College savings versus vacation?

[LivingAlmostLarge]

I was thinking about whether college savings is necessary. I fully agree that retirement needs to be taken care of first and foremost. But parents and as former children, can I ask, should you be saving for college instead of taking annual family vacation?

If a family vacation costs an average of $7k, would it better spent if it were only $2k to vacation and $5k to college savings? I know as a kid I'd have appreciated a $5k college fund instead of a $5k vacation.

But parents ring in? Is it more important to vacation as a family? Maybe I put too much emphasis on college and not enough on vacationing. But I think for me I'd rather save for my kid's college than go on vacation. But there are tons of cheap vacations like camping, road tripping, etc.

Or would it be better to blow the vacation fund on vacationing?

[jIM_Ohio]

vacation. The time you spend with kids will be memorable, and those memories help build the relationship stronger. Solve college another time (by having kids borrow to pay for it).

[sweeps]

Saving for college and saving for vacations are both good goals. But if you can't do both, I think the decision between the two is pretty easy.

[Broken Arrow]

I always feel a little guilty when people talk about saving money for their children's college tuitions. My earning is limited and I am playing catch up, or so I tell myself. But in the end, to be perfectly honest, I have no plans to save for my children's college. They will just have to bear student loans as I have. I also hope that it will help teach them financial responsibility as it has taught me.

To be frank, if I was in that situation, I would not have picked vacation either. I think the best memories are the quality time and attention you give them, and that doesn't have to involve much money at all.

No, if I had extra money, I would probably use it to accelerate my financial plans instead. Then, if there are still money to spare (though I can't imagine that), then I'll look into a 529.

But that's just speaking for myself.

[Scanner]

It's funny - all the finance articles deal with subjects such as diversification, asset allocation, equities, bonds. . .but in the end, these are the real life decisions we make everyday that financial advisors and other pundits are disconnected from.

Do we take that trip to Disney with the kids so they remember it?

or

Do we save for X, Y, or Z?

I'm not going to play the usual fence here.

Vacations are nice and needed but IMO, don't do them for the kids.

Kids will remember things like this when they grow up:

1. Pancakes on Sat. morning
2. Going to church on Sun.
3. Letting them "camp" on the floor in your bedroom (when I was little we had 1 window air conditioner so I remember getting sleeping bags and sleeping in mom/dad's bedroom, I'm sure they were thrilled, LOL)

I sort of remember the trip to Disney my family took but it's very vague (I think we stayed at the Royal Plaza).

So. . .if you have the choice, put it in for college.

[DebbieL]

I for one am extremely grateful that my mom took me to Disneyland a couple times when I was a kid. I will NEVER forget those experiences, and I did the same for my kid. I think there are some experiences that really make an imprint on a kid. I didn't have a kid so I would never have any fun trips with her.

As for the education - I had it available to me for free (from my parents) when I was younger - didn't care and wasn't motivated to do it. Now I'm back in school earning my degree on my own dime and loving it. I work full time, so I'm not taking on debt to do it. It means more, and I actually have a clue now what I want to do - something I couldn't say in my 20's.

For my own daughter I will play it by ear. I will not pay for her to piss away my money. If she is motivated to go to college and does well, I will likely reimburse her. I have to see the grades before I’m writing the cheque.

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by LivingAlmostLarge

If a family vacation costs an average of $7k,

What kind of vacations are you taking? We do a week in Disney World every fall. That costs about $2,000. We also do a week or two somewhere else during the summer. That runs another $2,000/week or less depending on what we do. We also do some short trips during the year, like this past weekend to Lancaster, PA. We are fortunate in that we can afford to take several trips each year, but if we couldn't, we'd be perfectly happy with one $2,000 trip.

I'd say if you're spending $7,000 on vacation, you need to take cheaper vacations and use the difference to fund the education accounts. I think both are important. Vacations need not be expensive. Just taking a week off to spend time at home with your kids and take some day trips is a perfectly good vacation and that can be quite inexpensive.

[Like2Plan]

If it was either/or, it would be college. We did put vacation behind college funding for several years. We were fortunate that we were eventually able to do both
(We don't spend 7,000 for a family vacation, either).

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by Like2Plan

If it was either/or, it would be college.

I didn't address this part of the question. I'm not in that situation, so I can only be hypothetical, but I don't think I'd give up vacations. I would make vacation as inexpensive as possible while still being enjoyable, but I wouldn't cut them out. My daughter has learned so much through traveling that can't be learned any other way besides experiencing it. I think that is worth every penny. She's been to something like 17 states, plus Mexico, Canada, Bahamas, Puerto Rico, St. Thomas, Belize, Dominican Republic and probably a couple of places I'm not thinking of. She remembers tons of stuff from places she has visited. It has helped her in school already when they've been studying various things.

There are always ways to pay for college - jobs, loans, scholarships - but you can never replace those family vacations and experiences.

[Joan.of.the.Arch]

I think I will get more out of reading others' thoughts in this thread than I can contribute.

What we did has worked out well, so far. We did not save at all for college, but all along we have spent for our child's education. We knew that come the college years we would be willing to continue the highest yearly level of spending we'd put out for "education" up to that point, possibly more. However, we also remained open to the possibility that we would help fund a new business for our child, rather than pay for college. We figured he would probably choose college, but perhaps he would want to begin a business.

We also pretty much counted on our belief that our child could get scholarships. That was risky, no doubt, but we had reason to think he could.

Our vacations were educational. They were not terribly expensive, but I am so, so glad we took them. Some of them affected our child profoundly, helping to form his personality in ways that makes him goal oriented, self-assured, independent, observant, thrifty, innovative, patient with others, able to endure, satisfied in his heart. These are things that do help when it comes to learning schoolish things. They were also worth learning in themselves and were so well done through those vacations.

As I said, it all worked out fine. Son (now in college) got enough excellent scholarships to take his pick from among several universities. He has chosen a major for which he has to work very hard. I honestly don't see how he could spare study time for more than a few hours a week. Jobs are hard to come by in the rural university town, anyway. Plus he does work a few "service hours" a week connected with one scholarship. So we parents are happy to continue spending on him for room, board, transportation, and general living needs. It is no more than we were spending on him when he lived at home.

For the specific question-- $7K vs $2K with $5K put way for college? Well, if we'd had that much to make choices with, I'd have to say we'd definitely save the $5K per year and take $2K vacations. Our wonderful vacations were had mostly with well under $2K per year, though some years the average was more. I would have to average it though, cause some expensive equipment was used for several years. So for us, I know great vacations could be had on that. Then are we talking about 18 years X 5K? $90,000 for college?

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Yep, but realize if you read MP Dunleavy she writes she needs $7k/year for vacation but can't save for college. Hence the question.

Would your kid want the $7k vacations or maybe a paid for college? Cause yes $5k x 18 = $90k which can be a lot.

[Joan.of.the.Arch]

(I think MP Dunleavy has her head in the sand on a number of personal finance matters.)

[pearlieq]

Originally Posted by Joan.of.the.Arch

(I think MP Dunleavy has her head in the sand on a number of personal finance matters.)

Amen to that! She's a hot mess. She makes very questionable decisions, and uses her column space to try to justify them. I've been very disenchanted with her over the last couple of years.

As for the original question, I think both are important. I don't think any kid will shrivel up and die without an annual vacation, but traveling together could make some very precious and powerful memories. I don't think it would be too much of a tragedy if some discretionary income was saved for vacations instead of college.

[sweeps]

What is the lesson for a child when a parent who can only afford education or an expensive vacation chooses the latter?

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by LivingAlmostLarge

Yep, but realize if you read MP Dunleavy she writes she needs $7k/year for vacation but can't save for college. Hence the question.

Who is MP Dunleavy and can you provide a link to the article?

[Caoineag]

MP Dunleavy is a Women in Red writer (women who have gotten themselves into debt). The whole point of her articles is that they are supposed to reflect her learning how to not waste money so you should expect some less than appropriate financial thoughts during her progress. She was hired to write BECAUSE she is bad with money.

MP Dunleavey Article Index - MSN Money

[MonkeyMama]

$7k on vacation??????????????????? Oh my!

Well, I may not be the one to ask since our parents are on a vacation kick and my kids have done more vacationing in the first 4 years of their lives than my first 20. LOL.

But likewise, my parents never had the money to vacation. We drove to the mid-west every 2 or 3 years when we could afford it to visit family.

We went to Yosemite and Disneyland once when I was rather young. Then I had the opportunity to go to Hawaii when I was 17 or 18. (With school band).

Looking back I think it would have been nice if my parents had made vacation a priority. But it is not the fancy lands I miss. Just taking time out to do something different. Camping an hour away would have been FINE. However, I always felt I appreciated these experiences more because they were so rare and few in between.

However as a broke college student I had opportunities to go to NEw Orleans, Vegas, travel the east coast, etc. (where I learned I could travel on a shoestring budget) & then my parents paid for a trip to Europe. Recently my dad took me to Japan. I think I really appreciated all of these more as an adult. & how I could be bitter at my parents for waiting until they could afford it and making up for lost time? Yay for them. I have too many friends who are caring for their financially inept parents. The ones who did have $7k vacations every year though they couldn't really afford it.

Why not do a $500 vacation every year?

Of course I didn't get vacations or college money. Somehow I survived and turned out okay. My point being my kids are entitled to neither, and I am not terribly worried about it. They will be okay with either/or, or neither.

If not for our generous parents we would (& do) enjoy day trips to Monterey, San Francisco, weekends in our cabin near Tahoe, and annual or semi-annual trips to Southern California. We want to do more camping as well, as the kids get a little older. This is the kind of stuff we can swing on $500-$1k/year. But there is plenty of money leftover to help them for college. I worry with all the vacationing they have done that they will expect more as a whole, through life.

Sometimes it is just good to set the bar low.

Also, one more thing to add. One thing my parents did was always made home a haven. We try to do the same. When you live a vacation lifestyle, you don't feel the need to get away. That is something we do. We invested more in our home because we rather spend more time in our home. In the summers I go lounge at the pool and walk around the lake and pretend like I am on vacation. Dh would be happy to never leave the house with all his toys. I understand the importance of getting out and seeing the world. But we don't really feel the need to get away so much. We try to make our life a vacation. I think that part is kind of lost when I show my childhood. We always had plenty of fun. It never cost much money. I personally think vacation as a whole is over-rated. We live our lives to enjoy a few short weeks out of every year??? That's just not our style.

Oh yeah, one more thing. Dh did travel much as a kid and he doesn't really enjoy traveling much. ??? I think he is just kind of bored with it. Which I think would be a shame if our kids ended up the same. I think he is jealous I didn't travel so much. LOL. Isn't the grass always greener?

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by MonkeyMama

Oh yeah, one more thing. Dh did travel much as a kid and he doesn't really enjoy traveling much. ??? I think he is just kind of bored with it. Which I think would be a shame if our kids ended up the same. I think he is jealous I didn't travel so much. LOL. Isn't the grass always greener?

I did travel a lot as a kid, though it was almost always nearby travel. I flew once as a kid, when we went to Disney World when I was 13. That was a BIG deal. The rest of the time, it was car trips: Lancaster, Catskills, D.C., Baltimore, Jersey Shore, NYC, etc. Rarely more than 3 hours from home.

DW, however, traveled very little. Her father had a retail store and worked 6 days/week. She didn't start traveling until she got together with me, and hasn't stopped since. She's now been to Disney World 18 times, taken 3 cruises and traveled to many other places with me. She loves it and is very glad that we've been able to expose our daughter to all those things.

So I don't know that what your husband feels is the norm. I feel sorry that my wife didn't get to travel when she was young because I had so many great experiences and she had none. So I'd never be jealous of someone who didn't travel.

[pearlieq]

Originally Posted by Caoineag

She was hired to write BECAUSE she is bad with money.

Well, she certainly delivered as advertised!

I'm fine with taking a real, fallable "average joe" perspective, but I would expect progress and responsibility from her over the years. Instead, she continues to make questionable choices and then uses a widely published column to try to justify them.

I think that's dangerous, since there are people that will take it as legitimate financial advice--and if it's OK for her to do it, it must be OK for them.

Seriously, what would you think if she were hired to write a diet column and started every piece with "Well, I ate another Double Whopper combo today, but I got 25% of my daily calcium from the cheese, and 3 grams of fiber from the fries, so really it was a good thing..."

[Caoineag]

Lol, oh I understand your point. I was just making sure no one here thought she was a real money guru. Her house one was more than a little disturbing to me but I do find her columns entertaining. Especially since they make some of my financial blunders look mild in comparison...