An Abstract of a Political "Discussion" - a Rant

[SnoopyCool]

I'll preface that I respect your opinion on politics, and will tell you that I'm Conservative, as you'll soon deduce. I think people are wired differently and have hold of different parts of the elephant, so that when we describe it, all descriptions will be a little different (ear, tail, whatever).

On Facebook, a friend commented that she couldn't believe that Rush Limbaugh didn't support Obama as president. Now I listen to him quite frequently, and I just don't agree with that statement. So I comment on her status, saying "I listened to him today and didn't hear that. Hmm..." (and yes, I heard what she was saying, and reviewing what I wrote, I see - easily- how it was received).

Let the games begin.

I cannot believe how quickly those that I assumed had a little more structure, finesse resorted to name calling! And it was ugly. As though someone of a different opinion could not have a brain! Now certainly, I don't think my opinion is the be-all, end-all, and I do like a good debate, but namecalling without restraint seems silly and unproductive.

Seeing the chaos, I respectfully wrote back to the original author, stating that what I hear from him over and over would not support that statement, as I see it. I also told her that I meant her no malice, because I really didn't.

Another girl wrote on her wall, saying that I was pathetic and how she didn't know how "this one" ended-up on her friend's list. I wrote to her and reminded her that she invited me to her list, and though we don't agree politically, I don't find her pathetic. Gee, people!

THIS, my friends, is why I think I'll use a little more moderation in accepting friend invitations on FB. Apparently everyone I went to high school with has no tolerance for Conservatives.

Okay, so now that I've vented, I'll go enjoy what's important in life... My Kids!

[sweeps]

I try to avoid making political or religious statements on Facebook. Although I've been very tempted! I think it's better having discussions here on SA because usually we keep the discussion civil and because we're anonymous and don't know each other.

I'm a little confused though. Why would Rush support Obama? Isn't Obama the anti-thesis of everything Rush stands for? (Admittedly I don't listen to Rush, I'd rather gouge my eyes out. Just curious. )

[Cylenchar]

Have you ever heard of Godwin's Law? It essentially states that the longer an online 'discussion' takes place, the closer the probabaility of one party being compared to Nazi's or Hitler reaches one. Unfortunately, I have noticed this tendency from both sides of the spectrum. The attack the messenger versus use facts to support your arguement is pretty frustrating. I may read political blogs but I rarely comment for this reason.

[SnoopyCool]

Cylenchar- I've often skipped on commenting because I just don't want to engage in things like this. I don't know why I decided to comment the other day. I know better.

I've never heard of Godwin's Law, but very interesting.

Sweeps... funny on the eye thing! Rush may not agree with Obama, but he's our president. Who in the wide, wide world of America would want to see him fail? I am confident that most of us do not wish that.

[Caoineag]

Yeah I love political discussions because I like to learn from them, BUT a lot of people can't accept that someone might think differently then them and become personally invested in it. I am constantly evolving what I believe based on the best evidence I can find (would you be surprised to hear I consider myself a pragmatist) but most people lock into their belief system and never consider it again.

[bjl584]

I would fully expect Limbaugh to NOT support Obama. Most of Obama's ideas and plans are liberal. Limbaugh is a conservative. It makes complete sense to me that he doesn't support him. I don't think that it is so much that Limbaugh doesn't support Obama the man. I think it's more that he doesn't support his idealogy.

[cptacek]

Rush doesn't want Obama to fail as in he wants us to be bombed and taken over, but he doesn't want him to be successful in his plans for America. Rush said he wants America to succeed and he is certain that Obama will take America down the exactly wrong path. Basically what sweeps said...

[cptacek]

Originally Posted by Caoineag

Yeah I love political discussions because I like to learn from them, BUT a lot of people can't accept that someone might think differently then them and become personally invested in it. I am constantly evolving what I believe based on the best evidence I can find (would you be surprised to hear I consider myself a pragmatist) but most people lock into their belief system and never consider it again.

I agree, I have had many political discussions (and religious discussions and evolution/I.D./creationism discussions and abortion discussions and police brutality discussions and etc...) with my friends and so long as people are logical about their arguments, they really help you determine what you really support, and you are not just following the crowd. As soon as they get to "well, you aren't going to change my mind" or "we just have to agree to disagree" that is the end of the discussion.

But, name calling isn't a part of these discussions. I think once it dissolves into that, it means you won the argument.

[pearlieq]

Just proves the rule--never ever discuss politics/religion/ideology with anyone online, and be very careful with whom you discuss it face to face. It's just so private and so personal.

I can very much enjoy a respectful face-to-face discussion with smart people who disagree with me. But never, ever online. It's absolutely futile and leaves one covered in the toxic waste of negativity.

[kork13]

This frequently annoys me. I'm so logically-minded that it's sickening sometimes. When people revert to name-calling, accusations, invalid assumptions, and so on, it just infuriates me.

It kills me that so many people out there truly believe that ONE opinion is THE correct answer. Yes, I'm logical, and I have my opinions on many different issues. However, I accept that my opinion can (and often does) differ from someone else's.

This is leading me toward discussing the fact that America's "Politically correct revolution" (Everyone gets a trophy...everyone's a winner...it's the effort that counts) has ruined the basis of America's success... critical and creative thought, real effort, and personal responsibility. ......but I digress.

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by kork13

This is leading me toward discussing the fact that America's "Politically correct revolution" (Everyone gets a trophy...everyone's a winner...it's the effort that counts) has ruined the basis of America's success... critical and creative thought, real effort, and personal responsibility. ......but I digress.

This drives me absolutely nuts. Kids are being raised today with absolutely no motivation or drive to succeed because we no longer value or recognize success or superiority.

Last year, we attended a special program at our daughter's school to recognize kids with 4.0 GPAs. I'd say darn near 1/3 of the student body got that prestigious honor. Sorry, but something is seriously wrong if 1 out of every 3 kids has perfect grades.

[mom-from-missouri]

During the primaries, my mother in law broke her engagement off because she found out he was voting for 1 democrat (just 1, out of the whole bunch) on the local level because he knew they man personally and felt he could do the job.
After dating for over 3 years, but, he has already married another! So, it was her loss.

[maat55]

Originally Posted by sweeps

I try to avoid making political or religious statements on Facebook. Although I've been very tempted! I think it's better having discussions here on SA because usually we keep the discussion civil and because we're anonymous and don't know each other.

I'm a little confused though. Why would Rush support Obama? Isn't Obama the anti-thesis of everything Rush stands for? (Admittedly I don't listen to Rush, I'd rather gouge my eyes out. Just curious. )

Your right, Rush is nothing more than a conservative mouth piece. I myself am also conservative as you know, but I grew tired of the one sidedness he represents.

I guess we will have to wait till the next 9/11 for the country to come together again.

[SnoopyCool]

Originally Posted by pearlieq

Just proves the rule--never ever discuss politics/religion/ideology with anyone online, and be very careful with whom you discuss it face to face. It's just so private and so personal.

I can very much enjoy a respectful face-to-face discussion with smart people who disagree with me. But never, ever online. It's absolutely futile and leaves one covered in the toxic waste of negativity.

Truer words have never been spoken.

[GrimJack]

I actually enjoy political discussions on the 'net - it allows for immediate links to support (or not) a point. When the discussion goes off course, I point out the logic problems (ad hominem, straw man, etc) and try to move the discussion back to issues. I am a liberal and use the link as a basis for my discussions. I do not much accept other people's definitions of what or who I am. Is there a similar link to define conservative? Sometimes, it really does help to define terms.

WRT this opening post - I believe that the reference made was to Limbaugh's statement "“Okay, I’ll send you a response, but I don’t need 400 words, I need four: I hope he fails.” ". Interestingly, he said this "In July 2006, with conservatives in power, Limbaugh offered one of his common screeds against the left. “I’m getting so sick and tired of people rooting for the defeat of the good guys,” he complained. " - here is a link to a story about it but it is a link to a liberal site; I am sure there is a conservative view somewhere.

[sweeps]

Rush and all the ideological asshats -- both on the Right and on the Left -- are what's wrong with this country. Fine, you don't like Obama (or you didn't like Bush), but wanting him (or Bush) to fail? That's treasonous as far as I'm concerned.

[cptacek]

Originally Posted by sweeps

I'm a little confused though. Why would Rush support Obama? Isn't Obama the anti-thesis of everything Rush stands for? (Admittedly I don't listen to Rush, I'd rather gouge my eyes out. Just curious. )

Originally Posted by sweeps

Rush and all the ideological asshats -- both on the Right and on the Left -- are what's wrong with this country. Fine, you don't like Obama (or you didn't like Bush), but wanting him (or Bush) to fail? That's treasonous as far as I'm concerned.

Interesting. What made you change your opinion?

[SnoopyCool]

Wow... this one got to namecalling, too! See what I mean?

[sweeps]

Originally Posted by cptacek

Interesting. What made you change your opinion?

I don't see how those statements were contradictory.

[maat55]

Originally Posted by sweeps

Rush and all the ideological asshats -- both on the Right and on the Left -- are what's wrong with this country. Fine, you don't like Obama (or you didn't like Bush), but wanting him (or Bush) to fail? That's treasonous as far as I'm concerned.

This really depends on the definition of success. I could really careless about Bush or Obama, I want America to succeed. Succeed as a free capitalist nation, that is.

My greatest hope for Obama is to turn this ship away from the bankrupt port we are sailing to.