What is your view on giving, tithing, etc.?

[sweeps]

Originally Posted by ActYourWage

Our church sends missionaries around the world for something more important than money, food, etc., that is lost, hurting, and searching souls.

Where does the line get drawn between a church and a cult? Serious question.

[ActYourWage]

Originally Posted by sweeps

Where does the line get drawn between a church and a cult? Serious question.

I am not saying we don't help the less fortunate, If I cam across that way. We definitely do.

To answer you question, we share the gospel but it is up to the person to decide what they what to do. I think the line gets drawn depending on who or what you serve that defines a church or a cult.

[moneybags]

Originally Posted by nkthen

From my understanding, only less than 10%-20% of the churches misuse the funds.

Wow, 10-20% misuse of the funds is an acceptable amout?

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Um, a close friend of mine is becoming a minister and the church will provide for him. However he is going to work in a very small congregation, but even he doesn't tithe.

He gives 10% to charities because most churches spend way to much on pastor's salaries, cars, etc.

Every wonder why the Pope has a popemobile? Or the Aga Khan a private jet with AK747 initials? It's from all the tithing.

My roommate is a muslim and according to him only a portion of tithe they are preached should go to the church, 2.5% and 10% to charities. Because the church gets A LOT.

I wonder don't those who give to organized religion where all the money goes? Or do you get to see your church's books?

[ActYourWage]

Originally Posted by LivingAlmostLarge

Or do you get to see your church's books?

Yes!

It is much more than giving to a church or a organization. It is to my Lord, Christ Jesus.

[ActYourWage]

Originally Posted by moneybags

Wow, 10-20% misuse of the funds is an acceptable amout?

If I was a betting man, I would venture to say the Government misuses much much more than 10-20% of OUR money.

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by LivingAlmostLarge

I wonder don't those who give to organized religion where all the money goes? Or do you get to see your church's books?

I'm on the board of trustees of our synagogue. I know exactly where the money goes. And we do donate to the synagogue regularly, sometimes earmarking our donations for particular funds and sometimes just going toward the general fund. Somebody has to pay the electric bill and buy copy paper and pay the landscaper and such.

[maat55]

Originally Posted by moneybags

Wow, 10-20% misuse of the funds is an acceptable amout?

Unfortunatly, imperfect humans handle money given to the church, as does any other charital organization. I would argue that less greedy hands handle church money than other groups. I would have more respect for God's money than my own.

As to whether it is better put to use, by a church, is questionable.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Actyourwage, I don't think the lord is seeing it. The church is for rent/mortgage, utilities, but what else?

God certainly isn't there taking it in and getting on his own jet with the pope or aga khan. And he certainly isn't riding around in a popemobile.

I noticed you ignored the fact that many religious leaders lead very extravagent lives. Above and beyond. Must be because their followers give a lot to them.

How else is Rome so palatial?

[ActYourWage]

Originally Posted by LivingAlmostLarge

Actyourwage, I don't think the lord is seeing it. The church is for rent/mortgage, utilities, but what else?

God certainly isn't there taking it in and getting on his own jet with the pope or aga khan. And he certainly isn't riding around in a popemobile.

I noticed you ignored the fact that many religious leaders lead very extravagent lives. Above and beyond. Must be because their followers give a lot to them.

How else is Rome so palatial?

The Lord sees every thing I give. The church is to spread the good news of Jesus, to help others in need, etc.

I haven't ignored anything. My pastor lives in a modest house and lives on a budget, hardly extravagent.

What does Rome have to do with anything?

BTW, when you buy something, someone somewhere is living extravagent lives.

[Aleta]

Unfortunately, there are those that do take advantage but that ifs between them and God. When I give I do so because it is between God and me. I'm only responsible for doing my part. They will have to deal with their own conscience and God if they abuse the funds intrusted to them. Of course, a church needs good accountability and it's better if they have an outsider auditing their books.

Churches have alot of overhead. They have to pay for their place of worship. The airconditioning has to be paid. There is alot of maintenance and they have to follow safety guidelines just like every other business does. They often have playground equiptment for children and activities for teenagers. They pay for buses to pick up kids to take them to church. The ones cleaning the church get paid a salary as does the maintenance person and the ones caring for the outside grounds.

They pretty much have to pay for the same items that all of us pay for. They also help people in need in the church and surrounding areas and also have soup kitchens.

Yes, it's true that some have lived above what most consider extravagant but you only hear about those not the ones who live modestly as the OP says. My brother is a pastor and believe me, he lives very modestly.

[sweeps]

Wow, that never ceases to amaze me.

[PrincessPerky]

We give not only to the church but to several other charities.

We can see the church books, and while I do not always agree with everything they spend on (buying more supplies when they have many just in a jumble from three years of VBS...) I do feel that they try to spend more of it on missionary work, and outreach.

In fact I belong to a church that doesn't fund raise. Not that they never want money (we now worship in a gym, because the sanctuary is too small for us, by a LOT.) But they do not offer you a trinket in return for cash, nor do they ask you to sell said trinkets to friends and neighbors.

There are churches who abuse the money and I do find it a shame, I wish I could stop it, but I can't. I can only control where I send my money to and teach my children.

[JimInOK]

Originally Posted by LivingAlmostLarge

I wonder don't those who give to organized religion where all the money goes? Or do you get to see your church's books?

I can only speak for the Baptist Church, but yes, those in local Baptist churches are given every opportunity to see just what the church's finances are and where the money is going. There is a monthly business meeting, generally replacing one Wednesday night service. Copies of the financial statements, including check registers, are available for everyone who attends and are placed in the foyer for anyone who did not attend the service to later pick up.

Our pastor does not handle the church's finances. That is handled by the deacons after being brought to a vote by the membership. The deacons are elected by the church body and come from the church body. The deacons are regular people, just like those in our local C of C. Even such mundane things as who is going to handle the janitorial duties and how much we will compensate them comes before the church body.

I believe too many people on here are confusing televangelists and radio evangilists (many of whom are actually very reputable) with the way local church finances are handled.

Those who maintain such a high level of cynicism about giving to the church should get more involved in a local church and learn for themselves just how these things are handled before criticizing them. It just bristles me to see somebody liken the leaders of these bodies to the Jim Bakker's of the world. Get to know some of them yourself, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

[maat55]

I think people should give faithfully, but not blindly. Church members are responsible for making sure the elders are not missusing the tithe.

[ActYourWage]

Originally Posted by JimInOK

I can only speak for the Baptist Church, but yes, those in local Baptist churches are given every opportunity to see just what the church's finances are and where the money is going. There is a monthly business meeting, generally replacing one Wednesday night service. Copies of the financial statements, including check registers, are available for everyone who attends and are placed in the foyer for anyone who did not attend the service to later pick up.

Our pastor does not handle the church's finances. That is handled by the deacons after being brought to a vote by the membership. The deacons are elected by the church body and come from the church body. The deacons are regular people, just like those in our local C of C. Even such mundane things as who is going to handle the janitorial duties and how much we will compensate them comes before the church body.

I believe too many people on here are confusing televangelists and radio evangilists (many of whom are actually very reputable) with the way local church finances are handled.

Those who maintain such a high level of cynicism about giving to the church should get more involved in a local church and learn for themselves just how these things are handled before criticizing them. It just bristles me to see somebody liken the leaders of these bodies to the Jim Bakker's of the world. Get to know some of them yourself, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Nice post. I Agree.

[Gruntina]

Some people like to follow the DR plan on getting out of debts and investing while others like to follow Buffet or various well known financial speakers.

I chose to follow God's way! What I mean by that is that I have faith in the bible and there are so many lessons, stories, guidelines and etc relating to finances with savings, investing and debts.

It was a choice that was given to me and one that I gladly accept. I made this life decision by reading the bible with prayers and what my gut feeling is leading me. I do not do it because someone told me that I had to.

I tithe 10%, I put 10% in retirement (this percent is not including my company match) and I put 10% in savings. So far it is working out for me. I have no debts except for the mortgage and a small auto loan. I have nothing to lose and truly feel my life is filled with abundance in many ways.

But common sense and best judgment is asked of us. If you have massive debts, they need to be paid off. If you had a choice between bring tithe to church and feeding your children, you feed your children. It’s not a black and white thing but by doing what is right for each circumstance. There are times I ignore the warning signs and let my temptation get the best of me(I am just human after all). I just have to dust myself off and try again.

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by Gruntina

I tithe 10%, I put 10% in retirement (this percent is not including my company match) and I put 10% in savings. So far it is working out for me.

I think that's a great plan. You are saving 20% of your income, which should have you well set for your future. You are living far below your means. And you are giving back. Sounds good to me.

If you had a choice between bring tithe to church and feeding your children, you feed your children.

This is where I run into issues with tithing. Lots of people don't follow your reasoning. I have had patients tell me they can't afford their medication because after paying their bills and tithing, there is nothing left. Sorry, but if you can't afford something as important as your own medication, you need to reduce your charitable giving.

[cschin4]

I also think giving involves more than money. It might mean baking brownies for the church picnic. It might mean volunteering to help paint the local homeless shelter. It might mean answering the phone during the annual fund drive. Time is just as valuable as money. Charities need both dollars and manpower to function effectively

We should do the former without neglecting the latter.

[maat55]

Originally Posted by disneysteve

I think that's a great plan. You are saving 20% of your income, which should have you well set for your future. You are living far below your means. And you are giving back. Sounds good to me.

This is where I run into issues with tithing. Lots of people don't follow your reasoning. I have had patients tell me they can't afford their medication because after paying their bills and tithing, there is nothing left. Sorry, but if you can't afford something as important as your own medication, you need to reduce your charitable giving.

The problem many people make is when they set their budget. They buy their house and cars and stuff first, then decide to start saving and tithing, when they should have bought their stuff based on 80 or 70 or 90%. As Gruntina has illustrated, she lives on 70% of her income. Some are trying to squeeze 20% out of 10%.

Unfortunatly, many people just do not plan ahead, thus they struggle to meet too many goals, with too little money. All the while, after realizing this later, they are to lazy and selfish to give up their things, for a better plan.