The ATM in the Church Lobby

[PrincessPerky]

Agreed, DisneySteve. Our Episcopal church just began the "convenience" of online payment of pledges. It is my belief that once that begins, then ATM kiosks and credit cards can't be far behind.

I wonder if the first church to accept personal checks thought that ruind and CC cards were right behind?

I am all for ease of giving (I donate online, thru the bank) but not for ATMs in the lobby...

[momof1in150]

We have just started automatic withdrawal of pledges. We have a lot of our church population that goes away in the summer and forget to mail in their pledge. This is one way that the church can receive pledges year round. I am on our Stewardship Committee so I know how important it is for the church to receive the money that others commit to make during the year. Budgets in churches are made based on what you say you will pledge during the year.

[disneysteve]

We have just started automatic withdrawal of pledges.

I think that's a good idea. Do you pay any fee for that service and, if so, is it less than the fee for accepting credit cards?

[LuckyRobin]

Unless it is a fee free machine this smacks of usury (charging a ridiculous rate for obtaining money, usually interest, but ATM fees are close enough), and the Bible at least is quite clear about God hating usury. And it simply feels downright wrong, like when they put a soda pop vending machine in one of the back hallways of my church when I was a teenager. Some things just don't belong in church.

I have a feeling this started in what I call Warehouse churches (big space, pack 'em in, play them some enthusiastic music, take their money and send them out the door with a feel good message but no real learning).

[disneysteve]

Unless it is a fee free machine this smacks of usury (charging a ridiculous rate for obtaining money

We keep saying ATM, but we aren't talking about a cash machine. We're talking about an automated terminal where you could make donations. I think we're all saying ATM for lack of a better term.

[momof1in150]

I think that's a good idea. Do you pay any fee for that service and, if so, is it less than the fee for accepting credit cards?

It comes out to about $0.50 per month per person. I just upped my pledge by $1.00 to cover it.

[Cassandra]

We keep saying ATM, but we aren't talking about a cash machine. We're talking about an automated terminal where you could make donations. I think we're all saying ATM for lack of a better term.

That makes a huge difference!

So, just so I'm clear on this, it's like an ATM, but instead of getting cash out of it, you get a receipt for how much you donated which the church then withdraws from your account?

Cassandra

[disneysteve]

So, just so I'm clear on this, it's like an ATM, but instead of getting cash out of it, you get a receipt for how much you donated which the church then withdraws from your account?

Correct. Either you swipe your debit card to make a donation from your bank account, or your credit card to charge it (and get reward points).

I actually think it is an appealing idea being a board member of our temple. I wonder how that would go over.

[dcox20]

this seems like one of those things that is made to hype us all up - like smoking causing cancer.. bah!



lol

Why would adults get hyped up about this?
I don't understand.[/QUOTE]

See all of the posts after yours and before this one - people take their beliefs very seriously and this can be construed as a good or a bad thing by many people... that's why people would get hyped up.

I do like the idea of a donation machine vs. an ATM... there are times when I come to church without cash or a checkbook, it would be nice to be able to give when the spirit strikes without the lack of a way to do so.

Also, I like the idea of automated withdrawal of tithes - the bible says that our tithe is to from the "firstfruits" meaning it should be paid first prior to any other bills or obligations (thereby setting our priorities straight)... it also takes a bit of faith to do this especially if you don't have your tithe budgeted or you routinely go outside of your budget...

[PrincessPerky]

Correct. Either you swipe your debit card to make a donation from your bank account, or your credit card to charge it (and get reward points).

I actually think it is an appealing idea being a board member of our temple. I wonder how that would go over.

So thats what happens when you don't read the article, you miss the real point. OK so a machine to accept CC and check card donations in the lobby...I can think of a more tasteful place to put it, but hey, at least it only takes donations...do you get a double reciept so one can go home for taxes and one can go in the basket? (we do most of our donation online, but to reinforce giving for the kids they get to put something in the basket..which has to annoy the poor counters)

[Aleta]

The only problem that I have with it is that this looks and sounds functionally sound, but later the church could get into other areas.

[txex86]

Correct. Either you swipe your debit card to make a donation from your bank account, or your credit card to charge it (and get reward points).

I actually think it is an appealing idea being a board member of our temple. I wonder how that would go over.

I think that the notion of automatic drafting of bank accounts for church pledges, along with the idea of charging your credit/debit card undermines the reason I go to a church in the first place. In fact, I find it tacky that my church encourages automatic drafting. While it may be "convenient" for parishioners to have their checking account drafted or whip out their Visa or American Express on the way to the sanctuary, is this really the idea God had regarding giving to the church?

As I see it, prepayment of pledges without having to actually attend church undermines why one would attend a church to begin with.

Getting off my soapbox now.

[boefixepa]

I can see the pros/cons of it, but I'm pretty certain my church will never do it.

Each member is responible to pay their tithes and offerings and the money is turned in with a form. Each year you get a statement for your taxes. So the paper trail holds no water there.

As far as convience, I think it defeats the purpose. But that is going to vary from religon to religon. Our church makes no doubt about the requirements the Lord makes of his people and part of paying your tithes and offering is learning to do so and to do so for the right reasons and for the right purpose. I don't think it's supose to be easy or spur of the moment. It's generally the only check I have to write every month, and I simply don't see that changing. We also go in each year at 'tithing settelement' and meet with our leader and declare wether or not we paid a full tith (10%). Then we are free to talk to our leader and share any issues or concerns we have.

[Pupart]

Why would adults get hyped up about this?
I don't understand.

See all of the posts after yours and before this one - people take their beliefs very seriously and this can be construed as a good or a bad thing by many people... that's why people would get hyped up.

~~~~~~~~~~~~
It was the administrator of this website that posted the info about this subject so I guess he had enough confidence in the members of this group not to get "hyped up" . Looks like he was right.

[Hedy]

I don't necessarily have an issue with online giving, but I'm concerned about the potential for abuse-tithing seems a common thing people are unable to give up or believe that tithing to God will help their finances. I'm worried that accepting credit cards would act to enable people to bury themselves deeper in debt.