Making Teens Help Pay Off Family Debt?

[jwthornhill]

We agree with most of you that the kids shouldn't be working to pay off the family debt. Especially since the remaining debt from the IRS and UIA. So, beginning this Feb. nothing they earn will be applied to our debt reduction program.

Thanks for all of the advice and constructive criticism.

[Scanner]

As far as tithing, I haven't followed this whole thing but I am sure the Catholic Church gives absolution/suspension of this obligation in extenuating circumstances.

Ask your priest, minister, rabbi.

Having the IRS breathing down your neck would qualify to me as an extenuating circumstance to suspend tithing for awhile.

There is such a concept of being guilty of "scrupulosity"

Scrupulosity - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'll let you reflect upon that.

[flavor]

Charity starts at home but its the parents responsibility to take care of their kids and home.
If parents feel they are not responsible to pay for their kids college education, they should not feel that kids should have the responsibility to help their parents get themselves out of debt. Its your debt, not theirs. You made the wrong decisions. you made the wrong choices. Just my opinion.

[DebbieL]

Again, I have to point out the kids WANTED and VOLUNTEERED to help. It was their idea. This sort of thing was not uncommon at all not too long ago (and probably still is common in some parts of the world). My dad was working 16 hours a day both on and off his parents farm by the time he was 12 (he was born in 1929 - so basically raised in the depression). It was hard times back then, and many kids didn't get the luxury of a childhood that stretched into their 20s like they do nowadays.

My dad is the most AWESOME man I've ever known by the way. I've never met anyone kinder and with a more generous spirit. My parents never needed any financial help, but if they had, I know I would have wanted to help out too.

JW, you have awesome kids. I agree that it isn't their responsibility to help with the debts, but the fact that they wanted to speaks volumes. Sadly, I don't think my own daughter would do that if I needed it
Most kids these days are spoiled IMO.

[NDArmyGrrl]

Originally Posted by flavor

Charity starts at home but its the parents responsibility to take care of their kids and home.
If parents feel they are not responsible to pay for their kids college education, they should not feel that kids should have the responsibility to help their parents get themselves out of debt. Its your debt, not theirs.

Flavor, the OP has come to that agreement also. So for the OP now can everyone rally around and send the OP good vibes as they focus on reducing debt and spending!

So jwthornhill --What new ideas are you coming up with to increase wealth and decrease spending to get out of debt?
Also in your blog you talked about your Wifes Wish list for after your are debt free....Are any of the ideas ones that are low cost but would be enjoyed by the entire family so that maybe right now everyone can enjoy life and then hit the plan with extra gusto? I know sometimes taking a small break from massive bill cutting, increased earnings to live life can revive a savings plan.

[Lori63]

My son works (he's 16) to help pay car insurance and to have money for the 'unnecessary' things he wants, and also for his social life.
I agree if it is a cable/internet/phone bill that they have contributed to they can help pay.

[rennigade]

Why should your young teenage children help pay for YOUR debt. It's not there fault the parents made bad decisions in life and are now in financial trouble. I don't care if the debt came from buying little timmy braces, or taking suzie to dance classes. Parents are supposed to provide for their children!

Its fine for them to have jobs, but the money they make belong to THEM, and they should be able to do whatever they want with it. If the parents aren't responisble, why should the kids be?

[Hot dog]

Rennigade you sound like you have some underlying feelings behind your post. The OP asked for advice because his children came to him and wanted to help. He wasn't forcing them. Do you have children? You sure sounded like a kid having a temper tantrum. It's my money and I can do whatever I want. That is not how it works in real life. If you have a cell phone bill and you want to go to them movies it is not your money to do whatever you want with it. That is what having bills and responsibility will help a kid realize. No one gets to do whatever they want. At least not without suffering the consequences good or bad. It is not a bad idea to make children do the right thing with their $, like save, so that they do not get that mentality.

[Scanner]

I agree. . .this is a hot topic. . .weaving religion, finances, and child rearing all into one thread.

I am mature enough to realize there's going to be a compromise somewhere.

I still stand by my opinion. . .okay. . .let the children help in the name of the family good but I would suspend tithing while that's going on.

Something doesn't seem right to me that a church, synogogue, temple is getting 10% of the family income while Junior and little Suzie are babysitting and doing a newspaper route.

(Disclaimer: I have no idea what the tithed amount is, if it's 10% and I have no idea how his kids are working, I'm just argueing the generalities)

And beleive me, I am not one to say the solution to every financial problem is to get out church tithing.

Is starting a new business a reason to stop tithing? No.
Is wanting to take a vacation a reason to stop tithing? No.
Is a big credit card bill because you bought a flat screen TV a reason to stop tithing? No.

Is the IRS breathing down your neck a good reason? Yes, at least for a temporary suspension, and yes, I think you should receive all spiritual ministrations in the interim.

And I would think your pastor/church policy would agree.

And if they don't, I say find another church - sorry to be blunt.

Listen, you aren't the first person that I have known of to get in some trouble with the IRS. I'm a doctor for crying out loud and the IRS loves to put out hits on physicians.

Heck, I think the very fact you have had some trouble with the IRS makes you a good candidate to be a Congressman.

My record isn't clean on paying the state of NJ some small penalties on payroll so this too, shall pass.

But remember what Jesus says, "Render under to Caesars what is Caesars."

I take that to mean, "Caesar wants his dough. . .forget about the church until Caesar gets his."

Thus endeth my Friday sermon.

[maat55]

renegade

You said that teens should be able to work and spend the money however they want.

I'm OK with the working but they should not be able to spend it on whatever they want. As parents we have the right to guide them in their spending, even with their money. When they are adults paying their own bills, then they can choose to be stupid.

[NDArmyGrrl]

The OP has two things going on,

First him and his wife are trying to reduce their debt

Second they have children that NEED to be shown how to save. (The children should have been learning to save the money they were making to buy things they wanted...Hockey lessons, NEW clothes, New Bikes etc. and for the future, instead of it paying off the debts of the parents.) Luckily the OP desided not to have them pay off any more debt but he has not really posted on how he is teaching his children to save.

The OP likes Dave Ramsey's advice, I hope he looks into getting the Financial Peace Jr items for his three children at home. The OP is often saying that teaching other to invest and save is like the blind leading the blind and I hope that he Purchases the Financial Peace Jr book or something else similiar so he can use the debt he and his wife have as a dont do this do this instead example.

[Seeker]

Originally Posted by jwthornhill

Beginning earlier this month my wife and I decided to step up our debt elimination plan by asking our teenage sons and daughter to contribute by working jobs, etc. My two teen sons (13 & 14) started a neighborhood trash carry-out service, or teen daughter got a part-time job and my wife and I started working extra hours at work in addition to a part-time weekend job that my wife got.

I recently had some relatives over for dinner and they both gave us a real tongue lashing for doing this.

What do you think?

We Need To Be Debt Free

Actually jwthornhill wrote originally that they "asked" their kids.... not that the kids volunteered. He titled the post "Making Teens Help..." all of these words implying that they, the heads of this household, were asking their non-adult children for financial help.

Now please understand that while I agree that adult (or out of school and working) children should be contributing some portion of what they earn toward current family expenses (after all they still live at home, they still eat, Mom probably still washes clothes, prepares dinner, etc)... but this too is "current" family expenses... NOT past parents debt.

I still firmly believe that "children" (non-adults and in school) if they are earning an income, should be allowed to keep, save, or spend the money for their "extras" (assuming parents approve) and definitely not toward past parents debts or mistakes.

Since both parents are working and at least one has an additional PT weekend job, then I have no problem with teenaged children helping around the house and "helping" in that fashion (this is the "old-school"/farm type of help), and this would be sufficient and helpful. And again this is toward current expenses; though no money changes hands.

Teenaged children helping parents get out of financial trouble with money is just plain wrong to me. The children are learning that they cannot "save." They are learning that if they don't spent it, someone else will want it or possibly take it.

At that age, if I were earning money, I'd be hiding it from my parents. To me the "trust" and respect would have been lost at the point of this request and I would be in protect-my-own-interests mode.

I was a teenagers, and yes, I'm not afraid to admit it, I was selfish. Being the only "girl" with two younger brothers, I was not "spoiled" and none of us got any special treatment; though the boys got more of what they requested than I ever did. My folks were not rich.... and we really had no money while growing up. But when I did start earn money in High School, I gave some to Mom; not because she asked or even wanted it from me... but only because I wanted to.

If I were the parents of these children, I would be refusing any money they earned and telling them to save it. Children of today will have a much harder time than we did while making their place in the world. With the rapidly rising costs of the basic necessities of life, and the rising costs of higher education, and everything else... I don't know how the younger people of today, do manage to get ahead of all the debt.

[hellodeli1]

Now, I don't know your personal experience, but I think it's absurd that you asked your kids to help pay down the family debt. I would applaud your kids on helping out and really contributing toward the family good, but there is absolutely no way that I could imagine doing this.

I grew up very poor -- my dad worked two jobs and my mom worked as well. Pretty early on, I got a job so that I wouldn't have to ask my parents for money, which was clearly not available.

To be honest, I think I would developed a pretty strong resentment if my parents ever *asked* me to get a job to pay toward the "family" debt.

[kilapapipa]

If grades are good, the teens could get a job to earn extra money to spend or save. I would support extracurricular activities before a job though. They will have to work the rest of their lives. I think I would have them save a percentage of wages. We have done that with birthday and Christmas money in the past.

Your debt is not their problem. You should have thought about this when you decided to have kids. It is your responsibility to provide them with the basics and you should be able to be happy doing it.

[Ima saver]

Where is JW's blog?? I have not seen it.

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by maat55

I'm OK with the working but they should not be able to spend it on whatever they want. As parents we have the right to guide them in their spending, even with their money. When they are adults paying their own bills, then they can choose to be stupid.

I respectfully disagree with you here. I would much prefer that my daughter make her stupid spending mistakes when she is young and it doesn't have a major effect on her because she isn't supporting herself. That's why we give her an allowance - so that she starts learning to handle money. Even at 12, she has already gone through buyer's remorse, gotten items that weren't so great once she owned them, discovered that she overpaid for things needlessly, etc. Those lessons are best learned now with easily disposable income. Hopefully, as a result, she won't make those same mistakes later when she is out on her own and more dependant on her money to pay living expenses and save for the future.

Other than not allowing her to buy things that we completely disapprove of, she is pretty much free to spend her money however she chooses.

[Ima saver]

I have to agree with you there, Steve!

[jIM_Ohio]

Originally Posted by Ima saver

Where is JW's blog?? I have not seen it.

it was linked in first post of this thread.

[lovcom]

I feel it would be immoral, and really bad to ask one's children to pay that which the parent's should do themselves. It is a shameful thing to do.

[lovcom]

Originally Posted by maat55

renegade

You said that teens should be able to work and spend the money however they want.

I'm OK with the working but they should not be able to spend it on whatever they want. As parents we have the right to guide them in their spending, even with their money. When they are adults paying their own bills, then they can choose to be stupid.

I disagree with your parenting. You make the huge mistake of "protecting" one's kid from making stupid mistakes. This is really bad because the best way for a kid to learn is to make some of the really stupid mistakes. Too often in our society, children are "proteced", and "sheltered" from the cruel realities of life and consequently they don't learn, or become spoiled, or never know the value of hard earned money.

This is not to suggest that a parent should allow their kid to rack up $10,000 in debt or something horrible, but at the same time, we need to let them breath a bit, be the master of their domain a bit otherwise they will not learn to the degree that they should.

I have two teen daughters that both work. Just because I'm their parent does not give me the moral right to control their money, save for spending it in cigarettes, alcohol, or drugs of course, but again, they need to feel the burn of the bouncing checks, the buyers remorse one might feel a month after spending 90% of their monthly income on a stupid iPod or iPhone, things like that...they need to feel that burn...to over protect is to keep them from the very thing that will teach them the best.

Lets not be too controlling ;-)