Online buying from a private seller

[brassnebony]

Hi everyone,
I have a little issue and would be gratefull if someone could shed some light on it,
I'm looking to buy a musical instrument from a potential private seller online,
he is from a different country so I cant really arrange to view it. I kind of have to take a chance that its in good nick. The arrangement he wants is for me to pay him by bank draught and when it clears he will send the item. I have never dealt like this before and for some reason I dont feel comfortable about it. Has anyone else ever dealt like this before and how did it turn out?
Thanks

[bjl584]

Rule #1
If it doesn't feel right, then it probably isn't.

The unfortunate reality is that there are tons of scams out there. I'd be suspicious of buying anything online from a private seller in a foreign country.

I've bought from online listings before, but always from private sellers that were within driving distance or from reputable businesses.

[disneysteve]

I have bought from private sellers in foreign countries many times, but always through a third party like ebay or Amazon. I've also sold to buyers in foreign countries around the globe, but only through ebay. I would NEVER do a private transaction that way and certainly wouldn't pay the way he is suggesting. If you can use a reputable escrow company, that might be okay but I'd still be wary. Surely you can find what you are looking for through more conventional means.

[emanon1501]

Dont do it unless you do it through escrow service or something like eBay and pay with PayPal. If something goes wrong, you can dispute it and get your money back. How much are you talking about?

[cypher1]

I'd be very cautious also, especially its outside a more recognized service than eBay. I've also had friends getting scammed from forums years ago. As always stick with a credit card via Paypal or Escrow if you do go through with it. International transactions just make it more complicated. Although when I shipped a car to Denmark from eBay a few years ago, it wasn't as hard as i thought it would be.

[MonkeyMama]

IF this is not through Ebay or a legit thrid party, it is most likely a scam. This usually crops up when you try to sell something on a site like Craigslist. I don't know how you found the seller and what their angle is.

Unless this is an extraordinarily unique item you can not find elsewhere, I would personally stick to a local seller so I could see what I am getting. What is the allure of this foreign seller? Why not just find a local seller? IS it "too good to be true" type of a deal?

[97guns]

Originally Posted by cypher1

I'd be very cautious also, especially its outside a more recognized service than eBay. I've also had friends getting scammed from forums years ago. As always stick with a credit card via Paypal or Escrow if you do go through with it. International transactions just make it more complicated. Although when I shipped a car to Denmark from eBay a few years ago, it wasn't as hard as i thought it would be.

this is sound advice, if you can paypal him you would have support from either paypal or your credit card if something goes awry. i have paypal'd overseas in the past so i know it can be done.

[Joan.of.the.Arch]

Is there a music community connected with that instrument that you can get help from? At least to vouch for the seller?

My DH once assisted in an international purchase of a music instrument. He was emailed by a musician in Asia who wanted to buy an instrument here in the US and requested DH's help with a seller. (Sounds like the start of a Nigerian scam, doesn't it? But no!) He contacted my DH, not knowing anyone in the US, but having read my DH's webpage on the instrument. My DH ended up helping with the deal and made a good contact for his own music interest. They now exchange music and my DH is on the winning end, as this particular Asian music has not been published online, nor on paper as far as we can tell.

Anyway, look for others with experience with the seller. Tap into the grapevine.

[rj.phila]

ive done this a fair amount. if you fill in details, i can give you an idea of what questions to ask, red flags, etc.

[thefrugallery]

Run the other way! Ask the seller to list it through Amazon or Ebay so that you can purchase under their protection. You have no recourse if there is something wrong with the item, or if you never receive it at all. I don't know why any legitimate person would want a bank draft instead of an electronic payment.

[photo]

If the person is legitimate, then he will have no problem selling the instrument through eBay (or a similar avenue) which protects both of you.

If the person refuses, then you refuse. Otherwise, you have no protection whatsoever against fraud.

If you don't agree with the above, then I've got the very same instrument! All you've got to do is send me some money...

[brassnebony]

The item is a set of uilleann pipes which are pretty hard to come by! You cant just buy them in a shop you would have to go to a reputable uilleann pipe maker and jion his waiting list which could be from 1 year to 10 years. Decided to steer clear though!!Always go with your gut instinct!

[photo]

Originally Posted by brassnebony

You cant just buy them in a shop you would have to go to a reputable uilleann pipe maker and jion his waiting list which could be from 1 year to 10 years.

So why would this person be willing to sell them to you? If it sounds too good to be true, then it probably is.

[rj.phila]

Originally Posted by brassnebony

The item is a set of uilleann pipes which are pretty hard to come by! You cant just buy them in a shop you would have to go to a reputable uilleann pipe maker and jion his waiting list which could be from 1 year to 10 years. Decided to steer clear though!!Always go with your gut instinct!

again, i hate to say this, but dont confuse "gut instinct" with "ive never done this before". i have bought things several times by directly paypalling somone cash, and waiting for the item to show. LOTS of people do this. i have yet to get screwed. it happens, but there's ways to navigate it, surely.

if the seller is willing to give you their name, address, and phone number, and you get a good proper vibe, i'd do it. if you get a dicey vibe from the INTERACTION, then dont. i just paypalled someone 500 for a coffee machine this weekend. showed up perfectly.

sellers steer clear of ebay cause of the fees, and the runaround they get from lots of buyers(actually goes both ways, haha). most sellers hate ebay, fyi.

[photo]

Originally Posted by rj.phila

LOTS of people do this. i have yet to get screwed. it happens, but there's ways to navigate it, surely.

Would you do this with an item that, in the OP's words, You cant just buy them in a shop you would have to go to a reputable uilleann pipe maker and jion his waiting list which could be from 1 year to 10 years?

That's different than buying a coffee pot. There is some reason the seller has this difficult-to-buy item for sale.

[rj.phila]

Originally Posted by photo

Would you do this with an item that, in the OP's words, You cant just buy them in a shop you would have to go to a reputable uilleann pipe maker and jion his waiting list which could be from 1 year to 10 years?

That's different than buying a coffee pot. There is some reason the seller has this difficult-to-buy item for sale.

those are the ONLY things i do this with. i dont bother with "common" items. i mostly buy rare, vintage synths. very esoteric items. there is an entire community based around selling of instruments, studio gear, etc. once acclimated, one can navigate purchases relatively easy.

have you ever bought something direct for a seller? have you had a bad experience, or do you relegate yourself to established marketplaces? that's fine, but if you are naysaying out of lack of experience, that is different from naysaying out of 1st hand experience getting burned.

[photo]

Originally Posted by rj.phila

have you ever bought something direct for a seller?

Not from a different continent, sight unseen, and with no legal contract.

Again, if something is so rare that there is a long wait list, why would one person suddenly offer to sell the item if the sale is legitimate? That's what you did not address.

[brassnebony]

Sent a final email stating I would only deal through paypal or an escrow service two days ago and low and behold no reply. Definitely a scam. Screw those b*"£$$ds getting my hopes up like that! ah well ill just have to keep searching.

[MonkeyMama]

Um, I am with photo on this one.

I think there are a number of red flags here.

I personally didn't say I would never buy an object private party from an international buyer. That is why I asked if the item was unique. But, the bank draft thing is a very glaring red flag. Foreign country is a red flag.

Any reputable seller would work with buyer to arrange a more appropriate way to pay for the item. Or maybe people just send this guy bank drafts all the time so he doesn't want to deal with other channels. Fair enough, but he wouldn't get my business.

[rj.phila]

Originally Posted by brassnebony

Sent a final email stating I would only deal through paypal or an escrow service two days ago and low and behold no reply. Definitely a scam. Screw those b*"£$$ds getting my hopes up like that! ah well ill just have to keep searching.

yup, that's a good red flag. proper, solid communication is a must. insistence on a bank wire is kinda fishy on its own. taken with other indicators, yes, i'd wait.

photo-like i said, i ONLY deal in esoteric items. the rarity of the item has absolutely nothing to do with a warning sign. in fact, in my field, the uber-high end stuff RARELY changes hands in an established marketplace. it happens within communities of that field.

fyi, just received my brand spanking new rancilio silvia espresso machine yesterday. i paypalled a complete stranger last week 500 bucks. already 5x better transaction than 90% of my ebay purchases. care for detail was unprecedented.