Need advice, Mother in law, wow

[frugalfarmwife]

Ok, let me start this with the comment that I'm one that takes ALL advice, mulls it over and comes up with my own conclusions, and no one is going to hurt my feelings or make me mad, heck I'm already insane, lol!


Let er rip on this one because I'm done pulling my hair our over it and basically just dumbfounded.

The story:

Hubby was raised in a low to middle income family, do today, pay tomorrow. My MIL (God love her, sweet woman) always picked up the slack, worked extra, took the blame, kept the bills covered but NO ONE looked at tomorrow. There are three sons, the oldest my husband, he always fended for himself, worked to buy what he wanted/needed, wasn't trouble but was NOT taught financial responsibility. The second son, needed someone on top of him at all times, private school and sports with LOTS of expenses and travel (but this kept him out of BIG trouble) Then 8 years later the youngest son now 29, spoiled rotten SNOT, could do no wrong, has been bailed out of every financial hot spot from day one (they co-signed on a 22 thousand dollar car when he was 18 and it went downhill from there)

FIL died, not even the money for a funeral, it was bad. A few years later MIL came into a substancial amount of money, also sold her house that was paid off, basically had 600,000 to her name, should have been her turn for the good life, she earned it.

We stayed out of the financial picture, ASSUMING things were going ok (what is it they say about ASSUMING? LOL)

Over the few years she did gift us a few times and we were VERY grateful and thankful, showed our appreciation, the money went into the farm, was NOT squandered. I'd say we were given maybe 10,000 total.

MIL went into business with sister, who got bored and closed the business without telling her, stuck with a 41,000 loss, but this is nothing.

MIL FINALLY asks hubby for help, discloses situation, YIKES!!

Assets Condo valued at 257,000=owes 140,000
Car paid off
furnishings paid off
bonds=68,000

debts, are you sitting?

equity loan=40,000 (this was taken out in 2005 to cover CC's etc)
interest only variable rate loan on business that failed 41,000
CC debt 10,000
furniture loan for 1 son 3,000
youngest sons truck

After REALLY getting on her we've also found out:

Youngest sons truck is in her name
she's paying youngest son and his wifes cell phones
truck insurance
allowing them to use her CC's (they're not paying her back)

second son
cosigner on vehicles
furniture
who knows what else

This is only the information we've gotten her to admit to so far, who knows what else is going to come up

This woman, 63, is working full time and between her income, SS,and a small pension from the teamsters she can't keep up, she's selling bonds monthly to cover the condo payment. All CC payments are late monthly and the 40,000 interest only loan comes due in July.

I'm good at plugging small leaks but she's stonewalling the whole way, not admitting that the other sons need to buck up and pay their own bills, in fact the youngest is not working right now and hides at her house playing on the computer all day, if something drastic doesn't change there he's going to lose his car and truck (IN HER NAME) SOON.

I've never been a close member of the family and if they get mad at me it's ok, and we know we'll never see a penny of inheritance from her, never wanted it and never expected it.

This will NOT drive a wedge between hubby and I, in fact seeing this has opened his eyes drastically and brought about a new appreciation for what we have and my frugalness.

We will NOT loan ANY OF THEM ANY MONEY.

So, what would you do if this was your family? How much would you help?

BTW, I DO love her dearly, but in our last conversation she said "but if I have it to give I want too, my boys deserve it" AHHHHHHH.

And this is NOT consuming our personal lives, we ONLY discuss it outside our house while doing barn chores, not in our house.

kj

[Ima saver]

Wow, that is terrible. I never quite went as far as your MIL. My daughter got married young and within a year she was pregnant. After the baby was born, we co signed on a car. After baby #2, I could not stand the dumpy trailer that they lived in, so I found a tiny house, put the down payment down and took the loan in my name. (less than $30,000) Not soon after that, she wanted a divorce.
So I helped her, paid off the car, made house payments, etc.
She met another guy, knew him 2 weeks married him and got pregnant. Neither had jobs and they ran off to Michigan.
She came back and got divorce. I paid her rent, electric and phone while she is on welfare and food stamps. (I sold the house at a loss)
She moves in boyfriend # 3 and I am supporting all 5 of them. I told them I would quit paying rent , elec. phone in 3 monhs. When I stopped, they left town. she had 2 more kids by him and then left him. So she was calling begging me for rent money. She wrote bad checks, got arrested. I let her sit in jail, but someone bailed her out.
She begged and begged me to help her, so I paid her fines so she would not be put back in jail.
I told her that is it, she has cleaned me out, no more help. She has remarried, but still called and begged for money all the time. I told her no more. I no longer even hear from her, all she is interested in, is my money.


I don't know if this would help, but your MIL has got to let go and let her son's grow up and be on their own or they will turn out like my daughter (who was adopted at birth)

[nanamom]

I would agree, your MIL has to let go and let them grow up. She needs to get her debts on the table an dtake a good look at what she has and doesn't have, then build from there. I hope she is open to advice.

[Ima saver]

If she had just put the $600,000 in the bank, the interest it would generate could help her live without working. why didn't she pay cash for the condo since she had $600,000?
I don't think she can get the vehicle out of her name, once you co sign, you are liable for it. Make the son get a job and start paying his mother back. (easier said than done)

[frugalfarmwife]

Thanks so far guys, and the boys are the big sticking point and her relationship with ALL (including my husband) really bothered me until recently, she'd always comment that she'd take them back home in a heartbeat! (My mom, lol, if I witch about the hubby she'll tell me I'm a grown up and work it out, she ain't taking me back! Then she makes me tell her three nice things about hubby and will NEVER bad mouth him) I've finally realized that her saying she'd take my hubby back should not be a threat to me, if he were a man that WOULD go back to his mom he wouldn't have been man enough for me and I'd have never married him!

As for the youngest son, we're about to have a knock down drag out and it ain't gonna be pretty! He has used HER credit card to set up AOL on HER computer and is the main account holder, so I can see when he's online (which is ALL DAY) So I told her about it and told her I will NOT set up online banking for her as long as he's on her computer. She confronted him and he started hollering about how MY computer is on all day too. OHHHHH, that did it, shot off an email to him that until MY finances become THEIR worries what I do is NONE of his )(&^^% BUSINESS! That THEY are the ones that HELPED her get into this situation, she's paying THEIR bills, not OURS, she's cosigned for THEM, not US! That we're trying to help HER regain financial security for her retirement.

More on youngest, last year she set him up in a landscaping business, got him the jobs and did his books, let him use her CC's for supplies, etc. He brags that he made 62,000 of which 30,000 was under the table (and no, I'm NOT going to turn him in for this, just letting karma take it's course) He ran out of work in Sept, has not worked since then and is now out of money. He has a wife and a baby and a house.

I don't want into their finances, I don't even WANT to know, thats the sons and his wifes life and problem, but they are directly harming the mother.

Agian, so thankful for my mom, and right now telling her daily how proud I am of her, she raised 4 productive members of society, one is even mentally handicapped but financially independant!

This is just so sad and really going to come to a head and be ugly when it does, sigh, poor woman.

kj

[frugalfarmwife]

Originally Posted by Ima saver

If she had just put the $600,000 in the bank, the interest it would generate could help her live without working. why didn't she pay cash for the condo since she had $600,000?
I don't think she can get the vehicle out of her name, once you co sign, you are liable for it. Make the son get a job and start paying his mother back. (easier said than done)

Even worse than being the cosigner on the truck, she's the OWNER!

And I know, it could have been wonderful for her with the right advice, but none was ask for and none was given, MIL and her three siblings each inherited, only one has any of the money left and with the exception of the one who invested NONE of them are speaking anymore, money sure CAN be the root of all evil!

And BTW, thank you all so much for letting me ramble about this, typing it out really does help me immensly, it just boggles my mind.

As for not paying for the condo in full? Who knows, again I'm an outsider in this family, I'm very different and looked at with suspicion at times, they're all sure I came into this marriage wealthy and that I "bought" hubby which is a HUGE LAUGH, hubby and I work our butts off for what we have.

In fact just two months ago at Christmas MIL took my hubby aside and gave him a check for 300 for himself because I'm so mean with money!! ROTFLMAO!!! Hubby and I are a TEAM, in the truck on the way home he gave me the check for our savings!

kj

[Ima saver]

Does the youngest son and his family live with her? Are you afraid if she does on line banking , he (youngest son) might steal money from her? She has got to take control of this situation fast!

[frugalfarmwife]

Originally Posted by Ima saver

Does the youngest son and his family live with her? Are you afraid if she does on line banking , he (youngest son) might steal money from her? She has got to take control of this situation fast!

No they don't live with her, they have their own house, he hides in moms house all day and no I don't trust him to stay out of her online accounts (mom works all day) This sons wife works evenings, so he goes home at 5 and stays with the baby for the evening. In my opinion this is NOT healthy for the sons marriage EITHER, mom lets him run and hide, he needs to grow up, suck it up, be a MAN and be in his marriage.

And steal from her? As far as I'm concerned he already is! He uses her CC's ALL the time without paying her back, they ran up cell phone bills over 200 a month and she paid them, she pays their vehicle insurance.

And things with the SON are probably coming to a head too, he commented to me "I had a choice, pay our health insurance or the car payment, oh well let them take the car" With him not working and the job his wife has she can probably cover the house payment and MAYBE electric, but nothing else, so thats about to explode and this time mom can't bail them out!

Again, MIL is a WONDERFUL woman but would let any of the sons run home to her, each of the wives (3 of us) are very different and in different places in life, we are not in contact, only speaking at holidays, not a dislike thing, just different lives and lifestyles.

kj

[Lemony]

Unfortunately, it's hard to convince a mother like that to cut the cords, kwim? I hope it works out for her.

If you CAN convince her that she is just an enabler and has to let her son grow up, then first things first she has to cancel the Cell phones and she should sell the furniture and truck (then cancel the insurance.) it's in her name so she can do that.

I doubt she'll do it though. sorry about the situation. That must be tough to watch

[Ima saver]

Well yes the son is stealing if he is using her credit cards. She needs to call the company and close all of the credit cards right away. Cancel the cell phones! Why does everyone in the world have to have a cell phone?? When my mother died, my sister took everything and never spoke to me again, so i know how that goes.
I am tickled that you dh gave you the $300 check. That is what my husband would do to.

[frugalfarmwife]

Ok WOW, I'm done, this family puts more FUN in dysfunctional than mine does, lol! BIL is now informing me she ISN'T paying their bills, she ISN'T covering for them, etc, etc. Claims he's known about her cash problems for a year and that he's given back every penny she's given them and 25% more. Sure, uh huh, yep. Oh, and it's our fault that we're not there all the time, shame on us for having a life and living an hour away, shame, shame.

The more I think about this whole thing it was like pulling teeth to get her to admit who she's paying things for, and I SWEAR she's trying to turn hubbies against wives!

Geez, almost wonder if she did some of this on purpose to get her sons to come back home.

BTW, I've SEEN the bills, the CC charges etc. So know who's taking from her

This is going to be sad to sit back and watch, just sad

I think I'll go cook hubby a REAL GOOD dinner tonight, then we'll go for a long walk and be thankful for each other and all we have.

kj

[Lemony]

Ouch! That must be rough. As long this isn't hurting your relationship to your hubby, you can forget the whole issue and let MIL and BIL sort out their own messes. Just stay out of it - BIL will have a wakeup call someday!

Sorry you have to put up with that.

[frugalfarmwife]

Ouch and yes now just sad, just a sad situation. I'm sure I've caused irreversible damage for my place in the family, I'm the mean one ya know.


I think the only thing that will help is a knock down drag out between mom and youngest, maybe some of the lies I've pointed out will make her see but I doubt it, I'm the woman that stole her favorite son.

Hubby and I are fine, will always be fine and enjoy our lives, but to have this turned back around on us? Wow, youngest is insinuating that because we're not there it's our fault for not seeing it, where'd that come from? WOW And we're supposed to be responsible for her?

And this has actually been over the course of three weeks we've been working on trying to help, just posted today for the first time. First time we went up to help mom just wanted to cook for us and visit, didn't want to talk about issues, the thing is we have a farm to run, we can't just drop things and run!

Past mad, just sad

If you inherit get advice!

kj

[Ima saver]

I don't think you can just drop this. MIL needs help and quickly. You know your dh is not going to let his mother starve when she is older and can't work. Who else is going to take care of her besides you?? Something needs to be done now, while she has a few assets left an can still make ends meet without youngest son's bills.

[frugalfarmwife]

Originally Posted by Ima saver

I don't think you can just drop this. MIL needs help and quickly. You know your dh is not going to let his mother starve when she is older and can't work. Who else is going to take care of her besides you?? Something needs to be done now, while she has a few assets left an can still make ends meet without youngest son's bills.

Ok, I know this sounds made up but I SWEAR I love karma! Lexus just called wanting the younger brothers phone number because the payment is behind, we have a very unusual last name and since they no longer had a working number they started down the names in the state. They have the number now.

And I know she needs help but right now I'm so angry at the younger brother that I could spit and have to step back and let hubby decide how much advice to give them, I'll just cause mom to have a breakdown picking on her baby.

She can live with the others if need be, she and I discussed LONG ago we'll never live together, I won't even live with my own mom, we're a very private couple and our home is OURS.

kj

[Ima saver]

I thought that you did live on the farm with your parents, or am I missing something. I could never live with my mother or in laws either, so I don't blame you there.
Good, I hope they do come and take the car away. It is going to ruin you mil credit, but that can't be helped.
I know how you feel, my MIL would never come to our house for dinner. When we moved 600 miles away, they would come see us, but her son had to come to the motor home and eat meals with them, they would not eat in my house. Since her son does all of our cooking and cleaning, I don't know why not. Maybe cause I had a poodle (who do not shed, by the way)

[frugalfarmwife]

Oh dear no, don't live with parents, hubby and I have been together for 15 years, I'd been on my own since 18, I pulled him out of his parents house when I was 28 and he was 23 and we've been on our own all along, bought a farm together, both worked the farm and outside the home.

Three years ago we bought a larger farm and moved, I did have seed money to start out thanks to my grandfather but not that much, we've put a lot of blood and sweat into the current farm and did add 36 more acres a year ago, yes I owe my mother some money on this land but it's a loan with interest and signed papers, the way we do loans in my family
She will be paid off within the year.

kj

[Ima saver]

Sorry, I got you mixed up with someone else on here, who said that they lived in a big house with their parents, but each had there own space.
What will happen if your MIL cannot make the payments on her condo anymore. where will she go, what will she do?
Btw, I met my husband when he was 25 and I was 32. It works!

[flash]

Wow. Stress.

I have been through nothing as intense as that, but I do understand the basics. My mother and brother have that kind of relationship. (I've journaled about it here, and you're right, it helped to vent). My brother does the wildest make money quick schemes, gets into trouble, and my DM bails him out. I grew up DIRT poor, but somehow DB, as the son in the family, was always priviledged. DM took her FILs inheritence, used it to send DB to a private college, paid for his car, paid all his bills. He worked one DAY at a fast food store in college and quit. Too hard. His marriage, 4 kids and failed, SIL HATES DM, as well she should. DM keeps giving and giving and giving.

Both DS and I have talked with her about it, and she always says she knows she needs to let him learn...he's 55, and DF is dying, and she is still sending all her money to DB. DM is living on SSI at 80 and sends that to him, then comes to me to cover her scripts, or refuses to take them.

I have NO advice, except cling to DH and let the waves roll. Be prepared to care for MIL in the future, but not the rest of the family. And vent all you want.

[Ima saver]

Yes, she is right, we are hear to listen. I was glad to get it all out about my daughter cause it has hurt me for the past 17 years!! Just be glad you have you dh, I am. I don't have any blood relatives left, so I have just my hubby and doggies.