Thoughts on a Second Stimulus Package?

[Pitman]

As proud as I am that Barack Obama has become the president elect, I'm against his first plan to "help" the economy, I was against the bail-out, but the gov't had to do something. Yester afternoon, Obama had a press conference, and he wants a 2nd stimulus package "sooner rather than later", maybe in the end of the year or in the first two months in 09. Did I miss something, what happened to the first stimulus that was only a few months ago? If the first stimulus didn't have a wide range effect on the economy, how would a 2nd one be any different?


What do you think?

[maat55]

I think the stimulus idea is more mental than substance. The government hopes that people will free up money for Christmas with the idea that Santa Sam will flip the bill later.

I think artificial stimulus is a tool for monkeys. If the stimulus works, guess who the monkey's are.

[tripods68]

I think the 2nd stimulus is geared towards to go more on local cities, counties throughout the US to stimulate government projects/spending to stimulate hiring which will create a higher based of taxation. It won't be the 1st like the first one where every one received refund. I could be wrong but I think thats were the direction will likely to be. Pelosi already admitted this is where they want to go.

[Aleta]

I agree with Maat55 that the first stimulus was more mental. I think that they also wanted to put money into peoples hands to offset the high prices of gas, food, and other items that consumers were dealing with.

I agree that the 2nd stimulus will have to do more in the way of creating jobs that will offset the housing and financial ills.

[Inkstain82]

The first one did have a wide-ranging, positive effect on the economy. Obviously, it's economics and politics so you'll get 100 different opinions if you ask a hundred different people, but my understanding is that it did help smooth things out on their way down, which is important.

[m3racer]

What a great a idea!!! A 2nd stimulus package will most definitely get our economy out of the tank. I especially can't wait when the fine Americans who don't pay any federal income tax get to spend some $$$ on nonessential items like handbags, etc. Excuse me for the sarcasm but as a person who helps budget 90% of the federal government's budget this is a total crock of sh*t. Obama and the rest of our government FTL! Imagine how great America would be if it were run by people who were not corrupt. Imagine how great America would be if we didn't have so many people with a sense of entitlement. Every opportunity is in place for every American to be successful in this country. The real problem is the average American is Fuc*n lazy as hell!

[m3racer]

BTW, I am not a DemoRAT nor a RepuBAFOON. I'm a just a PO US citizen that tries to be fiscally responsible but is expected to help those who are not.

[sweeps]

How about instead of just handing out a pile of money for short-term consumption, we get started on public works projects aimed at energy independence (wind farm construction, solar panel construction, electric grid upgrades, nuclear plants perhaps, etc.). That would give some people real jobs with the ability to learn valuable skills. It would stimulate the economy and it would help us get started on an important long term goal.

[m3racer]

Originally Posted by sweeps

How about instead of just handing out a pile of money for short-term consumption, we get started on public works projects aimed at energy independence (wind farm construction, solar panel construction, electric grid upgrades, nuclear plants perhaps, etc.). That would give some people real jobs with the ability to learn valuable skills. It would stimulate the economy and it would help us get started on an important long term goal.

Great point but that would make too much common sense for the politicians in Washington. Sweeps, I'm putting you on the next presidential ballot in 2012.

[kork13]

Originally Posted by sweeps

How about instead of just handing out a pile of money for short-term consumption, we get started on public works projects aimed at energy independence (wind farm construction, solar panel construction, electric grid upgrades, nuclear plants perhaps, etc.). That would give some people real jobs with the ability to learn valuable skills. It would stimulate the economy and it would help us get started on an important long term goal.

My understanding is that public works projects are the focus/idea of this proposed second stimulus... I can't speak exactly what those projects might be (really, I question if anyone really knows)... But I can say that a handout (like the first one) will not happen again... It caused a momentary bubble in gross consumption, but made no lasting impact beyond putting the government further into debt.

Personally, I don't like the idea of any further gov't interference... i mean, intervention...

[KatieNK]

I don't think this stimulus package is the same as the first, with money being sent to citizens. It is more stimulus for government programs, to get more aid out there for those who need it. That is what I saw on the news at least....

[KatieNK]

Found the following at this link: Obama pushes stimulus plan | NewsOK.com

The No. 1 priority, Obama said, is to get Congress to approve an economic stimulus plan that would extend jobless benefits, send food aid to the poor, dispatch Medicaid funds to states and spend tens of billions of dollars on public works projects. If the plan is not approved this month, in a special session of Congress, Obama said that "it will be the first thing I get done as president of the United States.”

[jIM_Ohio]

I heard or read something to the effect that this stimulus will or might be different.

It might not be given in the same form as last one (a check to taxpayers). This stimulus might take a different form. Not sure what that form could be...

for example funding government projects which create jobs which pay people wages

[disneysteve]

extend jobless benefits

I have a problem with extending unemployment. Over the years, I've known many people who have collected unemployment and the vast majority of them didn't seriously start job-hunting until their benefits were about to run out. In fact, I can think of at least one person who was thrilled each time her job shut down or she got laid off because she then got to collect unemployment for several months and didn't have to work. When the benefits ended, she found herself a new job. That happened several times over the years.

I realize that this doesn't apply to everyone. I'm sure lots of people are out there pounding the pavement (or the internet) searching for a job the moment they find out they are in need of one. That just hasn't been my experience.

[Inkstain82]

Originally Posted by disneysteve

I have a problem with extending unemployment. Over the years, I've known many people who have collected unemployment and the vast majority of them didn't seriously start job-hunting until their benefits were about to run out. In fact, I can think of at least one person who was thrilled each time her job shut down or she got laid off because she then got to collect unemployment for several months and didn't have to work. When the benefits ended, she found herself a new job. That happened several times over the years.

I realize that this doesn't apply to everyone. I'm sure lots of people are out there pounding the pavement (or the internet) searching for a job the moment they find out they are in need of one. That just hasn't been my experience.

Since unemployment benefits are usually earned through a direct tax on the people who eventually collect it, I don't have a problem with that. You don't get unemployment until you've paid for the right to the benefits.

[m3racer]

Originally Posted by jIM_Ohio

I heard or read something to the effect that this stimulus will or might be different.

It might not be given in the same form as last one (a check to taxpayers). This stimulus might take a different form. Not sure what that form could be...

for example funding government projects which create jobs which pay people wages

You are partially correct. However, our lame duck Congress with president Obama are planning to give $$$ back to people who don't pay any federal income tax as part of this "stimulus package." This should piss you off if you are a taxpayer in any bracket. Doesn't it feel "patriotic" to help pay and promote the laziness that transpires our society? Also, for the record...Obama's plan of cutting taxes for 95% of Americans is just plain misleading. How many Americans understand that half of the 95% he's talking about don't pay a single penny in federal income tax. God I fuc*in hate politicians and their lies!!!!!

[m3racer]

Originally Posted by Inkstain82

Since unemployment benefits are usually earned through a direct tax on the people who eventually collect it, I don't have a problem with that. You don't get unemployment until you've paid for the right to the benefits.

That is not true. Also, it does not justify someone leaching off of society. Please re-read Steve's post.

[disneysteve]

Originally Posted by Inkstain82

Since unemployment benefits are usually earned through a direct tax on the people who eventually collect it, I don't have a problem with that. You don't get unemployment until you've paid for the right to the benefits.

You do need to work a certain amount of hours to qualify for unemployment benefits, but you can still collect a lot more than you paid in. Unemployment benefits should be a safety net, not a replacement for a job for 26 weeks, or more. As with most government aid programs, I think there is a tremendous amount of abuse of the system.

[Inkstain82]

Originally Posted by m3racer

That is not true. Also, it does not justify someone leaching off of society. Please re-read Steve's post.

I read it the first time quite thoroughly. Please don't assume that because I disagree that I don't understand what you and he are saying.

If a tax is taken out of your paycheck to pay for unemployment insurance, and you collect on that insurance, how are you leeching on society? Although the insurance is administered by the government, it is an insurance policy. Collecting on it is no different from collecting on medical insurance if you get sick or car insurance if you are in an accident.

[Inkstain82]

Originally Posted by disneysteve

You do need to work a certain amount of hours to qualify for unemployment benefits, but you can still collect a lot more than you paid in. Unemployment benefits should be a safety net, not a replacement for a job for 26 weeks, or more. As with most government aid programs, I think there is a tremendous amount of abuse of the system.

All forms of insurance present the possibility of collecting more than you put in. If they didn't, insurance would be a horrible deal that no one would have incentive to take.

I understand and respect your opinion, but I disagree on how prevalent and relevant abuse is.