Analyze my situation - net worth, saving for wedding, buying a home

[nyliguy]

That line "against my Fiances' will" puts some red flags in my mind. It is very important to be on the same page with your future spouse about money before you get married. Money fights are a leading cause of divorce after all. If you haven't talked to her seriously about money yet, do it right away. Try to reach some consensus about how the two of you want to handle money before you get married. Although, I have to agree with most of the advice in this thread, I believe that being in agreement with your fiance is more important than being in agreement with the people here. (Of course, I'm assuming she isn't completely crazy when it comes to money, because you've given me no reason to think that she is.)

From reading through this thread, I get the impression that you would be more of a saver than you currently are if not for the people around you. You're spending a lot on your wedding and hoping to get a lot of it back because that's what your friends do, and you bought a $10,000 engagement ring to show that you could. If you truly have reservations about whether or not these things are worth so much money, I think you need to step back from what is expected and what everyone else does and decide whether or not it's what you really want to do. If the cost of the wedding is already set in stone, so be it. But, for things that haven't been set yet, like how you will handle buying a house, you and your fiance should give some serious thought to whether you want to do it the way everyone you know does or whether you want to try to find a better path.

Great advice and good evaluation. I don't know if it's so much as we see differently, but yes I'm very conservative and worry about money and savings while everyone around me seems not to. Again I don't know others sitiuations, nor do I care, yet I do want the same things as everyone else has regardless of knowing there situation. Nice home, family, vacations.

I'm not so worried about the wedding, as that stuff is pretty much set in what we will be spending. I worry about the afterwards, were will our incomes be in a few years, how much we will save and how much we can spend on a home and so on. These are all things unknown and I can't hunkerdown and not spend anything just for the sake of savings.

As for housing and having 20%, yes that is the goal but I dare any of you to look at home values on Long Island, NY and tell me how many young people you actually think have 20% to put down.

Unless you're like many people were your parents are ready to loan you the money to make up your shortfall to make a down payment, you had your parents pay for your student loans, your parents paid for your wedding and you benefited 100% from the gifts. That's life, for the rest of us we balance debt and income and take risks on being able to make it here and live a happy life.

[Goldy]

Great advice and good evaluation. I don't know if it's so much as we see differently, but yes I'm very conservative and worry about money and savings while everyone around me seems not to. Again I don't know others sitiuations, nor do I care, yet I do want the same things as everyone else has regardless of knowing there situation. Nice home, family, vacations.

I'm not so worried about the wedding, as that stuff is pretty much set in what we will be spending. I worry about the afterwards, were will our incomes be in a few years, how much we will save and how much we can spend on a home and so on. These are all things unknown and I can't hunkerdown and not spend anything just for the sake of savings.

As for housing and having 20%, yes that is the goal but I dare any of you to look at home values on Long Island, NY and tell me how many young people you actually think have 20% to put down.

Unless you're like many people were your parents are ready to loan you the money to make up your shortfall to make a down payment, you had your parents pay for your student loans, your parents paid for your wedding and you benefited 100% from the gifts. That's life, for the rest of us we balance debt and income and take risks on being able to make it here and live a happy life.

If we forget about the wedding and just focus on your goals and current plan I have some concern that you are on a bit of a tightrope. You already have a fair bit of debt and by taking on the new house you might find yourself in a place where one spell of bad luck would push you deep in the red. I would strongly recommend that you take a bit of time to build up your DP so you can buy that house with 20% down.

Regardless the decision is yours and you will probably be just find either way (just might pay a little more in interest and fees).

[DebtFree&Broke]

I always thought that wedding gifts were to help the couple start their lives together, not to pay for the party. Don't plan your wedding on how much you think you'll receive in gifts, plan it on how much you can afford.

[JoeP]

As for housing and having 20%, yes that is the goal but I dare any of you to look at home values on Long Island, NY and tell me how many young people you actually think have 20% to put down.

A quick google on "long island real estate" brought me to a site that had 4139 properties for sale between $100k and $200k. Many of these would be considered starter homes because of their size, age, and amenities...but that fits what people typically do after graduating and getting married.

The reason: you want to give you and your spouse time to adjust to your new life together, work on furnishing a modest house, focusing on your next steps (kids, pets), being part of a neighborhood or community, managing finances together, starting saving for what you envision will be your next house. You don't need to be saddled with payments and taxes on a $400k house, which leaves most with so little money that credit cards and car loans add additional stress to any marriage. If a kid comes along (it happens, you know!), you'll be in a MUCH BETTER situation without all that debt hanging over your heads.

My advice would be to either rent an apartment or buy a STARTER HOME. Save up money, see where your jobs takes you, investigate if you really want to live on expensive Long Island, and then lay it on the table and see what that all looks like.

[nyliguy]

I always thought that wedding gifts were to help the couple start their lives together, not to pay for the party. Don't plan your wedding on how much you think you'll receive in gifts, plan it on how much you can afford.

It's all the same to the gift GIVER and most likely the bride and groom would receive the same amount of gifts wether the bride and groom paid for their wedding or not, wether the wedding cost $100,000 or $3,000 most likely they'd get the same amount in gifts. I have had friends that had a backyard wedding, also had friends that had Manhattan wedding with 350+ guests and it would be safe to assume that all the guests gave the same amount of gift to both weddings (the amount they could afford).

The difference is between what you thought was to help the couple start a life together or pay for the party plainly comes down to the bride and groom paying their own wedding so your gifts are a net wash, or if the bride and groom had their parents pay for it so your gifts are for them to start their own life together. Or if you just went down to the courthouse and people sent you gifts to start your life together.

I might be the strange and 'dumb one' but it is always interesting to see how different areas of the country do weddings. I don't think it's a people thing and definatly a part of the country thing.

I've been to lovely weddings were I never thought the bride and groom were trying to be somethign they werent and dropping more than they can afford, it's just a party and etique was to pay for my plate and enjoy in their day.

Over simplying this, but would you show up to someones holiday party without dessert or some type of dish? Granted you weren't invited to supply food for the party but it's still proper etique. OH and GOD heavens, if the host of the party doesn't go out and buy TONS of desserts because they assume their guest will be bringing a lot already.

I'm way off topic, and everytime the topic of NY weddings comes up to someone on a forum it always leads to the people who spent $2k and how it's ok to use your money on a home or retirement but it's irresponsible to spend it on a wedding.

[nyliguy]

A quick google on "long island real estate" brought me to a site that had 4139 properties for sale between $100k and $200k. Many of these would be considered starter homes because of their size, age, and amenities...but that fits what people typically do after graduating and getting married.

The reason: you want to give you and your spouse time to adjust to your new life together, work on furnishing a modest house, focusing on your next steps (kids, pets), being part of a neighborhood or community, managing finances together, starting saving for what you envision will be your next house. You don't need to be saddled with payments and taxes on a $400k house, which leaves most with so little money that credit cards and car loans add additional stress to any marriage. If a kid comes along (it happens, you know!), you'll be in a MUCH BETTER situation without all that debt hanging over your heads.

My advice would be to either rent an apartment or buy a STARTER HOME. Save up money, see where your jobs takes you, investigate if you really want to live on expensive Long Island, and then lay it on the table and see what that all looks like.

I get what you're saying about moving slow, and adjusting to what you can afford and those are some of my plans as I'm conservative although in this region it's common to purchase homes that are 3 times your annual salary.

Most of those homes would be in heavy crime areas, or in remote areas 2-3hrs away from work with traffic. If you think $400k is high, than you would be shocked if you saw the property taxes on homes here.

What income level would you consider to buying a home of such value, in that most people living in those $400k homes do not make over $150k year. The cost of homes here will always hold considerable value since it's the suburb of New York City(although they can decline in the housing bubble burst). Not a bad investment to have, over living in rural Virgina in a $100k home making 1/3 of a New York salary but being able to fnd your retirement account.

[riverwed070707]

A quick google on "long island real estate" brought me to a site that had 4139 properties for sale between $100k and $200k. Many of these would be considered starter homes because of their size, age, and amenities...but that fits what people typically do after graduating and getting married.

The reason: you want to give you and your spouse time to adjust to your new life together, work on furnishing a modest house, focusing on your next steps (kids, pets), being part of a neighborhood or community, managing finances together, starting saving for what you envision will be your next house. You don't need to be saddled with payments and taxes on a $400k house, which leaves most with so little money that credit cards and car loans add additional stress to any marriage. If a kid comes along (it happens, you know!), you'll be in a MUCH BETTER situation without all that debt hanging over your heads.

My advice would be to either rent an apartment or buy a STARTER HOME. Save up money, see where your jobs takes you, investigate if you really want to live on expensive Long Island, and then lay it on the table and see what that all looks like.

I've been following this thread and while I agree with a lot of the advice given, if you're not from NY, I don't think you're qualified to make this generalization. These $100-200k properties could be nothing more than a studio apartment with half a kitchen and no parking in an area you would be afraid to walk out the front door after dark. For the same reasons I wouldn't buy a house for $20,000 in my area (yes they exist and I assure you no on one this board would live in one no matter how much they save) it may not be realistic to buy property for under $200k in NYC. Everyone has buying standards and while I agree some people do overbuy and a HCOL area is not an excuse to buy before you're ready, suggesting someone just buy a house that's $150k less than the price point they are looking at isn't a helpful suggestion...

Assuming the OP preps by saving a 20% dp while maintaining and adequate EF, its well within the guidlines for him to buy a house in that price range.

As for the wedding... well I'm keeping my lips sealed on that one. WHile I wouldn't spend that much, I guess the only value I can add is to say, OP, if its important to you and your FI to have an expensive wedding then do it -- you only get one -- HOWEVER, understand what that means for you financially and be prepared to wait longer to buy. You have to prioritize and your finances aren't looking in favor of doing both in just a couple years. Having the wedding of your dreams may mean holding out a few more years...but scaling back may mean realizing yoru dream of becoming a homeowner a little sooner. Just my $.02

[LivingAlmostLarge]

I agree with riverwed it's all about priorities. I don't think you need to be completely debt free to buy a home but it makes life easier. I think it also is easier to buy with 20% DP. I have a lot of friends jealous of my DH and I for putting 20% and they make lots of snide comments about it.

But hey we made different choices and sacrifices for it. I think that people forget that you can't have everything now. If you want a wedding for $40k then buying a home is definitely put on the backburner. If you scaled back the wedding the home and possibly kids would come sooner but it's a personal choice.

Another personal choice is buying the $400k home dependent on a $150k combined salary means that you both will have to work and pay for daycare. Potentially it could be very tight and you may be making pennies and barely making it after having kids. Again lack of planning and future thought.

I'm not telling you what to do, but if it were me I'd run different scenarios about when I wanted to have kids, do i want the opportunity to stay at home if I chose or work part-time, do I want to be able to travel with kids, what car do I want to drive, etc.

But everyone makes a different personal choice. The only thing is I can honestly say that sometimes there are red flags and a train wreck definitely waiting to happen.

FWIW my engagement ring was $1300 and it doesn't even fit anymore. I look at it and if my hands ever go down in size again maybe. Stupid pregnancy. My DH can easily afford to replace it now, but it just doesn't seem important anymore, and back then it was "so" much money when were broke. But it was more what it represented. Just a shift in priorities.

[red92s]

First things first: that $10k engagement ring is not an "asset". The appraised values everyone feeds you simply serve to make you feel like you got a good deal . . . the open market is much less forgiving. Anyways, it's not like you are selling it at any point in the future (riiight?) so it's more of a sunk cost than an investment.

I got married about 3 months ago. We had a $20k budget. We ended up at around $27k. In total, we got maybe $3k in cash as gifts (but a lot of "stuff"). Simply assuming you are going to rake in $30k in gifts because YOU give like that is setting up for disaster. Everyone doesn't have the same sense of whats proper, even if you think it'd be rude to give less than $100. "covering your plate" is one thing . . . but they are not going to cover the dress, the flowers, the car, the sparklers, and the band.

[nyliguy]

I agree with riverwed it's all about priorities. I don't think you need to be completely debt free to buy a home but it makes life easier. I think it also is easier to buy with 20% DP. I have a lot of friends jealous of my DH and I for putting 20% and they make lots of snide comments about it.

But hey we made different choices and sacrifices for it. I think that people forget that you can't have everything now. If you want a wedding for $40k then buying a home is definitely put on the backburner. If you scaled back the wedding the home and possibly kids would come sooner but it's a personal choice.

Another personal choice is buying the $400k home dependent on a $150k combined salary means that you both will have to work and pay for daycare. Potentially it could be very tight and you may be making pennies and barely making it after having kids. Again lack of planning and future thought.

I'm not telling you what to do, but if it were me I'd run different scenarios about when I wanted to have kids, do i want the opportunity to stay at home if I chose or work part-time, do I want to be able to travel with kids, what car do I want to drive, etc.

But everyone makes a different personal choice. The only thing is I can honestly say that sometimes there are red flags and a train wreck definitely waiting to happen.

FWIW my engagement ring was $1300 and it doesn't even fit anymore. I look at it and if my hands ever go down in size again maybe. Stupid pregnancy. My DH can easily afford to replace it now, but it just doesn't seem important anymore, and back then it was "so" much money when were broke. But it was more what it represented. Just a shift in priorities.

So you're saying the $40k wedding is going to make a mortgage and day care a challenge,or are you saying the $400k home is going to be a challenge?

If you mean the home than I agree, while I know many people who make less and purchase homes in mid $300's they often have much support from family through having a wedding paid for or parents watching their kids so they save on daycare.

[nyliguy]

First things first: that $10k engagement ring is not an "asset". The appraised values everyone feeds you simply serve to make you feel like you got a good deal . . . the open market is much less forgiving. Anyways, it's not like you are selling it at any point in the future (riiight?) so it's more of a sunk cost than an investment.

I got married about 3 months ago. We had a $20k budget. We ended up at around $27k. In total, we got maybe $3k in cash as gifts (but a lot of "stuff"). Simply assuming you are going to rake in $30k in gifts because YOU give like that is setting up for disaster. Everyone doesn't have the same sense of whats proper, even if you think it'd be rude to give less than $100. "covering your plate" is one thing . . . but they are not going to cover the dress, the flowers, the car, the sparklers, and the band.

If you're just making a statement about the ring than I agree it's not an asset. If youre implying that I said it was than you're wrong I never implied it was an asset.

So you're saying that my friends who had the same exact guest that I am having will give me different gifts than they gave them? I never said I will rake it in, but I assure you my friends give money and will do the same for my wedding. If I got zero $ gifts I would not care but I'm just stating what reality is although im not counting on the money.

My wedding list is 250 guest, I had a engagement part with 60 guests and received more than you did for your wedding of $3k. I hate to sound negative, but it's just the culture here in NY everyone gives cash gifts.

I'll even go as far to say NY weddings are rather stuck up in a way were it's dragged out with engagement party, bridal shower, wedding. Gifts from the registry are given at the bridal shower and cash is given for the others. It's rather difficult when you get invited to 5 or siz weddings a summer as the money to give in gifts is tough. I was in a friends wedding party and had to rent a tux for $200 and gave him a $300 gift.

Not sure how this thread spun into defending how weddings are here and wether to expect gifts or not.

[JoeP]

Most of those homes would be in heavy crime areas, or in remote areas 2-3hrs away from work with traffic. If you think $400k is high, than you would be shocked if you saw the property taxes on homes here.

Even if 90% of those homes fit the description you give, that leaves around 400 potential starter homes you can look at. It sounds a lot like you've already made up your mind, and are not entertaining advice from those who have a lot more life experience and are offering it to you and your future spouse with the best intentions.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

$40k wedding will make buying a home and having kids delayed, perhaps more than you anticipate. But it's a choice. The more you lock in your finances like having an expensive wedding, expensive home you lock yourself into choices instead of financial freedom.

The cheaper the wedding, the more cash on hand you have. Or perhaps you pay off more debt, putting you in a more secure position to have kids earlier or having the opportunity to stay at home with those kids full time or even part-time. It might sway you to have 3 kids instead of 2 kids. It might sway you to put more down instead of 20% for a home.

Putting more down than 20% might make the $400k home very comfortable instead of tight. It might allow for job loss or career change.

For sure the cheaper wedding will allow you to save more for retirement now instead of the future. But it's all about choices. Realizing that by choosing X, you give up Y.

I choose to stay at home with my DD. I drive a 99 corolla and am considering a new used car. My sacrifice is that I don't get a new car because I don't work. Now if I were working we'd have a lot more disposable income and I know I'd have a new car because my DH would insist. But I don't mind my choice.

Second choice by staying at home we may not be able to pay for college 100%. Will that be okay? I don't know, but I am trying my best to provide for our kids responsibly. But again I've made a decision and given up 100% paid for college, maybe paying for a portion of their wedding, house DP because I'm choosing to stay at home now.

I have had job offers at a close to 6 figures and my DH makes more than I do. My entire income would be banked for college, retirement, new car, weddings, etc since we don't live on it now. So it's a big sacrifice.

But perspective wise you can't have everything and you can't have everything now.

[nyliguy]

$40k wedding will make buying a home and having kids delayed, perhaps more than you anticipate. But it's a choice. The more you lock in your finances like having an expensive wedding, expensive home you lock yourself into choices instead of financial freedom.

The cheaper the wedding, the more cash on hand you have. Or perhaps you pay off more debt, putting you in a more secure position to have kids earlier or having the opportunity to stay at home with those kids full time or even part-time. It might sway you to have 3 kids instead of 2 kids. It might sway you to put more down instead of 20% for a home.

Putting more down than 20% might make the $400k home very comfortable instead of tight. It might allow for job loss or career change.

For sure the cheaper wedding will allow you to save more for retirement now instead of the future. But it's all about choices. Realizing that by choosing X, you give up Y.

I choose to stay at home with my DD. I drive a 99 corolla and am considering a new used car. My sacrifice is that I don't get a new car because I don't work. Now if I were working we'd have a lot more disposable income and I know I'd have a new car because my DH would insist. But I don't mind my choice.

Second choice by staying at home we may not be able to pay for college 100%. Will that be okay? I don't know, but I am trying my best to provide for our kids responsibly. But again I've made a decision and given up 100% paid for college, maybe paying for a portion of their wedding, house DP because I'm choosing to stay at home now.

I have had job offers at a close to 6 figures and my DH makes more than I do. My entire income would be banked for college, retirement, new car, weddings, etc since we don't live on it now. So it's a big sacrifice.

But perspective wise you can't have everything and you can't have everything now.

So you're not saying a $40k wedding is bad, just paying for it myself is bad? What if my intention is never to pay for my kids wedding or pay for their college and make them handle that on their own. You do know maybe people paid for their own college tuition.

[nyliguy]

Even if 90% of those homes fit the description you give, that leaves around 400 potential starter homes you can look at. It sounds a lot like you've already made up your mind, and are not entertaining advice from those who have a lot more life experience and are offering it to you and your future spouse with the best intentions.

I understand you have good intentions, but I question your outlook on life. You sacrific now in order to pay for your kids wedding, their college, and have tons of money for retirement and to leave your kids when you die. What happened to raising your kids with their needs and having them make it in life themselves by funding their own choices.

I start to wonder if I came here posting that my parents were paying $50k for my wedding if I would be getting the same response, about how I could do a $3k wedding and that money would be better used on something else......like funding something for my kids in twenty years.

What region of the country do you live in, home much was your income and the price of your home?