year old singletons, not late 30's, early 40's adults with kids and responsiblities.

[InDebtInDC]

InDebtinDC,

Home gyms are boring.

Even when I was in top athletic shape, I was never a gym rat. I would do a little bit of free weights, some dips for triceps but that was about it. Consequently, I think I'd find it hard to connect with a personal trainer in that regard. Most personal trainers are born, bred, work and die at the gym and know next to nothing about swimming for fitness.

I know from a pure physiological standpoint running + anaerobic weight training will produce the most weight loss.

But it misses the huge psychological factor - what does a person like to do? I see too many of my patients sucked into the gym on New Years Day and they get bored and have stopped going by St. Patrick's Day.

I like to swim. I don't know why but the sound of bubbles in my ears and being weightless in the water is enjoyable. I like to interval train and Fartlek train in the water, along with regular junk miles. I think I am halfway good at it too.

Running? I'm about as good as Donovan McNabb. I'll do it if I have to (to get out the pocket) but I ain't going far and fast, that's for sure.

My oldest son likes baseball. I have tried other sports but he likes baseball. My youngest seems to like soccer; he'll probably break the Scanner trend and I actually may have a runner in him.

I said to my oldest, "Fine. . .but I insist that the Scanners be good swimmers. Swimming will be your "support sport" since baseball really doesn't produce much in the way of exercise." I also offered rowing crew as an alternative but I think he'll bite on the swimming.

Anyway, that's why joining a gym isn't front and center on the table. Plus a baby is coming. . .going to gym and hanging out there is for 20 year old singletons, not late 30's, early 40's adults with kids and responsiblities.

I respectfully disagree. I myself am a certified personal trainer, and I know a lot of them are ignorant and don't really care about their clients at all. I will exclude those from my comments. Similarly, it would be extremely disrespectful to me to characterize you as a problematic know-it-all client. I'll just leave that alone for now.


I personally believe that cross-training is the best for your health. Cross-training includes every possible type of movement that is beneficial for you, including all the sports you prefer.

I generally dislike sport-specific training because over time, your body adapts to a certain movement and you therefore no longer reaps the benefits of your efforts. You need to trick your body by mixing it up.

I used to train with the swim team so I understand what you're talking about. The only concern I have for those guys is they need to supplement their strokes with weight training to adequately develop their opposing muscle groups. Otherwise they will be grossly disproportional = health issues.


As far as your comments about running around a gym, I've found that has not been my experience if you pick the right gym. I think most of the older people in the gym know why they're there.

The time issue I understand. Home gyms being boring I also understand.

Respectfully, not everybody is well verse is exercise kinesiology. You may know some but if you pick your trainer right you can benefit a lot from it.


I think your regimen largely reflects your personal values and attitudes. I encourage you to explore new options, even if it didn't work out in the past. It depends a lot on who's helping you.

I train everything. Sports, swimming, jogging, weights, wrestling, kickboxing, everything. I like some more than others but I try to change it up as much as possible.