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  • #31
    Originally posted by Singuy View Post

    No one commits any action that they believe to be wrong.
    I don't think this is true at all. Except for cases of significant mental illness, the vast majority of people going out and committing a crime are fully aware of the fact that what they're doing is wrong and illegal. You can't tell me that every person who tries to shoplift something believes that's okay or that everyone who decides to rob a convenience store sees nothing wrong with that. I'm sure a lot of the thrill is trying to see if they can get away with it. They know it's wrong. They know they're breaking the law. That's the whole point.

    The problem with the whole "right and wrong" thing is that there isn't universal agreement on many issues. A lot of that stems from religious beliefs. Petunia mentioned "simple reasoning" but that doesn't work either because there's no logic or reason involved in many of these issues, especially when there is a religious factor. If simple reasoning worked, we wouldn't have had the Civil War, the civil rights movement, the women's rights movement, the LGBT rights movement, the black lives matter movement, etc. If everyone would do the right thing just because it's the right thing, the world would be a far more peaceful place.
    Steve

    * Despite the high cost of living, it remains very popular.
    * Why should I pay for my daughter's education when she already knows everything?
    * There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by disneysteve View Post
      I don't think this is true at all. Except for cases of significant mental illness, the vast majority of people going out and committing a crime are fully aware of the fact that what they're doing is wrong and illegal. You can't tell me that every person who tries to shoplift something believes that's okay or that everyone who decides to rob a convenience store sees nothing wrong with that. I'm sure a lot of the thrill is trying to see if they can get away with it. They know it's wrong. They know they're breaking the law. That's the whole point.

      The problem with the whole "right and wrong" thing is that there isn't universal agreement on many issues. A lot of that stems from religious beliefs. Petunia mentioned "simple reasoning" but that doesn't work either because there's no logic or reason involved in many of these issues, especially when there is a religious factor. If simple reasoning worked, we wouldn't have had the Civil War, the civil rights movement, the women's rights movement, the LGBT rights movement, the black lives matter movement, etc. If everyone would do the right thing just because it's the right thing, the world would be a far more peaceful place.
      Absolutely agree with that.

      But I disagree that there is no logic or reasoning involved. A small percentage of individuals truly have no comprehension that other people are people too (sociopaths), but most simply choose that what they themselves want is more important. And religion certainly can complicate matters, as alleged commandments from a deity are given precedence over common sense.

      Take for example the Civil Rights Movement. If I want to be treated fairly, it stands to reason that other people want that too. Thus, no one should be treated unfairly. That seems simple to me.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by disneysteve View Post
        I don't think this is true at all. Except for cases of significant mental illness, the vast majority of people going out and committing a crime are fully aware of the fact that what they're doing is wrong and illegal. You can't tell me that every person who tries to shoplift something believes that's okay or that everyone who decides to rob a convenience store sees nothing wrong with that. I'm sure a lot of the thrill is trying to see if they can get away with it. They know it's wrong. They know they're breaking the law. That's the whole point.

        The problem with the whole "right and wrong" thing is that there isn't universal agreement on many issues. A lot of that stems from religious beliefs. Petunia mentioned "simple reasoning" but that doesn't work either because there's no logic or reason involved in many of these issues, especially when there is a religious factor. If simple reasoning worked, we wouldn't have had the Civil War, the civil rights movement, the women's rights movement, the LGBT rights movement, the black lives matter movement, etc. If everyone would do the right thing just because it's the right thing, the world would be a far more peaceful place.
        What is the right thing? I think we shouldn't have the right to kill unborns. Others disagree. Who is right? Is the Supreme Court the ultimate arbiter of right and wrong? Who is labeled as draconian in our society? The one who wants to protect the unborns! Those that want the right to kill unborns are progressives!

        I think black lives matter, yet there's a whole bunch of hip hop artists that, according to their lyrics, have disdain and no respect, for not only their own lives, but the lives of others. Is it OK to sing about killing cops, raping women, referring to "n***as" and "hos" two or three dozen times, and shooting up places? That's not demeaning to others? Blacks, cops, and women in particular?

        It's OK to bash men in every TV sit com and commercial as total buffoons and idiots, but it's not OK to do the same for women? When was the last time you saw a woman portrayed as a dunce next to her man?

        It's OK to have a gay pride parade, but not a straight pride parade? It's OK to have "National Association for the Advancement of Colored People", yet it is racist to call an African American "colored."

        We have some pretty interesting standards in this country. I frankly can't figure it out.
        How can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat?

        Comment


        • #34
          Texas, I feel you here. I kinda get the same vibe, especially living in Portland, Oregon. And one question here is: does this kind of faddish social trend stuff matter in the long run for personal finance or business? And second, why focus on it if you can't control it?

          james.c.hendrickson@gmail.com
          202.468.6043

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by TexasHusker View Post

            What is the right thing? I think we shouldn't have the right to kill unborns. Others disagree. Who is right? Is the Supreme Court the ultimate arbiter of right and wrong? Who is labeled as draconian in our society? The one who wants to protect the unborns! Those that want the right to kill unborns are progressives!
            By "protect", you mean you want someone else to be forced to gestate against her will. But what gives you the right to make decisions regarding someone else's body? One definition of a slave is a person who has no authority or control over their own body.

            Originally posted by TexasHusker View Post
            I think black lives matter, yet there's a whole bunch of hip hop artists that, according to their lyrics, have disdain and no respect, for not only their own lives, but the lives of others. Is it OK to sing about killing cops, raping women, referring to "n***as" and "hos" two or three dozen times, and shooting up places? That's not demeaning to others? Blacks, cops, and women in particular?
            Why are you equating hip hop artists to African Americans? There are white hip hop artists; do they speak for you?

            Originally posted by TexasHusker View Post
            It's OK to bash men in every TV sit com and commercial as total buffoons and idiots, but it's not OK to do the same for women? When was the last time you saw a woman portrayed as a dunce next to her man?
            I wouldn't know, because I watch very little TV. You have the option to NOT watch these shows and commercials too.

            Originally posted by TexasHusker View Post
            It's OK to have a gay pride parade, but not a straight pride parade?
            How many people have been murdered, beaten up, marginalized, or belittled because they are straight? Oh, that's right, none.

            Originally posted by TexasHusker View Post
            It's OK to have "National Association for the Advancement of Colored People", yet it is racist to call an African American "colored."
            The NAACP was founded in 1909. At the time, it was an acceptable term.

            Originally posted by TexasHusker View Post
            We have some pretty interesting standards in this country. I frankly can't figure it out.
            I suspect you could if you wanted to.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by james.hendrickson View Post
              Texas, I feel you here. I kinda get the same vibe, especially living in Portland, Oregon. And one question here is: does this kind of faddish social trend stuff matter in the long run for personal finance or business? And second, why focus on it if you can't control it?
              I think that social trends definitely settle into the world of personal finances and investing. The values of today's young people say that everything is temporary, nothing is permanent. Half of them are from broken homes. They don't want to commit to anything, because nothing can reasonably be relied upon. The world is about the latest tweets and snaps, and how happy everyone else is trying to make themselves appear. Everyone is a victim.

              As a result, your brick-and-mortar retail is on life support. The ones that are thriving are offering the cheap, throwaway stuff. Forever 21, Big Lots, Wal-Mart. Home ownership is declining. Car ownership is giving way to leasing. There's an increasing push for more entitlements from the "government" - monthly income checks, subsidies, forgiven student loans, Medicare for all. Quality means very little - folks just want the prestige. A midline Mercedes Benz sedan, once the finest production car in the world, is selling for about the same actual dollars as it did 30 years ago. But that car 30 years ago was a piece of mechanical genius. The Mercedes today is just another throwaway car after 10 years. It has the badge - more prominently than ever - but it's no Mercedes any more.

              All of these macrotrends have an effect on personal finance and investing.

              How can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat?

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Petunia 100 View Post

                By "protect", you mean you want someone else to be forced to gestate against her will. But what gives you the right to make decisions regarding someone else's body? One definition of a slave is a person who has no authority or control over their own body.

                What gives us the right to force death on an innocent unborn? Mom gets her life back either way.

                Why are you equating hip hop artists to African Americans? There are white hip hop artists; do they speak for you?

                Nope, and the point still remains.

                I wouldn't know, because I watch very little TV. You have the option to NOT watch these shows and commercials too.

                Most people watch TV.

                How many people have been murdered, beaten up, marginalized, or belittled because they are straight? Oh, that's right, none.

                Straight people are murdered every day.

                The NAACP was founded in 1909. At the time, it was an acceptable term.

                So was not allowing blacks to vote and a whole lot of other stuff.

                I suspect you could if you wanted to.

                I'm glad you have a handle on right and wrong. Sorry I'm such a clod.
                ^^^^^^^
                How can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat?

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by TexasHusker View Post

                  I think that social trends definitely settle into the world of personal finances and investing. The values of today's young people say that everything is temporary, nothing is permanent. Half of them are from broken homes. They don't want to commit to anything, because nothing can reasonably be relied upon. The world is about the latest tweets and snaps, and how happy everyone else is trying to make themselves appear. Everyone is a victim.

                  As a result, your brick-and-mortar retail is on life support. The ones that are thriving are offering the cheap, throwaway stuff. Forever 21, Big Lots, Wal-Mart. Home ownership is declining. Car ownership is giving way to leasing. There's an increasing push for more entitlements from the "government" - monthly income checks, subsidies, forgiven student loans, Medicare for all. Quality means very little - folks just want the prestige. A midline Mercedes Benz sedan, once the finest production car in the world, is selling for about the same actual dollars as it did 30 years ago. But that car 30 years ago was a piece of mechanical genius. The Mercedes today is just another throwaway car after 10 years. It has the badge - more prominently than ever - but it's no Mercedes any more.

                  All of these macrotrends have an effect on personal finance and investing.
                  Texas, you're on a roll today.
                  james.c.hendrickson@gmail.com
                  202.468.6043

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by james.hendrickson View Post

                    Texas, you're on a roll today.
                    am I off base?
                    How can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat?

                    Comment


                    • #40

                      What gives us the right to force death on an innocent unborn? Mom gets her life back either way

                      "Us"? "Us" do not force anything. The person who is pregnant is the person who makes the decision. That's exactly as it should be.

                      Nope, and the point still remains.

                      Actually, it doesn't. It's illogical and incorrect to draw conclusions about an entire race of people based on the words of a few hip hop artists.

                      Straight people are murdered every day.

                      Yes, but not because they are straight.

                      So was not allowing blacks to vote and a whole lot of other stuff.

                      Not to the people who formed the NAACP. The term "colored" was acceptable to the people who formed the NAACP.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by TexasHusker View Post

                        I think that social trends definitely settle into the world of personal finances and investing. The values of today's young people say that everything is temporary, nothing is permanent. Half of them are from broken homes. They don't want to commit to anything, because nothing can reasonably be relied upon. The world is about the latest tweets and snaps, and how happy everyone else is trying to make themselves appear. Everyone is a victim.

                        As a result, your brick-and-mortar retail is on life support. The ones that are thriving are offering the cheap, throwaway stuff. Forever 21, Big Lots, Wal-Mart. Home ownership is declining. Car ownership is giving way to leasing. There's an increasing push for more entitlements from the "government" - monthly income checks, subsidies, forgiven student loans, Medicare for all. Quality means very little - folks just want the prestige. A midline Mercedes Benz sedan, once the finest production car in the world, is selling for about the same actual dollars as it did 30 years ago. But that car 30 years ago was a piece of mechanical genius. The Mercedes today is just another throwaway car after 10 years. It has the badge - more prominently than ever - but it's no Mercedes any more.

                        All of these macrotrends have an effect on personal finance and investing.
                        What a ridiculous statement. Brick and mortar retail is struggling because of on-line retail, not because of "today's young people" being from broken homes and unwilling to commit to anything.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Petunia 100 View Post

                          What a ridiculous statement. Brick and mortar retail is struggling because of on-line retail, not because of "today's young people" being from broken homes and unwilling to commit to anything.
                          yes, but what is the psychology of buying online? Is it just a cheaper price? I've visited with a number of retailers here locally and they say that that is not the case. Folks simply want to avoid having to be around other people. They don't want to interact or invest in relationships. It's all about what is convenient for me, and please don't force me out of my comfort zone.

                          How can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat?

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Petunia 100 View Post
                            If I want to be treated fairly, it stands to reason that other people want that too. Thus, no one should be treated unfairly. That seems simple to me.
                            And yet, so many people are not treated fairly until they battle and march and petition and succeed in getting legislation passed to secure the rights they should have already had.
                            Steve

                            * Despite the high cost of living, it remains very popular.
                            * Why should I pay for my daughter's education when she already knows everything?
                            * There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by TexasHusker View Post

                              yes, but what is the psychology of buying online? Is it just a cheaper price?
                              I think it is multiple things. Price is a big one, for sure. I'll happily hop in my car and drive to the store to make a purchase if the price is right, but 98% of the time, I can get a better price online with free shipping to my door. Why would I waste time, gas, and energy going to the store?

                              Convenience is another big factor. As I just said, with a few clicks on my phone from wherever I happen to be, I can order what I want and have it within 24-48 hours. No driving. No hoping they have the item I need in stock. No standing in line.

                              Dealing with people is part of it, too. When I do shop in a store, whenever possible I choose the self-checkout rather than a live cashier. It's faster and easier. And I can't stand stores where a sales person comes up and asks if I need any help. No. Leave me alone and let me shop in peace. If I have a question, I'll come find you.

                              Physical stores are struggling because online offers things that the stores just can't. Low prices. Convenience. Home delivery. The exception is the hybrid shopping of buying online and in-store pickup which we've done a number of times.
                              Steve

                              * Despite the high cost of living, it remains very popular.
                              * Why should I pay for my daughter's education when she already knows everything?
                              * There are no shortcuts to anywhere worth going.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by disneysteve View Post

                                And yet, so many people are not treated fairly until they battle and march and petition and succeed in getting legislation passed to secure the rights they should have already had.
                                Right, so not everyone uses simple reasoning, even when making laws.

                                Comment

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