College savings versus vacation?

[sweeps]

Originally Posted by Scanner

Fine. . .okay, the forum chooses the vacation - Disney, Lancaster, camping, beach, whatever.

But then don't come whining about how expensive college is 15 years from now and how the gov't should have subsidized taxpayer relief because you wanted to go to Lancaster in 2008.

Agreed!!!

[pearlieq]

Originally Posted by Scanner

But then don't come whining about how expensive college is 15 years from now and how the gov't should have subsidized taxpayor relief because you wanted to go to Lancaster in 2008.

Who said anything about blaming the government or expecting them to subsidize the cost of college?

I do think college is expensive. Too expensive. Overpriced, really. But I don't see that as something I expect the government to fix in a free market economy. There are still inexpensive alternatives and if we have limited means, that's how we'll get junior through college.

I don't know how to be any clearer--my priorities are mixed. I think college is important, but not to the point of grinding self-sacrifice. I don't consider it on par with food, shelter, and health care. I would do anything, up to the point of turning tricks, to provide those for my child.

College is more of a "nice to have". I wouldn't choose an excessively luxurious vacation over college savings, but I also wouldn't forego a budget vacation in order to pad the college fund.

But at no time would I be expecting the government to take responsibilty for that choice. And for what it's worth--I usually swing left politically. I'm not crazy about the assumption that democrat = looking for government handout.

[Scanner]

I can see it now.

President Jeb Bush in 2020 enacts the "Great Disney World Bail-out."

America will be facing the prospect of millions of youth who will not be able to afford $400,000 college educations, working at Burger King and foregoing their Disney vacations at the same time.

So, in a bold swift move, President Jeb Bush, following President Chelsea Clinton, enacts a 90 day Disney World Reform by sending 500 free Disney Points to all Americans so they can have their vacations.

"We beleive this will not only allow for college educations but keeps the economy in my old state strong by employing the people working in Goofy and Donald Costumes. Expect your Disney Reward Dollars by June.

These Disney Reward dollars can be applied anywhere - at the Magic Kingdom, the Contemporay Resort, even for busing.

We hope to also improve monorail infrastructure by 2030."

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by Scanner

Okay, I think you guys keep dodging the issue. I am trying to get a sense of what a priority is here.

Let's say you get to the end of the year and you only have $500 left over. Again real scenario. Maybe it's because you didn't manage your money the best but you fully funded your retirement, you had 1 car repair emergency, and you now have $500 left over and 2 kids.

Now. . .what do you do?

EDIT: and btw, I am not judging people who put vacations over college. Some people don't think college is "all that" so they get to have the vacations and their children enter the workforice/armed forces upon graduation and work themselves towards an education. That is totally fine. It's just not what I see with parents of 18 year olds, who the majority want their kid to go to college but don't have 2 pennies to rub together for it.

That's a tough question and truly impossible for me to answer since I've never been in that situation. I'm not sure what I would do if faced with that decision. I'l like to think that I'd save what little I had, but I can also see how folks living on the edge like that could really use the break and enjoyment that comes from getting away for a few days and having some good family time.

I don't mean to keep repeating the same thing, but even with $500, I think one could do both. We've done plenty of inexpensive trips. It depends where you live, but we live within day trip distance of the Jersey Shore, NYC, D.C., Baltimore, Lancaster, Hershey, Philadelphia and other interesting and fun destinations. We could do a couple of good day trips and spend maybe $100 total and still invest the rest.

So for me, education is a priority, but so is travel and family time. There will always be ways to finance the education but you can't ever replace the family experiences you didn't have. And I firmly feel that travel IS education and is part of the big picture that includes more than just what happens in the classroom. For example, reading a book about the Holocaust is one thing. Visiting the National Holocaust Museum adds a whole other level to the understanding of those events.

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by Scanner

These Disney Reward dollars can be applied anywhere - at the Magic Kingdom, the Contemporay Resort, even for busing.

Don't be ridiculous, Scanner. Everyone knows Disney buses are already free.

[Joan.of.the.Arch]

I think that not only are the answers to this question skewed by this being savingadvice.com, but only a narrow slice of forum participants have answered here. I know oodles of people who do not spend $7 K on vacations, not $2 K, not even a measly $500. I know many people who work on their homes through their "vacation,' who at most do something like go fishing a couple days in a row, who maybe once every two or three years take the kids to a local amusement park and come home to sleep in their own beds at night. Many, people's only travel is to go stay with the children's grandparents, driving all day and night to get there without the expense of a motel night for the family. A popular 1-day vacation for families around here is to go to the state park where there is a fantastic river feature to play on, then drive back home the two hours that it took to get there. A picnic lunch can be taken, and dinner may be had at Burger King on the way home. Those who can afford the weekend may camp in the state park to play again in the river the next day and to visit the 2nd very nearby state park.

Scanner, your Jeb Bush Disney points plan was funny. Made me laugh. My family has no desire ever to visit a Disney park. I'd like to sell Disneysteve my bailout points--- at a very good price, of course.

Really, our family vacations were mostly very cheap, though luxuriously long and relaxing. But in my mind, were were able to afford them at all because we lived otherwise well below our means in nearly every way we knew to do so. Really, I wouldn't say that we jeopardized our child's college possibilities. In fact, somehow I let it slip my mind when I was writing earlier that our child always had the possibility to attend the school where his father teaches. As a work benefit to his father, family can attend tuition free. You were looking into teaching, too, right Scanner?

Anyway, I think a lot of people do what they can to provide for their children in the present while looking forward to helping them through school. And lots of people don't spend much for vacations.

Snowgirl, as soon as I saw you could get a 4-year degree for $13,000, I looked to see where you were from. I think you need to triple that number in US dollars to get the cost of the cheapest public college degree in the US. Probably even quadruple it for a cheap school. For a moderately priced school?--maybe someone else knows the numbers.

[LivingAlmostLarge]

It's expensive. I'm not sure whether to choose Scanner. Honestly I think $500 for college or vacation. I think I might choose college if it were that tough. Solely because it can be free to vacation.

You can camp by taking your food with you and you can sleep in your car with blankets, and some places it's free to camp, others $10 camp fee.

So my vacations would be free camping. But I am glad not to be in that situation.

[Scanner]

You were looking into teaching, too, right Scanner?

Yes, I was and still am.

I may be facing the biggest decision of my career. Right now, I think a university in the Poconos is interested in me (I'm at least a bonafide candidate).

As you note, I'd get tuition (not room and board) for free for 2.5 kids (one's in the oven), our house would effectively be paid off, health benefits, disability and other little perks (403(b)).

So. . .no mortgage (or a very small one for a 4BDR house on a half acre).

However, my wife's career has really taken off. She just got an award for "Manager of the Year" at a local hospital system. We have good health insurance through her and don't think I don't appreciate that, being self-employed.

However, we live in a high tax, high car insurance, high cost of living state.

I'd like to "cash out" of business at some point in the next 2-3 years, pay my capital gains, and invest the money. We aren't talking a lot of money nowadays as medical/dental/chiropractic practices have lost a heck of lot of equity in the last few years.

I'm probably no exception.

I read a blog the other day of a family practice MD who got $16,000 for his business and another family MD who had made $23,000 within 10 months in his private practice.

The climate is getting worse and I'd really like to take my chips off the table.

I don't mind staying in business, if the wife is happy. It turns an average profit and I can set my hours back and be less available to patients. I have concluded it's not worth being overly available and dedicated to them as they hand you a Blue Cross Card and think that covers things.

They aren't dedicated to you (provider lists is where their loyality lies) so there's no use being available 24/7.

After all, the money to be made in healthcare at this point is "managing" doctors and practiticioners, not actually practicing health care. So, I'd like the DW to stay put and manage healthcare from afar.

I was also reading of cardiothoracic surgeons actually having problems.

Wow. . .I'm rambling and free associating. . .sorry.

[DebbieL]

Scanner, I don’t really know how to answer your question because I really don’t have things that tough. Honestly, if money were that tight I would be considering bettering my own education to get a better job for MYSELF – never mind my kids, lol.

My own story is that my parents were very supportive and willing to pay for university. Guess what? I wasn’t ready at 18. I had no goal that I was working towards (ie: no end in sight) and I failed miserably (I was an honor student all through school up to that point with no effort – university shocked the hell out of me). I quit, went into the real world, had a kid and went back to college a second time. The difference was amazing. This time I was ready. I got top marks in everything. Fast forward to the present time (I’m 37), and I recently started back to college again (this time for my accounting degree). I am paying for everything and working full time. I LOVE it. I will not have any student loans, and I’m finally at a point where I know what I want.

I had the opportunity with my parents, and I wasn’t ready and wasted it. I’m not sure whether or not I want to give my daughter the chance to blow my money on her wasting time in college if she isn’t fully committed. I may go the reimbursement route.

PS - I'm from Canada too (like Snowgirl) and I agree with her about the costs. My accounting degree will cost me about 13-14K total, and that will include all the perks through the college like a bus pass for the entire time I'm there, extended medical and dental plan for me and my family, etc. It's a great deal (and the quality of the education is top notch). I think tuition here only covers about 17% of the actual costs for our education. There are some privately owned colleges that are more, but all the public ones are non-profit organizations and supported through taxes, etc.

[Scanner]

I don't think it's necessarily people who are in tight situations.

I think it's very common for people at the end of the year to only have $500-2000 left over as "discretionary."

It's a common, "executive" decisions we all make

Do we:

1. Make a household improvement
2. Deploy it into college
3. Take a vacation
4. Pay down that auto loan/credit card/mortgage

Add your own.

I was just trying to get a feel for where the forum's priorities are.

If the priority isn't with college (and I have never advocated giving kids a full ride. . .my sons will pay room/board/books), then that's fine.

Just don't tax people and I'm sorry, it' the Left that will indeed do this, no offense.

We all know Democrats spend and the Republicans borrow in the name of Reag-o-nomics. I am not saying either is more or less fiscally responsible but Democrats have a reputation for enacting "reforms" we can't afford as people cry out for what they think they are entitled to.

If you are cool with yoru kids sitting on the sidelines while their friends go off to college, that's fine.

As far as college being "overpriced", I'm frankly not sure. There may be some truth in that in that gov't subsidized loans may be "propping up" academia bit.

Make college be "cash and go" with no subsidization, and I bet many close, but many stay open.

[vsjhoc]

Originally Posted by disneysteve

Actually, I won enough in Vegas to cover the hotel bill for 4 nights at Excalibur, so that helped the budget.

Steve - I had no idea that gambling was part of your savings/investment strategy. I'll have to try that some time. Any tips?

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by Scanner

Democrats have a reputation for enacting "reforms" we can't afford

Unless you include tax reforms we can't afford, which tends to be the Republicans' department.

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by vsjhoc

Steve - I had no idea that gambling was part of your savings/investment strategy. I'll have to try that some time. Any tips?

A lot of people who know me are surprised to learn that I'm a gambler. They seem to think it doesn't fit well with my overall financial responsibility.

Tips? Don't go anywhere near a slot machine. Google "blackjack strategy" and find one of many sites that teaches you the proper way to play blackjack. There is a blackjack trainer site that you can use to hone your skills that also teaches as you go along, correcting your mistakes. Commit the strategy card to memory before sitting down at a live table.

Slots generally have about an 8% house edge. That varies a little from casino to casino and machine to machine, but that's the average. Blackjack has about a 0.6% house edge. Again, it varies a little depending on table rules, number of decks, etc., but that's the average. So blackjack is almost an even money game if you know what you are doing. Stick to proper strategy and, most importantly, quit when you are ahead, and you can do quite well at a blackjack table.

Since this thread is supposed to be about college, I'll kind of relate back to the topic by recommending a book called, "Bringing Down The House" which is about the MIT Blackjack Team.

[Balco9]

Originally Posted by Broken Arrow

I always feel a little guilty when people talk about saving money for their children's college tuitions. My earning is limited and I am playing catch up, or so I tell myself. But in the end, to be perfectly honest, I have no plans to save for my children's college. They will just have to bear student loans as I have. I also hope that it will help teach them financial responsibility as it has taught me.

To be frank, if I was in that situation, I would not have picked vacation either. I think the best memories are the quality time and attention you give them, and that doesn't have to involve much money at all.

No, if I had extra money, I would probably use it to accelerate my financial plans instead. Then, if there are still money to spare (though I can't imagine that), then I'll look into a 529.

But that's just speaking for myself.

I heard on CNN that it's always better to save for your own retirement verus your own childs colege fund. Down the road you can always help them out as needed. especially if you don't have the income to save for both of you. Take care of yourself first. There is always an option for them to join the military, where college is absolutely free, just joking...

[Ariadne]

The FH and I are trying to figure out this whole education vs. vacation issue right now.

I think it's a completely individual thing. Neither of us have been on an out-of-province/country vacation in 4 years. I have been working like a dog the entire time, and I just returned to school part-time for a Master's degree. He will be writing his Engineering exams this spring.

So, yes, I would blow $7K on vacations this year, instead of saving for tuition. It sounds irresponsible, but we do have a continuing education/tuition fund. I'm not going to blow the entire $7K in one shot, but it would be nice to go to the Caribbean (it's -9 degrees Celsius right now...the warmest it's been all week!). Plus throw in a couple of camping trips and we're pretty much done with the money.

all the public ones are non-profit organizations and supported through taxes, etc.

I don't know DebbieL... sometimes when I look at all of the charges that I get from U of T, I wonder about the whole 'non-profit' thing. I paid $100 for a course kit/course book and they didn't even bind it!

[DebbieL]

Come to Victoria! We hardly ever get a temperature of 0, and I don't think I've ever seen -9, lol. I'm kidding about coming here of course - the cost of living is OUTRAGIOUS (not so bad if you rent, but to buy a home right now would be insanity). I love my college. I agree that the whole textbook thing is expensive, but I got all my texts for the lowest prices on amazon. I had to buy an accounting project from the school bookstore for $12.95, but it probably only covers their costs. I'm shocked at the level of education I can receive (and the quality of instructors) for so little.