What do you think about unions and striking?

[cptacek]

Would you believe that in some small towns there is no Target or Meijer or even a McDonalds????? Shocking isn't it, but these places exist. In some cases, the towns are too small to support a variety of businesses from the outset and in others our dear friends at Walmart ran them out of business by selling their cheap plastic crap at low, low, low prices. Deliberately of course. And don't think they don't know it. Making sure they are the only game in town is how they ensure that their workforce has no or very little option but to accept their labor practices.

So your advice while seemingly practical, may not be so for everyone. It's never that simple.

Please list a town that has a Walmart but has no other store. Target, McDonald's, anything. Just a Walmart and houses and banks and stuff, but no retail stores or restaurants.

Hey, and I know about small towns and no work. Remember, I'm commuting 162 miles one way for my job, because there isn't anything close to home that compares to the job I have. But, if Walmart is sooooo bad, then surely there are other jobs around that are better?

[dmontngrey]

The company I work for has customers and provides employees to do the work at the customer's location. We have a contract with the customer and the people that work there are our employees. We recently had our employees vote to unionize at one of our locations and there is nothing we can do about it. These employees don't understand what a mistake their vote will be. Our customer chose us because we don't have union employees. They didn't want to deal with a union and that's one of the reasons they brought us in. Nothing is finalized yet, but as soon as it is 1) we will lose the contract and our customer and 2) quite a few employees will have just voted themselves out of a job. I don't understand why these employees couldn't understand this outcome before they cast this vote.
No, we can't fire the employees for unionizing, but we CAN lay them all off when we lose the contract.

[b4freedom]

The company I work for has customers and provides employees to do the work at the customer's location. We have a contract with the customer and the people that work there are our employees. We recently had our employees vote to unionize at one of our locations and there is nothing we can do about it. These employees don't understand what a mistake their vote will be. Our customer chose us because we don't have union employees. They didn't want to deal with a union and that's one of the reasons they brought us in. Nothing is finalized yet, but as soon as it is 1) we will lose the contract and our customer and 2) quite a few employees will have just voted themselves out of a job. I don't understand why these employees couldn't understand this outcome before they cast this vote.
No, we can't fire the employees for unionizing, but we CAN lay them all off when we lose the contract.

Why will you lose the contract? Does it actually state that in the contract? And why do your employees want to unionize? Usually it's a sign that there is something wrong when employees want to unionize. Happy employees rarely unionize.

[ithaca]

Would you believe that in some small towns there is no Target or Meijer or even a McDonalds????? Shocking isn't it, but these places exist. In some cases, the towns are too small to support a variety of businesses from the outset and in others our dear friends at Walmart ran them out of business by selling their cheap plastic crap at low, low, low prices. Deliberately of course. And don't think they don't know it. Making sure they are the only game in town is how they ensure that their workforce has no or very little option but to accept their labor practices.

So your advice while seemingly practical, may not be so for everyone. It's never that simple.

If there's a Walmart, there's a gas station. Both pay minimum wage. Also, these people are CHOOSING to stay in that small town. I still don't feel bad for them.

[dmontngrey]

Why will you lose the contract? Does it actually state that in the contract? And why do your employees want to unionize? Usually it's a sign that there is something wrong when employees want to unionize. Happy employees rarely unionize.

The type of business we are in always has our employees complaining. It has nothing to do with us as a company, they just think the grass is always greener. We don't have control over how the customer does things and our employees have to follow the customer's rules. If they have a problem with this, they are free to get a job elsewhere. Unions can be very convincing with false promises of offering better benefits, better pay, etc. Our employees hear this and want something "better" of course! They're just not able to see the whole picture here. This is a rather large customer for us, and again with the type of business it is, they can do anything they want and take their business elsewhere if they wish. If the customer doesn't want to deal with a union situation, they can simply end the contract with us somehow. Even if that means they have to break contract. I am not familiar with the contract, but I know this is a possibility for them to cut ties with us for one reason or another. Just the nature of the business. Accounts come and go all the time.

[GrimJack]

Destroying our companies with overpriced labor isn't going to have any effect on how other countries run their businesses. I certainly don't think unions are making the world a better place.

Would you tell me what you think overpriced labor is? I have heard that complaint before and don't get much of an answer but some mumbling.

Do you think 100 million dollar salaries for executives is justified?

Can you name a company that has been destroyed by overpriced labor?

[GrimJack]

I highly disagree with the last comment - at least as far as most unionized companies where I live are concerned. These workers make far more than they would for doing anything similar anywhere else. My sister worked as a telephone operator for our local phone company (it's unionized). She worked 6.5 hour shifts, had benefits out the wazoo, and made probably 3 times what anyone doing anything similar in a non-unionized environment would have made.

I personally think there are way too many lazy people being protected by these unions. It's so hard to get rid of them once they are in. My mom worked at the hospital (also union) and complained all the time about the dead weight. Some of them were off on paid stress leave more often than they were actually at work (months at a time sometimes). How much more stressful is it to mop floors at a hospital than anywhere else?

Please use real numbers so we can understand a little better. You are saying that it is the fault of unions that non-union workers are under-paid, is that correct? You think benefits are a bad thing?

How does dead weight in a union house differ from dead weight elsewhere? Your mother complained that someone took paid medical leave? That seems odd.

[GrimJack]

There is a very very simple solution for any employee that is being mistreated by Wal-Mart..... go work at Target. Or Meijer. Or McDonalds. I don't really feel bad for someone that chooses to work for Wal-Mart when there are thousands of other companies that would employ them.

I understand that you do not feel compassion for the misfortunes of others but when you say that there are thousands of other companies that would employ them suggests to me that you might not be familiar with the current economy. I remember when Dan Quayle was campaigning in some California town and pointed to a McDonald's with a help wanted sign in the window and he actually said "see, there are jobs for everyone".

[GrimJack]

Working off the clock is illegal (call OSHA on em) and so is not taking a break (again it is a safety thing, call OSHA)

and I believe both candidates want to make the health care universal, so that wont be an issue as soon as big bro govt gets its way.

Unions ARE big buisness, just not a manufacturing business.

Yes it is illegal and W-M keeps getting busted for doing it. They claim that it is not company policy but only rogue managers that do it - so the local store is fined and punished but so far the corp. is dodging responsibility. Oddly enough, stores all over the country are being caught going 'rogue'.

[GrimJack]

Because I don't do studies on unions, I judge them by what I hear from a member of one or on radio and tv. I've been told by an American Airlines a union member that new members have to be told to slow down, not to get their jobs done too quickly.

Try being self-employed and get the same pay and benefits of a union worker. Dollar for dollar, you'll work much harder. I don't sit around watching a clock waiting for my next break. I take less than five minutes to eat my sandwich.

I don't like that seniority takes presidence over your work ethic. Unions like the gov. have a place, but are doing a horrible job.

You choose to be self-employed and complain that someone else chooses a different path? You listen to talk radio and 'Friend of a Friend' comments to form your opinions.

I agree that self-employment is a tough go which is why I don't go that route. I also find a lot of other career paths not to my liking. The point I am shooting for is that every career path has its goods and its evils - everyone complains about their coworkers, unions make an easy target but....

[GrimJack]

The unreasonable demands of unions started the demise of the US auto companies. I think they do more harm than good..

No! The unreasonable expectations of management started the demise of the US auto companies. In what way do they do more harm than good? What are the unreasonable demands that unions make?

[GrimJack]

Yeah, I've heard stories from other manufacturing companies across town that got sold and everyone had to reapply for their jobs. The 20 year guys that had gotten into the habit of getting to work on time, taking a nap on the bench, taking a break on time, taking another nap, etc., weren't hired back. Seriously.

But, I've also heard that whatever they get for health insurance benefits will change our benefits too. So, I've heard some coworkers hoping they get great benefits but are defeated on everything else.

And if these jobs are such "highly skilled jobs" like the union posters keep saying, then why not let competition and not seniority be the way they are handed out?

I question that the 'companies across town' chose not to hire back any of the workers who were getting close to retirement or were getting a decent wage.

So, you are thinking screw the unions but I want the good stuff they get?

Part of the problem with 'let competition' determine how the jobs are handed out is that then blacks, women, gays, etc. don't have a chance to compete because the manager does not like them or does not think they are capable. The seniority system was worked out as a way to make the system a little more fair.

[feh]

Would you tell me what you think overpriced labor is? I have heard that complaint before and don't get much of an answer but some mumbling.

Do you think 100 million dollar salaries for executives is justified?

Can you name a company that has been destroyed by overpriced labor?

One of the major reasons GM is in such bad shape is because of the pay/benefits of its union workers.

[maat55]

You choose to be self-employed and complain that someone else chooses a different path? You listen to talk radio and 'Friend of a Friend' comments to form your opinions.

I agree that self-employment is a tough go which is why I don't go that route. I also find a lot of other career paths not to my liking. The point I am shooting for is that every career path has its goods and its evils - everyone complains about their coworkers, unions make an easy target but....

That your pro and I'm con makes no difference. Because this country has to compete globally, american companies have to adjust. Unions are somewhat of a brick wall in the way of progress. Until other countries bring their standards up to ours, we have to unwillingly compromise.

[cptacek]

I question that the 'companies across town' chose not to hire back any of the workers who were getting close to retirement or were getting a decent wage.

So, you are thinking screw the unions but I want the good stuff they get?

Part of the problem with 'let competition' determine how the jobs are handed out is that then blacks, women, gays, etc. don't have a chance to compete because the manager does not like them or does not think they are capable. The seniority system was worked out as a way to make the system a little more fair.

I didn't say "I" hope they get good benefits but nothing else. I said I've heard other co-workers hope that. As for me, I hope they get negotiating pretty soon and come to an agreement so we can start getting planes out the door again.