seperation question

[mom-from-missouri]

OK, I have been helping a younger gal with some financial issues. Her abusive husband moved out recently. We changed her locks, got things (utilities and such) moved into her name......Found lots of stuff he forged her name on (credit cards and bills) and bills he didn't pay on. We are working on sorting all that out.

But, we have now been told that legally she has to let him into the house whenever he wants in, and we were not within the law to change the locks. He comes and goes when he wants, during the night even, and even walked in on a guest she had over (her cousin) while she was in the bathroom.

Her attorney appointment is for next week--can find one any sooner. Cops told her they don't interpret the law, so they won't help.

Does anyone know--is it true he can just walk in and out anytime he pleases and take whatever he wants?? He even took groceries I bought for her out of the cabinets....

He is a mental case. Sadly, although he has abused her in the past, no charges or reports were ever filed to use against him. He has her brainwashed that he is Jesus.

Any advice here?? Meanwhile, tomorrow we will be back on the phone trying to get in with an attorney a little sooner.....

[cooliemae]

The answer to your question comes down to who is listed on the lease/rental agreement or mortgage. If the husband is listed then then answer is yes, he has a legal right to have access the property. If he is not listed then the answer is no, he has no legal basis for having unwanted access to the property.

[~bs]

Is he on the lease or does he own the property jointly? If that's the case, I'm pretty sure you cannot kick him out of the house. If you have a restraining order against him, you may be able to get the courts to kick him out, even if you own the property jointly. If he's abused her in the past, and she never did anything about it, then there's nothing she can do, which is also her fault for not reporting it.

Look at it from the cops perspective;

They show up, crazy lady tells them she wants to change her locks and kick her husband from the dog house to out of the house. Why? He's crazy and abused her in the past. They check the system, no charges ever filed. Is she being abused now? Nope. Whose house is it? The husband's.

What do you expect the cops to do?

[bjl584]

Yes. He has legal authority to enter the premises as long as he is a joint owner of the property and they are still married.

The only thing that will unwind that is if she files and is granted an order of protection or by an attorney/judge in divorce court.

He might be insane, but if no charges were ever filed, then the legal system will be no help to her.

[MonkeyMama]

That's a bummer. We had the opposite happen. A relative's live-in girlfriend accused him falsely of abuse, and he was not allowed back onto HIS property. His home - wouldn't even let him get his car so he could go to work. Totally insane. I doubt an order of protection was served that quickly, but maybe an emergency order was put in place because charges were filed. Just a maddening situation. {Sounds like more to the story, but there really wasn't. Nicest guy you would ever meet, got mixed up with the WRONG person. Tenant rights are very generous, though she was only ever offered a place to stay or was a live-in girlfriend who did not contribute financially. OF course the law was on his side for the long run, but took some time to sort out. He was jailed and homeless and carless while it was sorted out. Oh, and she trashed the house while the police wouldn't let him enter. & of course he was too nice to ever file charges against her, which is what should of happened. But maddening not to be able to prevent it while it is happening}.

[mom-from-missouri]

Both their names are on the mortgage. Only his name is on the apartment he now lives in. Its not just that he comes, he comes unannounced and walks through the house--her mom spent the night last night and was sleeping in the guest room (someone spends the night there each night for protection or as a witness)and he went bursting into the guest bedroom at 3 a.m. where she was sleeping.

When I went thru my divorce and my husband moved out, we were told he could not come over with out giving me 24 hour notice, and could not come in unless someone was there. On the other hand, if he was coming to get his property, I had to let him in--but with 24 hours notice.

One night he came in and turned on the tv and all the radios as loud as they would go and sat on the sofa and just laughed. when she asked why he was doing it, he replied "because I can".

[disneysteve]

Both their names are on the mortgage.

When I went thru my divorce and my husband moved out, we were told he could not come over with out giving me 24 hour notice, and could not come in unless someone was there.

That's a totally different situation. You were divorced. There was a legal structure to that. In this case, there is no such structure. He just moved out but it is still his house. Until they are legally divorced or she has a restraining order (which is totally worthless anyway), I don't see how she can stop him from coming into his own home.

I'd say the best option for her is to move out herself if that's possible. That's the only way she can avoid this. Can she go stay with her mom until the divorce is final?

[mom-from-missouri]

I'm talking before the divorce. When my x moved out, his attorney told him he HAD to give notice, and could not just come and go. We were in separate houses for over 3 years before our divorce was final.

She can't stay with her mom-her mom rents a room from someone and doesn't have her own place. And, she has 2 young children.

Its a mess. She had no food, I spent money buying her food and taking her to a food pantry, and he came in the night and loaded it up and took it all. Sneered and said her name wasn't on it.

Went into the bathroom and stared at her 32 year old cousin sitting on the toilet, and then emptied out all the medicine cabinet and put it in a bag, took the tp off the wall and walked out. He is mentally ill. Yet, certain steps have to be followed to get the restraining order.

what about her privacy and safety and that of her guests??? A person should have a reasonable sense of privacy when they are in someone's home using the restroom, without someone who doesn't live there busting in through the closed bathroom door.

[phantom]

Are there any women shelters in the area that she can stay in until she can meet with the lawyer and figure out what she needs to do to legally keep him out of the house? If nothing else, the people at such a place might be able to give you suggestions on the best way to handle this situation. I would do a quick internet search to see what resources are available in your area. If that didn't turn up any results, I'd ask a local church if they knew of any resources.

She has my sympathy that she can't solve this by just locking the crazy husband out. But, since that doesn't sound possible at this point in time, I would be looking for a safer place for her to stay temporarily.

[mom-from-missouri]

We looked at one of the 3 shelters. It was dirty, smokey and no place for her kids. the other 2 we were told, were similar, but closer to the schools and had a waiting list.

so, we are looking into other options and packing up her stuff.

Last night when he came in, he evidently also took the 13 year old daughters brand new Easter dress. A load of laundry (the kids) is also missing from the dryer.

She doesn't want to leave the house for fear he will take everything or destroy it (we just fixed broken walls he had punched through--they were first photographed). I can't blame her, but we are now fearing for their safety. If he destroys it, she will still have to pay for it to be repaired as her name is also on the mortgage. He turned off all the utilities, even though both their names were on them. We had to pay deposits to get them back on in her name. He cancelled the auto insurance and tried to cancel the homeowners insurance but the mortgage company intervened there. Now he sent her a text he was coming to take her vehicle (he already took the other one), and that will leave her with none. We have gotten her a prepaid phone so he cant watch her cell phone as her phone is on the same plan as his.


We have removed and hidden her grandmas antiques and quilts--not worth much except to her.

I told her if nothing else it is harassment.

As a landlord, I can not enter my own properties without advance notice in writing to my tenants.

[disneysteve]

As a landlord, I can not enter my own properties without advance notice in writing to my tenants.

That's different of course. You may own the property but you aren't the legal resident of the property.

If he is doing all that you've said, can't she take legal action? What does her attorney say about all of this?

[mom-from-missouri]

That's different of course. You may own the property but you aren't the legal resident of the property.

If he is doing all that you've said, can't she take legal action? What does her attorney say about all of this?

The earliest we can get into an attorney is Tues of next week. 5 of us got on the phone and started calling--we made over 200 calls....

I wonder if that is how we can stop him--he isn't the legal resident there anymore, since he moved out and has an apartment--he did sign a paper for her to get food stamps stating he no longer lived there and gave his apartment address as his legal address. You can't have 2 legal addresses, can you?? If you could, people would be voting twice....In fact, he even went to the license office to change the address on his drivers license......

We realize he gets 50% of property, but the daughters Easter dress?? that's not hers.

And no man has the right to walk in on another woman in the restroom while she is sitting on the toilet, and refuse to leave the room. That isn't right.

[disneysteve]

You can't have 2 legal addresses, can you??

Lots of folks who own vacation homes would disagree with you. Certainly you can only register to vote in one place and have one license but you can own as many homes as you want. Just because he is living elsewhere doesn't take away his rights to enter another property which he also owns.

And no man has the right to walk in on another woman in the restroom while she is sitting on the toilet, and refuse to leave the room. That isn't right.

Agreed. That's why I was wondering what the attorney was doing about that kind of stuff.

[~bs]

It is legal to own more than 1 property as your residence, and have rights to enter them whenever you wish. If you're renting the property out, things are a bit different because you're giving up some of those rights in the lease agreement.

I also thinkyou're too close to the issue emotionally, and she should be careful or her accusations could backfire. Everything you're going after him for is just hear say unless you start filling police reports and back it up with evidence and statements. He's probably acting out because it's his property and he feels within his rights to do what he wants.

[mom-from-missouri]

temp solution

He just entered with a knife. Police had to get involved and he told them he intended to kill her and the kids. He is now in jail--at least until he bonds out.

This is what we feared would happen. Had a male neighbor not run over after she was screaming and had his wife call 911, she and 2 kids would now be dead.

Hopefully none of his friends will bail him out.