Divorce

[FrugalIII]

My wife just told me she wants a divorce. We have been married 5 years. In that time we have never had joint credit cards or a joint loan. We have never pooled our money other than the bare minimum required for household bills. We have no joint savings or investments. We have each kept our extra money for ourselves. To my knowledge she has no credit/loan debt. But, if she does do you think I'll be required to help pay it off even though it is not jointly owned?

[cschin4]

Possibly, Depends on the laws of your state.

[vsjhoc]

Originally Posted by FrugalIII

My wife just told me she wants a divorce. We have been married 5 years. In that time we have never had joint credit cards or a joint loan. We have never pooled our money other than the bare minimum required for household bills. We have no joint savings or investments. We have each kept our extra money for ourselves. To my knowledge she has no credit/loan debt. But, if she does do you think I'll be required to help pay it off even though it is not jointly owned?

So sorry to hear of your troubles.

You will need to contact a lawyer. I *believe* that Delaware is not a community property state, so you *shouldn't* get stuck with her debts. But as another poster said, it depends on the divorce laws of the state. And the judge's mood that day.

Best of luck, and I hope the road isn't too rocky.

[Ima saver]

I am so sorry!

[LivingAlmostLarge]

Consult a lawyer and cancel all joint checking and CC immediately. Get one solo card and make sure everything that is joint is frozen.

[FrugalIII]

Actually we have no joint credit cards. The joint checking/savings accounts have a total of $15.00 in them. We quit using the joint accounts years ago because she was spending the bill money. She may or may not have credit cards but they are not joint and my name is not connected with them at all. The only debt we have in both names is a car payment. I just want to know if I'll be responsible for paying off her debt that is not in my name. I don't mind paying the car loan because that is debt we agreed on.

[Coleroo]

aww!


One thing to consider - is any household bill / utility / cell phone accounts in joint names? I work in the telecommunications industry - if she runs up a cell phone bill, it can come back to haunt you on your credit record if your name is attatched to it. The same with any utilities, because they do report non payment to the bureaus.

[vsjhoc]

If you haven't already done so, get copies of your 3 credit reports. It will show if there is joint liability on anything that is reported there (although not some debts or utilities, as coleroo pointed out, which may be joint but may not report to credit bureaus).

Whose name is the car loan in? It doesn't matter to the car finance companies what the two of you agree; it matters who signed the note.

To answer your question, I think we're saying no (you're not liable for debts solely in her name), but you need to ask a Delaware divorce lawyer to get a definitive answer. I wouldn't rely on online advice on any legal matter.

[FrugalIII]

The car loan is in both names and I have already agreed to continue making the payments until the note is satisfied. My credit rating is very important and I will not do anything to jeopardize it. The cell phone bill is in my name and she agreed to pay that by giving me a check each month for the bill. Otherwise I'll pay it and cancel the phones. All utilities are in my name only too. I bought the house 9 years ago, 4 years before we were married. She convinced me a year ago to have her name put on the deed to expedite things if I should suddenly die. In good faith I did so. So I may owe her some equity although there isn't much. I know that was a dumb thing to do but I thought we'd be together forever. As I said before, we have kept all our finances separate. We took the monthly expenses divided by our combined income, converted that to a percentage and each paid that amount. We put no other money together the whole time we were married. I'm just worried that she has racked up credit/loan bills that I don't know about. She says no, but I don't trust her now.

[FrugalIII]

Anybody? Suggestions?

[TBH]

FrugalIII, what a rotten situation to be in. It sounds like you're in good shape for the bills, etc. I think you need to follow the major piece of advice given here--get a lawyer.

[neatdesign]

First, I agree that a lot will depend on the laws in your state (community property and all that). But you don't really say if this divorce is amicable or not. If it is -- that is, you are mutually agreeing to end the marriage and simply go your separate ways, with open and honest communication between you and no animosity -- it's possible that you don't actually need a lawyer.

My first husband and I divorced after 4½ years of marriage (we were HS sweethearts, together a total of 12 years). When we decided to split up, the feeling was mutual and we both wanted to work together to get the fairest outcome for both of us. Unlike you, we had a joint bank account, which we split 50/50 down the middle. He got one car and I got the other; since he was earning more than I was, I got the one with the smaller payments. It took us 20 minutes tops to go through the house and decide who was getting what. (We rented, so I admit it would have been more complicated had we owned a home together.) He helped move my stuff out and paid for my storage until I found a permanent place to live. He also kept me on his health insurance until I secured my own.

In short, ours was a very simply divorce, no lawyers involved at all. So, it can be done. But both people must be willing to be completely honest and fair to the other. Unfortunately most people don't have this experience.

~ Jenney

[FrugalIII]

Well, it's sort of amicable. But yesterday I find out accidently that she's cheating on me with a guy she works with. So, that really makes sense of all this. She comes home one day and says she's moving out. We've had our problems but no more than other couples. And, she wants to take me to the cleaners financially. Go figure!

[LuxLiving]

Can you work to save the marriage?

[neatdesign]

Originally Posted by FrugalIII

And, she wants to take me to the cleaners financially.

Well, then I definitely wouldn't say your split is amicable. In fact, just the opposite. That being the case, I echo the others' recommendations to consult an attorney.

~ Jenney

[BCHGRL]

I wouldn't be amicable in that situation!

[Kate Ann]

I'm very sorry to hear about your situation. Divorce is so devastating. Mine is finally final. I'm glad for that.

1). Definitely get an attorney.
2). If she has accounts in just her name and social, there's really no way for the collectors to come after you. (My ex didn't pay towards his cc's for at least a year that I know of, but they never called me since my name and social weren't connected). But, if the judge says you have to help pay it off, then she can wave that decree in your face....not sure how they can enforce it though (well, they can garnish your wages, but if she signed up in her name alone, the creditors would have to be given your info).
3). In the divorce papers, maybe ask your attorney to include language to the effect that all debts outside of the car payment are to each his own. If she signs that, then you're good.

Best of luck to you.

[Scanner]

What are your assets as a couple?

Just $15.00 in a checking account and living month to month with both of you working?

I am not sure what representation would do for you other than if she's making an alimony demand. If she is, then yes, get representation.

You said, "We kept extra money for ourselves but we have no investments."

What does that mean?

You can't hide anything - either of you - all assets and liabilities have to come out on the table, lawyer or no lawyer.

[FrugalIII]

What I mean is we have no "joint" investments, savings etc. No joint debt other than a auto payment. Everything is in either my name or hers alone. Yes, push come to shove it can all be split somehow. We pooled just enough monthly to meet our expenses. Each of us kept the balance of our income for ourselves to save or invest as we choose. She chose not to do either. She has no money whatsoever saved or invested for retirement. Me, on the other hand, saved every penny I could. I have a considerable portfolio of stocks/bonds/IRAs etc. I also have over $25k in a 5% savings acct. for emergency use. Again, she has not bothered to save one red cent, but now wants a portion of what I put away.
Since I first wrote though, a separation/property division agreement has been signed and submitted. She pays all her debt, me mine (I have none). I have to give her a lump sum payment, pay for her car for the next 4 years and she leaves all my investments and pension alone and I keep the house. Relatively good deal I suppose, all things considered. So far anyway. The divorce won't be final for another 4 months or so.

[Scanner]

What I mean is we have no "joint" investments, savings etc. No joint debt other than a auto payment. Everything is in either my name or hers alone.

Unless there was a prenuptial otherwise, it's my understanding it doesn't matter if everything is in your name, everything is in her name, or everything in both name.

As a partnership, you both share assets and liability.

I am not a lawyer - this is why now as I learn more you should consult one.

Yes, push come to shove it can all be split somehow. We pooled just enough monthly to meet our expenses. Each of us kept the balance of our income for ourselves to save or invest as we choose. She chose not to do either. She has no money whatsoever saved or invested for retirement. Me, on the other hand, saved every penny I could. I have a considerable portfolio of stocks/bonds/IRAs etc.

Here's the thing and it's a bitter pill to swallow - but your use of the word "I have" will be changed to "You have" by the courts.

Even if you worked 70 hours/week and she stayed home a kept woman, it's usually the courts opinion that she held her end of the partnership by caring for the house/raising kids/whatever.

She could argue, "I could have been a brain surgeon if I didn't have to stay home raising his children!!!" And she'd have a legal point. It's called "lost opportunity."

You see the other sides point and why usually the State doesn't want to get in the middle of it?

I also have over $25k in a 5% savings acct. for emergency use. Again, she has not bothered to save one red cent, but now wants a portion of what I put away.

And she may be entitled to it.

Since I first wrote though, a separation/property division agreement has been signed and submitted. She pays all her debt, me mine (I have none). I have to give her a lump sum payment, pay for her car for the next 4 years and she leaves all my investments and pension alone and I keep the house. Relatively good deal I suppose, all things considered. So far anyway. The divorce won't be final for another 4 months or so.

Divorces, from what I can see, are never good. If you can't get out of it with little skin off your back, you are doing well.

You sound like you have a good deal and let her squander it after you divorce.