The Bad Guy

[jwthornhill]

My mother use to say, "..Those convinced against their will are of the same opinion still." And, its been proven in my life time and time again. Typically I try to avoid conflict of any type. I haven't always been like that but, over the years I've learned that in most cases in which I've attempted to have a civil debate with someone it always left lingering resentment between myself and the other party involved.

A co-worker of mine recently told me that he had come across this blog while doing a "Google search" on my name. While standing in my cubicle he proceeded to tell me his philosophy regarding debt, credit and family (although, I didn't ask..). So, I politely sat there and listened to him, hoping that after 15 minutes he would stop talking once he noticed that I wasn't making any responding comments. Unfortunately for me he couldn't get the hint and continued for almost 25 minutes telling me how. "Everybody is in debt. Debt is the American way. Debt is a tool. I would never deny my family the pleasures of life just to be debt free." On and on he continued, until I finally told him, "look I appreciate your concern but, I've got to get back to work, I've got a deadline to make!"
[Photo]
Then, on our way home after church today my wife said,"JW, I'm getting a little tired of all this sacrificing, can't we just take one month off from this debt reduction plan and just enjoy ourselves a little bit? Just for one month?" Then almost like a choir my kids chimed in with, "Yeah Dad, Come On", "Come on Dad I couldn't even go to the batting cage once this summer" On and on it went until finally, to avoid a big argument I said, "I've got to go to work now. Let me think about it". Now, I somewhat expect to get this from the kids, from time to time. But, I was a little shocked to get it from my wife. I know that we are all just human and have our needs and wants but, delayed gratification means just that. Delayed!

So, when I go home this evening I'll end up being the Bad Guy again. But, I think that I'm doing what is best for our family in the long run. At least, I hope?!

NTBDF

[Ima saver]

While I agree that we all need a break once in a while, I think a month off would not be a good idea. How about taking one day next month to just have some fun for that day?

[disneysteve]

Obviously, your co-worker is trying to rationalize his own poor money management by convincing himself that everyone else is just as bad. I see lots of people doing that very same thing.

I don't know the details of your situation, but is it possible you might be able to ease up a tiny bit. Any plan, whether it be a diet plan or a debt reduction plan, is doomed to fail if it is too rigid. Going off the wagon for a month isn't necessary, but a small splurge now and then can go a long way to keep the troops in line and on track. A casual dinner out, a couple of dollars for the batting cage, a family trip to the mini golf course, a movie, whatever you all would enjoy that you've been denying yourselves.

I'm all for delayed gratification, but at some point there does need to be gratification.

[scfr]

You're kind of between a rock and a hard place, aren't you? I clicked on your link to refresh my memory about your situation, and then I remembered ... You owe the IRS money ... Not a good situation to be in (but I'm sure you don't need me telling you that, sorry).

Forget about your coworker. Your family is another story ... That is tough, since they have not "seen the light" the way you have and I know you want them to be happy. Could you guys brainstorm and come up with a list of activities that would be enjoyable without costing any money? I don't know what your family enjoys so these may not be applicable, but some ideas (including activities from my childhood that I loved):
- Reading a book out loud together (one that you already own, or check one out from the library)
- Playing a board game that you already have
- Watching family videos
- Checking out a movie from the library and popping popcorn
- Playing ball at the park with your son (instead of going to the batting cage)
- Going on a walk
- Talent show night

Another idea would be to set up a system of goals & rewards. (For example, for every $3K you reduce the debt, you all go out to a matinee movie).


And for your wife, perhaps a bit of pampering would help, if that's the sort of thing she likes? What if you put one of her favorite CDs on, filled the bath, and let her take a good long soak while you washed the dishes?

Good luck to you!

[CoryWM]

I don't know how strict your budget is, but i'd personally do one fun thing each month atleast.

I have a guy who also talksa bout how everyone in america is in debt. And how you really cant avoid it. Super nice guy. Just totally different than me financially. He says hes 20k in debt, at age 34 i'd guess. Pays roughly 500-700 a month in credit card bills paying the minimums. While i'm aiming to save that much each month. I feel bad for the guy, he's super nice, and smart, but feels stuck and can't get out.

Anyways. I'd just make sure you get to do atleast 1 thing a month. It doesnt have to be that expensive, but it's like being on a diet, you cant just not anything good for the rest of your life, you'll fail. You gotta treat yourself every once in a while.. To remind yourself why yuo're tryign to get back on track anyways. If your family only sees debt ahead, and living below their means now, they wont see the fact that if you can catch back up on the debt, they'll get to live better lives in the future.

[Scanner]

Did you budget in a "recreation" category?

If not, you need to and then you can work within the confines of that. I know many people view that category as superfluous but it really is a necessary budget item.

[Broken Arrow]

Well, there's a reason why I deliberately separate my real life identity and my online identity... even if the subject matter crosses over.

Oh, and boy do I know the feeling of being the Bad Guy. I still am to many in real life.

I do agree that there should be a recreation sort of budget; one for rewarding yourselves for staying on track on the debt diet. Otherwise, the resentment and the eventual backlash will be much greater. It doesn't have to be a very big concession or anything. Just a small one that everyone will hopefully be happy with until you are in a better financial position.

[Snodog]

Wow!, I just want to say good job so far. You have decreased the debt almost 30k in the last 5 months. Keep at it one day your family will thank you for what your doing.

[PrincessPerky]

If you can't win em...compromise.

Sit down at a family meeting (go to work/school late if need be but make time to talk together)

Start with why you want to be out of debt, make it short, make it real.

Then tell em what you want (the strictest budget to fastest payoff you are willing to use)

Then ask what they want. settle on a budget in the middle...anything on the side of payoff not accruing debt is better than them pestering you and better than going into further into debt.

Next month meet again, discuss what worked what didn't, see how far you have come in debt payoff, ask them why you are doing it (it is called brainwashing, in some ways very useful, if you can get them to parrot your debt free lines they may one day believe them) revise budget. or approve the same old one.

And that coworker...next time tell him you are not every other American...and that this seems to be a point you disagree on...suggest he go with you to a financial class, an appropriate setting for the whole debt discussion, work is not.

[cicy33]

I agree on the co worker thing, ignore him!

but on the family side. I have no idea what your past debtness is, but I feel that you must have some fun. Does not have to be expensive. I like the idea of getting everyone together and discussing something fun but reasonable on cost. and believe me I can totally relate to not having the money to budget in fun. But you must relax and breathe life or else you will become bitter as will the others around you. I am actually going to try the getting everyone together to suggest an activity. bowling, swimming, fishing, these are all reasonable cost effective activities. You could try to set aside a specific dollar amount for fun and that way everyone is happy.

[Gruntina]

I agree with a lot of pp here. Maybe you can just express your thoughts and thinking on finance with your family including to listening their thoughts and feelings. After all, it is a family goal since your decision also influence them. I would say differently if it was only you.

[Fern]

Well, as long as you're not making unilateral decisions here. It should be a decision made jointly with your spouse. Obviously, she is not on board. So maybe you need to sit down and talk things through.

On your co-worker discovering your site, i guess that's one reason not to use your real name here, to preserve your anonymity. Now, knowing he may be reading it, you may not feel as free to say some things as you might otherwise. That happened to me early on when i too willingly shared my blog with an interested party, who happened to be my mother. Big mistake!

I had Jeffrey help me create a new ID and told my mother i was no longer blogging. I just disclose too much personal info here to be comfortable with anyone who actually knows me to learn of it.

[Vapors]

Congrats on lowering your debt as much as you have as fast as you have. Considering your plumbing problem this month, now probably isn't the best time to stray too far from your budget. Looking at it now, you don't have much wiggle room with that big repair bill. I would ask them to wait until next month and then allow for a fun day or two.

Taking a whole month off after you have worked so hard would not be wise. Sometimes being the bad guy is tough. You are doing great.

[Exile]

I don't understand why you wife asked you to relent on your budget while the kids were present. She must have known they would side with her as not many children are fond of austerity programs. She should have realized what an awkward position that placed you in. You and she definitely need to talk about that, get on the same page financially, and present a united front to your kids.

By the way, it's ironic that wifey blindsided you right after "church". I thought that's a place which promotes "family values" and a de-emphasizes materialism. It just goes to show what religion purports to do, but really doesn't, because it can't.

JW, You seem like a straight-ahead, principled guy. Remind your kids why you're not being a spendthrift, and as SCRF illustrated, there are a lot of free to inexpensive activities in which your family can get involved and enjoy. Keep setting the example, and maybe your children will grow up to be as responsible as you are.

[Hot dog]

I agree with exile what was your wife thinking she shouldn't have said that in front of the children unless that was her plan to gang up on you and make you feel like the bad guy. She should've discussed that with you privately. She should be the one to go back to the children and tell them she has looked over the budget and sees that it can't be done or tell them she was wrong for doing that and you two will discuss it in private.

[Gruntina]

Wow! Seems like this is digging deeper and seems to find more underlying issues. Only you know your family as well as you do and I am rooting for things to works out for the better and not worse.

[mekish]

i think a month is too long. instead, why not make time/put extra money aside for something you like every once in a while.. part of happiness is having something to look forward to!